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beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
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For those that want safety from the government
#5338645 - 02/25/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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This is a resolution that would stop the government's wrongful activities. Okay it wouldn't stop all of them, there are just waaaay to many with this current administration. But one of the worst would be hopefully ended, the illegal spying program. Please sign if you want security from your government again.
http://www.tedkennedy.com/page/s/resolution350
I am personally very scared of our government, much more than I am terrorists. They have the power to watch anybody and have all there records, whether medical, financial, or internet and telephone communications. They can imprison anybody without allowing the person to appeal, have a trial, get a lawyer, or even notify the person's famly. They can torture. Why this scares me so much is that I see a system in America, it is the government's outreach for power and the population's outrage and eventual pressure to end that outreach that saves us through each coming generation. However with these new laws to be enacted forever like they want, any renegade, any influential person, any "Martin Luther King" can be shut down before they even create a public outrage. The government know's there a threat to the government sometimes before they even do, just by looking at there political interests and influential power. Their whole lives are an open book. And legally, the government can just lock them up forever and skip the whole assasination process. They can do it all legally. Stop any kind of public outrage. It starts with a leader to create movements, and yes they cannot possibly stop an entire movement but they can certainly get to its roots. And create fear in anybody that wants change in the government to not do anything at all. It certainly has for me.
And to those that still want to believe the government's justification that its for Al-Qaeda only, why don't you realise that if they wanted to spy on Al-Qaeda only they would easily get warrants for that and not have to do it by there current method. And in an emergency they could skip the warranting and spy for 72 hours, then get the warrant, legally, so what reasoning do they have to not get warrants at all? Who are they spying on? If this was for Al-Qaeda, how do they even search for new members without spying everybody else first? Can we really trust the government so much to give them these powers and just hope they are not using it to there obvious political advantage? Don't you think with a man like Bush in office we should be a little scared of such extraordinary powers?
My reasoning is that I have bigger things to be afraid of then terrorism, they have only killed 3000 people and that was many years ago, I don't like the abuse of fear tactics the government has been using with 9/11, we have things that cause many more deaths in this country every year yet there is still a portion of Americans who are not outraged by this power grab that could eventually lead to a very bad situation for Americans and a very good situation for it's government, solely because of 9/11 and how the government continues to slam those four sylables into our brain over and over again.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
Edited by beatnicknick (02/25/06 05:59 PM)
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snoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/20/05
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5338678 - 02/25/06 06:06 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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do we get protection from Ted Kennedy?
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: snoopaloop53]
#5338704 - 02/25/06 06:14 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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This isn't in any support for Ted Kennedy, I don't know anything about the guy or his political standings other than that he doesn't want the spying.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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wilshire
free radical


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: snoopaloop53]
#5338757 - 02/25/06 06:34 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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as long as you're talking on your cellphone to a foreign terrorist, yeah.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: wilshire]
#5338827 - 02/25/06 06:54 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
wilshire said: as long as you're talking on your cellphone to a foreign terrorist, yeah.
What is this in response to?
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5338957 - 02/25/06 07:40 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
beatnicknick said:
Quote:
wilshire said: as long as you're talking on your cellphone to a foreign terrorist, yeah.
What is this in response to?
Presumably the post he replied to.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: Silversoul]
#5339027 - 02/25/06 08:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes but if you read the post he replied to it does not ask a question that he is answering.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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Silversoul
Rhizome


Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5339063 - 02/25/06 08:10 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
beatnicknick said: Yes but if you read the post he replied to it does not ask a question that he is answering.
Yes it does.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: wilshire]
#5339759 - 02/25/06 11:17 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
wilshire said: as long as you're talking on your cellphone to a foreign terrorist, yeah.
So you choose to believe the government will not use this in any other way when in fact most politicians, based on Bush's record, are convinced that this is about more than Al-Qaeda and are trying to stop this. Dude with half the U.S. population like you I'd say we're f**ked. If people don't question authority than why does the authority have a reason to limit its abuse?
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5339778 - 02/25/06 11:23 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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We need term limits to get the fat drunk murderer out of the senate.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: DieCommie]
#5339786 - 02/25/06 11:28 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
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Okay listen we are not discussing the Senator we are discussing the Senate Resolution 350, stop changing the subject please.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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wilshire
free radical


Registered: 05/11/05
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5341502 - 02/26/06 03:32 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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What is this in response to?
could you explain to me your understanding of this surveillance scandal? who was being listened to and by whom, etc?
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole

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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5341530 - 02/26/06 03:38 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
beatnicknick said: Okay listen we are not discussing the Senator we are discussing the Senate Resolution 350, stop changing the subject please.
Then why didn't you post res 350? Instead of the "Submariner's" bloviation about it.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: zappaisgod]
#5344298 - 02/27/06 06:11 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Am I missing something here? Did I post the wrong link to the resolution?
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: wilshire]
#5344328 - 02/27/06 06:59 AM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
wilshire said: What is this in response to?
could you explain to me your understanding of this surveillance scandal? who was being listened to and by whom, etc?
People in our government, the NSA and its overseers, all have access to and can collect data from American citizen's e-mails, cell phone conversations, medical records, credit card transactions, internet history, etc. etc. without having to any court approval.
This is a violation of human rights, and that's why FISA was set up so many years ago. It was to prevent this very thing from happening. The government could have done it completely differently, they could have gathered information legally as long as they got a court approval some 72 hours later.
As for who they are spying on, they will not release that information and obviously if they were spying on terrorists they would have taken the legal route and told the court who they were looking for, what they'd be be doing, what kind of mass data collection would go on.
The public has looked the other way on this issue, although most don't approve, they are just going to let it slide to possibly save themselves from what would seem like millions of terrorist bombings all over this country 
C'mon folks can we really give them this much power because of 3000 people that died five years ago? I'd say get rid of this we've got plenty of better ways to get terrorists, we knew about 9/11 before it happened but chose to ignore it, and now that this information has been released, Al-Qaeda ain't gonna be using AIM to discuss who to kill next, man they watch the news too!
I think that unless stopped soon, the issue will be ignored and the leaders and future leaders can use this power to have a control over america like a vice grip on someone's balls. The government knows the advantages they have with this program, it could very well be the beggining of the end of democracy in our country, and the birth of a false one. Get creative. Think of what a president with an agenda that is profit over people could do to possibly keep his friends and family in office so long that it could be considered a monarchy with this program. He knows his politcal enemies before they even start to get in the game.
Everyone's lives are a complete open book.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
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Catalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5346458 - 02/27/06 06:15 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
People in our government, the NSA and its overseers, all have access to and can collect data from American citizen's e-mails, cell phone conversations, medical records, credit card transactions, internet history, etc. etc. without having to any court approval.
...but they cannot be used in a court of law so the info is useless. The bum digging through my dumpster has access to half of this stuff anyways.
Also, hasn't the FISA court concluded that the president still can authorize wiretaps and they cannot remove that constitutional power in FISA Sealed Case, 310 F.3d 717, 742 (FIS Ct. Rev. 2002)? That is why you won't hear too much more about this "scandal".
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wilshire
free radical


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Re: For those that want safety from the government [Re: beatnicknick]
#5346850 - 02/27/06 07:42 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
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As for who they are spying on, they will not release that information and obviously if they were spying on terrorists they would have taken the legal route and told the court who they were looking for...
i think it would be good for you to read this:
http://www.fas.org/irp/news/2006/01/hayden012306.pdf
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