|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Situation in Iraq growing more dire.
#5332517 - 02/23/06 06:11 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,185782,00.html
BAGHDAD, Iraq ? More than 100 people died on Thursday in widespread violence across Iraq, including a roadside bombing that killed four U.S. soldiers, as the number of Sunni mosques attacked rose to 168 following the bombing of a holy Shiite shrine and discussions on forming a unity government were suspended amid the strife.
Gunmen in Baqouba stopped three buses carrying factory workers, forced them out of the vehicles northeast of Baghdad and killed 47 of them, a provincial council member said.
The buses had been stopped at a checkpoint in the Nahrawan area, about 12 miles south of Baqouba, said Dhari Thuban, a member of the Diyala Provincial Council, before being burned and their passengers killed.
The motive for the killing was not immediately clear.
At least 47 other bodies were found scattered across Iraq, many of them shot execution-style and dumped in Shiite-dominated parts of Baghdad.
Three journalists working for Al-Arabiya television were found dead in Samarra, the site of Wednesday's Askariya mosque attack. Al-Arabiya is viewed in Iraq as favoring the United States.
In addition, four soldiers from the 101st Airborne Division were killed when their vehicle was hit by a roadside bomb north of Baghdad, the U.S. military said Thursday.
(Story continues below)
ADVERTISEMENTSAdvertise Here
The soldiers assigned to the division's 1st Brigade Combat Team were killed on patrol Wednesday near Hawijah, 150 miles north of Baghdad, the military said in a statement.
The names of the victims were withheld pending notification of their families.
The hardline Sunni Clerical Association of Muslim Scholars said 168 Sunni mosques had been attacked, 10 imams killed and 15 abducted since the shrine attack. The Interior Ministry said it could only confirm figures for Baghdad, where 90 mosques were attacked in Baghdad, one cleric was killed, and one abducted.
Officials said at least 110 people had been killed across the country in violence believed triggered by the mosque attack.
The sectarian violence threatens to derail U.S. plans to form a new national unity government representing all factions, including Sunni Arabs, who form the backbone of the insurgency.
President Jalal Talabani, a Kurd, summoned political leaders to a meeting Thursday. But the biggest Sunni faction in the new parliament, the Iraqi Accordance Front, refused to attend, citing the attacks on Sunni mosques.
"We want a clear condemnation from the government which didn't do enough yesterday to curb those angry mobs," said Dr. Salman al-Jumaili, a member of the Front. "There was even a kind of cooperation with the government security forces in some places in attacking the Sunni mosques."
As the country veered ominously toward sectarian war, the government extended a curfew in Baghdad and Salaheddin province for two days. All leaves for Iraqi soldiers and police were canceled and personnel ordered to report to their units.
Sixteen people, eight of them civilians, died in a bombing Thursday in the center of Baqouba, 35 miles northeast of Baghdad.
The bombing, which targeted soldiers, was not seen as part of the sectarian fighting.
Radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr accused the Iraqi government and U.S. forces of failing to protect the Samarra shrine, also known as the Golden Mosque, and ordered his militia to defend Shiite holy sites across Iraq.
"If the government had real sovereignty, then nothing like this would have happened," al-Sadr said a statement. "Brothers in the Mahdi Army must protect all Shiite shrines and mosques, especially in Samara."
The destruction of the gleaming dome of the 1,200-year-old Askariya shrine in Samarra sent crowds of angry Shiites into the streets. The crowds included members of al-Sadr's Mahdi Army and other Shiite militias that the United States wants abolished.
Sunni Clerical Association of Muslim Scholars spokesman Abdul-Salam al-Kubaisi blamed the violence on the country's top Shiite cleric, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, and other Shiite religious leaders who called for demonstrations against the shrine attack.
"They are all fully aware that the Iraqi borders are open, and the streets are penetrated with those who want to create strife among Iraqis," al-Kubaisi said at a news briefing.
British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said Thursday that he suspects Al Qaeda in Iraq, led by Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, was responsible for the devastating explosion at the Golden Mosque.
"There is not yet information about what caused this terrorist outrage, but al-Zarqawi and Al Qaeda have been linked as it has the hallmarks of their nihilism," Straw told a news conference in London. He called on leaders of Iraq's religious communities to defuse tensions caused by the attack.
Prime Minister Tony Blair said the attack was "an act of desperation as well as desecration."
Al-Kubaisi said U.S. Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad enflamed the situation when he warned Monday that the United States would not continue to support institutions run by sectarian groups with links to armed militias.
"Without doubt, these statements mobilized all the Shiites," al-Kubaisi said. "It made them ready to go down to the street at any moment."
In Diyala, a religiously mixed province northeast of Baghdad, 47 bodies were found in a ditch. Officials said the victims appeared to have been stopped by gunmen, forced out of their cars and shot near Nahrawan, about 12 miles south of Baqouba. Most were aged between 20 and 50 and appeared to include both Sunnis and Shiites, police said.
Fighting broke out Thursday afternoon in Mahmoudiya, south of Baghdad, between militiamen from al-Sadr's Mahdi Army militia and Sunni gunmen. Two civilians were killed and five militiamen were injured, police Capt. Rashid al-Samaraie said.
Thousands of demonstrators carrying Shiite flags and banners marched Thursday through parts of Baghdad, Karbala, Kut, Tal Afar and the Shiite holy city of Najaf in protest against the shrine attack.
U.S. military units in the Baghdad area were told Thursday morning to halt all but essential travel. Commanders feared that convoys might be caught up in demonstrations or road blocks.
Also Thursday, gunmen fired automatic weapons and grenades at a Sunni mosque in Baqouba, killing one mosque employee and injuring two others, police said. Assailants also set fire to a Sunni mosque in eastern Baghdad, police said.
Eight Iraqi soldiers and eight civilians were killed when a soup vendor's cart packed with explosives detonated as a patrol passed in the center of Baqouba, police Maj. Falah al-Mohammedawi said. At least 20 people were injured in the blast.
The bullet-riddled bodies of a prominent Al-Arabyia TV female correspondent and two other Iraqi journalists, who had been covering Wednesday's explosion in Samarra, were found on the outskirts of the mostly Sunni Arab city 60 miles north of Baghdad.
|
ACN45
Stranger
Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 160
Last seen: 17 years, 9 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5332701 - 02/23/06 07:11 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
thats some shitty news. looks like the worst possible outcome is about to happen.
|
JonnyOnTheSpot
Sober Surfer


Registered: 01/27/02
Posts: 11,527
Loc: North Carolina
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: ACN45]
#5332715 - 02/23/06 07:14 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
i wonder if iraq is just going to turn out to be yet another failed attempt by the US to install a puppet government in a land they have no right to be in. we shall see i guess.
|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5332844 - 02/23/06 07:52 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
This shall only escalate the Steeds of war in the middle east. Wait till Lebanon and Syria start killing eachother.
|
Adden

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 39,201
Loc:
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5332852 - 02/23/06 07:55 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Honestly though..
Did anyone think a war would be so easy, especially one built on false pretenses with hidden agendas?
|
DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Adden]
#5333013 - 02/23/06 08:42 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
no, noone thought it would be easy
|
Alex213
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 1,839
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: DieCommie]
#5333771 - 02/24/06 12:14 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
I think the neocons advising Bush thought it would be. They expected the population to greet their soldiers with flowers instead of bullets.
|
beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Alex213]
#5333931 - 02/24/06 02:09 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
If it gets really bad and the soldiers start droppin like flies I predict Bush's actions will be
1) Pull out and accept a big mistake (I know it wasn't a mistake for him he's got all kinds of things out of the war, like a secure second term, no big contracts for haliburton, and one day a puppet government) 2) Attack on one of the two religious groups until they are wiped out
If we continue to police Iraq, maybe we'll need so many more troops that this will start up a draft. I doubt it. But if so, the enlightened half of this country will uprise. Mark my words.
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
Edited by beatnicknick (02/24/06 02:12 AM)
|
badchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,372
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: beatnicknick]
#5334178 - 02/24/06 06:35 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
"We must stay the course".
-------------------- ...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge. It is an indellible experience; it is forever known. I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did. Smith, P. Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27. ...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely. Osmond, H. Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436
|
SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,459
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 5 hours, 15 minutes
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: badchad]
#5334445 - 02/24/06 09:54 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
BLAH BLAH BLAH
We are there, we will stay there.
Through all the blood...Iraq will be better.
Some people need the "3 minute microwave fix" on every issue. When they dont realize that war and occupation is a slow process.
And of course....nothing positive has come from Iraq....just horror stories....
Mark my words there will be an American military base perpetually there!
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
|
Alex213
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 1,839
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5334498 - 02/24/06 10:26 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Through all the blood...Iraq will be better.
Apart from George Bush saying so do you have any evidence for this?
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!


Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 34,086
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 52 minutes, 47 seconds
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5334511 - 02/24/06 10:30 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: BLAH BLAH BLAH
We are there, we will stay there.
Through all the blood...Iraq will be better.
Who cares if Iraq will be better? Just imagine all of the good we could have done with this $250 billion (and counting) abroad and at home.
What a fucking waste. Biggest blunder ever.
-------------------- -------------------------------- Mp3 of the month: The Apple-Glass Cyndrome - Someday
|
SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,459
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 5 hours, 15 minutes
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Learyfan]
#5334887 - 02/24/06 01:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Alex213 stated: Apart from George Bush saying so do you have any evidence for this?
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/scp/2005/41467.htm
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/D4BDF832-2871-4F11-A76F-2D8A262DA003.htm
http://www.state.gov/g/wi/rls/42512.htm
Those are three off the top of my head.
Learyfan Stated: Just imagine all of the good we could have done with this $250 billion (and counting) abroad and at home.
What a fucking waste. Biggest blunder ever.
Just imagine being an Iraqi, if Saddam would be in power right know. Fast forward twenty years from now, you will see something much better. All of which steams from US involvement.
Look at Japan
Look at Germany
Are those countries better off today or back when one had Hitler and the other an imperialistic militant government?
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
|
Alex213
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 1,839
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5335134 - 02/24/06 02:51 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/scp/2005/41467.htm
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/D4BDF832-2871-4F11-A76F-2D8A262DA003.htm
http://www.state.gov/g/wi/rls/42512.htm
Those are three off the top of my head.
None of which are very convincing. And the second one is from 2 years ago.
In what way is Germany or Japan comparable to Iraq? Germany had a long democratic history and wasn't torn apart by different religious factions. The other big difference is Japan and Germany started the war.
|
zappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Alex213]
#5335171 - 02/24/06 03:01 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
So did Iraq. Germany had a long tradition of militaristic adventurism, as did most of Europe. Tell me again about the long standing democratic conventions in Japan.
--------------------
|
lonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.


Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Learyfan]
#5335230 - 02/24/06 03:18 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Learyfan said: "Biggest blunder ever."
i am predicting that Bush will go down as a great president with huge balls.
Mark my Words, one day learyfan you will be a bitter old man watching a documentary "The Great President George Bush" on the History Channel.
-------------------- America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure" We have "reckless fiscal policies" America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better Barack Obama
|
snoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.

Registered: 01/20/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: lonestar2004]
#5335662 - 02/24/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
So we should have left Saddam in power, not take an active role in our interests for the future (oil), and pursue some kind of isolationist stand so that no one would think bad about us getting involved in other country's affairs?
|
RandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: snoopaloop53]
#5335676 - 02/24/06 06:01 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
snoopaloop53 said: So we should have left Saddam in power, not take an active role in our interests for the future (oil), and pursue some kind of isolationist stand so that no one would think bad about us getting involved in other country's affairs?
Pretty much.
You can be damn sure that somebody somewhere in the Middle East will find a way to sell us oil (whether the U.S. is very pro-active in the region or not). That's the only commodity that they have. Also, we could have taken the 250 billion that we have frittered away over there and used it toward some type of energy plan to get us free of the Middle East for good.
|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: lonestar2004]
#5335786 - 02/24/06 07:03 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
lonestar2004 said: Learyfan said: "Biggest blunder ever."
i am predicting that Bush will go down as a great president with huge balls.
Mark my Words, one day learyfan you will be a bitter old man watching a documentary "The Great President George Bush" on the History Channel.
This kind of thinking is dangerous to the nation, Cult of personality right there.
Its even more dangerous underestimating the recent causes of action in Iraq. A situation like this in Iraq can turn into anything. Imagine if it completely turned on the US. Especially since the US has recently dissaproved of the massive amounts of Armed militias like the SCIRI's Badr brigade, Kurdish Pershmerga, and Sadrs Mahdi Army.
Edited by The_Red_Crayon (02/24/06 07:13 PM)
|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5335805 - 02/24/06 07:11 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
They just slapped a daytime curfew in Iraq. This hasnt been done in a war since Bosnia in 91-95 in Ahmici.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,185903,00.html
BAGHDAD, Iraq ? The Iraqi government on Friday ordered a daytime curfew in Baghdad and nearby provinces extended through Saturday after the clampdown appeared to have blunted the surge in sectarian violence.
The 8 a.m. to 4 p.m. curfew will remain in effect in Baghdad and the provinces of Diyala, Salaheddin and Babil ? the same areas where the daytime movement ban was in force Friday to curb violence.
Iraqi state TV quoted a statement by Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari as saying the decision was taken because of "extraordinary circumstances that our beloved country is passing through."
There had been fears that mosque sermons during Friday prayers would be the occasion for further violence, though a Shiite official said gunmen did fire two rockets at a tomb sacred to Shiites south of Baghdad, causing damage but no casualties.
Earlier, Iraq's most influential Shiite political leader called for Sunni-Shiite unity and condemned all killings of Iraqis in a bid to pull the nation back from the brink of civil war after the bombing of a Shiite shrine and a wave of deadly reprisal attacks.
Violence unleashed by the destruction on Wednesday of the golden dome of the Shiite Askariya shrine in Samarra, a predominantly Sunni city, has left almost 130 people dead. The government further stepped up security on Friday, imposing a ban on entering or leaving Baghdad and deploying of armed forces in tense areas.
(Story continues below)
ADVERTISEMENTSAdvertise Here
Religious leaders, trying to calm tensions, met for talks and summoned Shiites and Sunnis to joint prayer services. Still, Iraqis feared the violence had pushed the country closer to civil war than at any time since the U.S.-led invasion nearly three years ago.
U.S. Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad acknowledged the danger facing Iraq ? and the U.S. strategy for disengaging from this country.
"Everything that needs to be done must be done to avoid a civil war, and I think they are keenly aware of the danger," he said of Iraq's leaders.
Shiite and Sunni clerics met Friday and agreed to work to discourage killings between the two sects. The meeting between followers of radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr and members of the influential Sunni Association of Muslim Scholars was held in northern Baghdad's predominantly Shiite neighborhood of Kazimiyah, said Sheik Abdul-Hadi al-Darraji, one of the participants from al-Sadr's group.
In a statement read over national television, top Shiite leader Abdul-Aziz al-Hakim, head of the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq, condemned the killings of all Iraqis as well as reprisal attacks on Sunni or Shiite mosques. He said those who carried out the mosque bombing in Samarra "do not represent the Sunnis in Iraq."
Dhafer al-Ani, spokesman for the biggest Sunni Arab bloc in parliament, praised al-Hakim's statement, calling it "a step on the road of healing the wounds."
But he said his Iraqi Accordance Front was still waiting for an apology from the government for failing to protect Sunni mosques from reprisal attacks, as well as a commitment to repair the damage and bring those responsible to justice.
The Sunni bloc Thursday suspended talks with the main Shiite alliance about forming a new government until its demands are met.
Al-Hakim blamed Saddam Hussein loyalists and followers of Al Qaeda in Iraq boss Abu Musab al-Zarqawi for the mosque bombing.
"We all have to unite in order to eliminate them," he said. "This is what al-Zarqawi is working for, that is, to ignite a sectarian strife in the country," he added. "We call for self-restraint."
Col. Jeffrey Snow, a U.S. Army brigade commander in Baghdad, said the pleas by Iraqi political and religious leaders were helping curb the escalation of sectarian violence.
"It appears as though the people have really listened to the government of Iraq as well as their religious leadership in terms of not allowing this to break down into violent acts," Snow said.
Al-Jaafari, a Shiite, said he had deployed Iraqi armed forces in areas of friction and banned most vehicles from entering or leaving the capital.
He also said measures had been taken to protect holy sites, ban the carrying of unauthorized weapons in the streets, and to rebuild the Shiite shrine in Samarra and other mosques damaged in the violence. A committee was appointed to establish responsibility for the "Samarra catastrophe," he said.
Khalilzad was optimistic Sunnis would return to the talks on forming a government. Without the establishment of an inclusive government, the U.S. strategy for disengagement from Iraq will collapse.
"Iraqis do not have a better alternative than to form a government of national unity," he told reporters at a news conference.
Several joint Sunni-Shiite prayer services were announced for Friday, including one at the Askariya shrine. But security forces turned away about 700 people, virtually all of them Sunnis, who showed up for the service.
Despite the daytime curfew Friday, security forces permitted worshippers to walk to mosque for midday prayers.
There was also little sign of the curfew in Baghdad's teeming Shiite slum, Sadr City, where armed militiamen loyal to al-Sadr have been out in force since Wednesday's mosque attack. Iraqi police found six bodies handcuffed and shot near a parking lot in the area, the Interior Ministry said.
In the southern Shiite heartland, more than 10,000 people converged on Basra's al-Adillah mosque, where a representative of Iraq's top Shiite cleric, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, called another joint service with Sunnis.
The extraordinary security measures helped curb ? but not eliminate ? the violence.
The tomb of Salman Pak, also known as Salman al-Farisi, was attacked after sunset with two rockets, said Jamal al-Saghir, an aide to Shiite political leader Abdul-Aziz al-Hakim. Although the shrine attracts Muslim pilgrims, it is not considered as venerable as the Askariya mosque in Samarra.
Al-Farisi was a 7th century Persian convert to Islam who served as the barber to the Prophet Muhammad. The tomb is located in the village of Salman Pak, 20 miles southeast of Baghdad.
In Samarra, a roadside bomb targeting a police patrol killed two officers 10 minutes after the daytime curfew expired.
Elsewhere, police found the bodies of two bodyguards for the Basra head of the Sunni Endowment, a government body that cares for Sunni mosques and shrines. They had been shot.
South of the capital, in the religiously mixed area known as the "Triangle of Death," gunmen burst into a Shiite home in Latifiyah, separated men from women, and killed five of the males, police Capt. Ibrahim Abdullah said
|
SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,459
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 5 hours, 15 minutes
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5335845 - 02/24/06 07:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Alex213 Stated:
Those arent convincing
Well having people vote in higher numbers then what we have here in the states, doesnt seem like something that has turned for the better in Iraq, then sir, what would be?
You dont like to see once oppressed people vote?
So the rape camps and mass graves are ok, when Saddam was in power?
You dont think that women in Iraq will be at least treated half human? You would it rather be the other way?
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5335868 - 02/24/06 07:39 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Well having people vote in higher numbers then what we have here in the states, doesnt seem like something that has turned for the better in Iraq, then sir, what would be?
Well with the people running on the ticket here in the US i couldnt understand why this isnt true.
Quote:
You dont like to see once oppressed people vote?
OH WONT YOU THINK OF THE CHILDREN!
Quote:
So the rape camps and mass graves are ok, when Saddam was in power?
What about the rape camps in Darfur,Sudan? North Korea, China's genocide of east Turkestan and Falun Gong members. This seems strange especially since all the shit we are charging Saddam with.(I believe the massive gassing of Kurds in Irbil) Was a result of the chemical components we gave to Saddam to fight the EVIL Ayatollah in Iraq. We sure as hell didnt make a big stink about it in 1988 why now?
Quote:
You dont think that women in Iraq will be at least treated half human? You would it rather be the other way?
Well im sure the people we are putting into power in Iraq like SCIRI will certainly treat women with respect. Oh wait i mean they will rule their country by Sharia (Islamic Doctrine).
IF you think that the people were puttin into power are gonna be non-violent good little american democracy you got another thing coming. Say hello to cozy relations with Iran and more roving religious lunatics with ak47s and russian made at-4s the only reason their not attacking us is because we put them in power.
|
RandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5335998 - 02/24/06 08:36 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: Well having people vote in higher numbers then what we have here in the states, doesnt seem like something that has turned for the better in Iraq, then sir, what would be?
High voting numbers does not mean that the overall situation has improved.
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: You dont like to see once oppressed people vote?
Me personally...I don't give a shit. I'm an isolationist. Those people can rot for all I care.
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: So the rape camps and mass graves are ok, when Saddam was in power?
Rape camps? I've never heard of those.
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: You dont think that women in Iraq will be at least treated half human? You would it rather be the other way?
Women were actually treated quite well under Saddam. For all of his Islamic bluster his regime was actually quite secular. Women went to school, worked, and had incredible freedoms in comparison to most other Muslim countries. There is actually a danger of women's rights being rescinded now that religious Shi'ite political parties are gaining power.
Note that all of this is not an endorsement of Saddam by me (he was a violent third-world scumbag dictator). I think he should be drug out into the street and shot.
|
Skeptikos
GeneticallyEngineeredBonobo

Registered: 01/15/06
Posts: 145
Loc: Rome, west side
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
#5336049 - 02/24/06 08:53 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
-------------------- Sincerely, Skeptikos
|
SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,459
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 5 hours, 15 minutes
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Skeptikos]
#5336328 - 02/24/06 10:28 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
and Russian made at-4s the only reason their not attacking us is because we put them in power.
My god, dont pretend you know nomenclature..... AT-4 is not Russian it is American.
As far as Rape Camps.......
http://usembassy.state.gov/nigeria/wwwhp101002c.html
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
|
Skeptikos
GeneticallyEngineeredBonobo

Registered: 01/15/06
Posts: 145
Loc: Rome, west side
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Skeptikos]
#5336331 - 02/24/06 10:29 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Whoops. Sorry,
-------------------- Sincerely, Skeptikos
|
Skeptikos
GeneticallyEngineeredBonobo

Registered: 01/15/06
Posts: 145
Loc: Rome, west side
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5336366 - 02/24/06 10:39 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: and Russian made at-4s the only reason their not attacking us is because we put them in power.
My god, dont pretend you know nomenclature..... AT-4 is not Russian it is American.
How is this a response to my post?
-------------------- Sincerely, Skeptikos
|
The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5336591 - 02/25/06 12:04 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: and Russian made at-4s the only reason their not attacking us is because we put them in power.
My god, dont pretend you know nomenclature..... AT-4 is not Russian it is American.
As far as Rape Camps.......
http://usembassy.state.gov/nigeria/wwwhp101002c.html
Actually it was made by the swedes. Russia just stole the prototype and stamped them. Usually this and rpg-7s are the main antitank arsenal of the jihadis.
|
Alex213
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 1,839
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5336600 - 02/25/06 12:06 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Well having people vote in higher numbers then what we have here in the states, doesnt seem like something that has turned for the better in Iraq, then sir, what would be?
Water? Electricity? Employment? Not having your country occupied by a foreign power? The ability to walk down the street without being shot?
You dont like to see once oppressed people vote?
You think because people are allowed a vote they arn't repressed? Those police death squads patrolling the streets arn't repressive in your book?
So the rape camps and mass graves are ok, when Saddam was in power?
The mass graves mostly date from the 1980's and shortly after the Gulf war. If you were concerned about these then why was Rumsfield shaking Saddams hand at the time?
And I don't think you really want to get into human rights abuses. The ex-prime minister of Iraq says human rights abuses are worse now than they were under Saddam.
You dont think that women in Iraq will be at least treated half human? You would it rather be the other way?
You've got this the wrong way round. Saddam's Iraq was secular. Women had more rights under Saddam than other Arab countries. With the religious fanatics now controlling large areas of Iraq womens rights are rapidly dwindling.
|
heidegger
Stranger

Registered: 02/03/03
Posts: 89
Last seen: 17 years, 2 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Alex213]
#5337075 - 02/25/06 03:05 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
|
Alex213
Stranger
Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 1,839
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: heidegger]
#5337156 - 02/25/06 04:32 AM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Friday, February 24, 2006 Fierce streetfighting at my doorstep for the last 3 hours. Rumor in the neighbourhood is that men in black are trying to enter the area. Some armed kids defending the local mosque three blocks away are splattering bullets at everything that moves, and someone in the street was shouting for people to prepare for defending themselves.
There's supposed to be a curfew, but it doesn't look like it. My net connection is erratic, so I'll try to update again if possible. The news from other areas in Baghdad are horrible. I don't think it's being reported anywhere.
My father and uncle are agitatedly walking back and forth in the hallway, asking me what we should do if the mob or Interior ministry forces try to attack us in our homes? I have no answer for them.
Phew. Sounds like a really great place. Fancy taking a holiday in Baghdad this year SirTrip?
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!


Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 34,086
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 52 minutes, 47 seconds
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: lonestar2004]
#5337786 - 02/25/06 12:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: Just imagine being an Iraqi, if Saddam would be in power right know. Fast forward twenty years from now, you will see something much better. All of which steams from US involvement.
Yeah, imagine if Saddam was still in power and Iraq wasn't the terrorist state it has become. Imagine if we hadn't dumped $250 billion (and counting) there. Imagine if we hadn't killed 30,000 - 100,000 Iraqi citizens. Imagine if we hadn't lost 2287 US soldiers. Imagine if our government hadn't lost credibility getting us into this quagmire.
The bottom line is that it IS nice that we freed the Iraqi people, but we could have done a LOT more with that money and with our military. We could have fed the world 3 times over for Christ's sake.
Lonestar: Bush will definitely go down as one of the WORST Presidents ever, but I'll tell you what. If someday The History Channel does do a show like the one you described, I owe you a coke.
-------------------- -------------------------------- Mp3 of the month: The Apple-Glass Cyndrome - Someday
|
SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,459
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 5 hours, 15 minutes
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: Learyfan]
#5339240 - 02/25/06 08:54 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Alex213,
You been to Iraq? I have. I fought there. The people have their own feuds to settle with one another. Their will be blood shed. Nation building is a dirty business. Show me a nation in history that didn't shed blood since its conception. Being a student of history, I challenge you to show me one.You see the people there? Ever see the look in thier eyes as they went to the polling station? Were do you get your news? Your willing to take the word of an Iraqi Prime minister under Saddam telling you that human rights are worse now? The "knowledge" of the untested like you makes me sick. I glad there are people like you with your mindset, I would keep you as far away from my flank in a firefight as possible.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
Edited by SirTripAlot (02/25/06 08:56 PM)
|
beatnicknick
The Innovator


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5339741 - 02/25/06 11:08 PM (17 years, 11 months ago) |
|
|
Nation building is a dirty business, no one will disagree that there wont be bloodshed. But we really should not be nation building. There are worse dictators to take out if our goal is intervene. Bush did it on false pretenses and was scandolous about the entire thing, has hidden motives surrounding money, if it is going to be more than 10 year war to help these violent people than the public will be outraged on top of all Bush's deception and we will pull out and accomplish nothing. We should pull out now to prevent that. I guarntee that if we want to keep Iraq nonviolent (great job we're doing now) that we'll have to stay there much longer than 10 years, as it is these people's nature for violence. The civilians, the ones we are trying to help, are the very people fighting us. We should get the fuck out of there now, it'd be so wasteful if we stayed any longer. Bush got his revenge, Cheney got his no-bid contract, now can we please end the dying of us and let them kill themselves?
-------------------- I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!


Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 34,086
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 52 minutes, 47 seconds
|
Re: Situation in Iraq growing more dire. [Re: SirTripAlot]
#5340784 - 02/26/06 12:00 PM (17 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: Alex213,
You been to Iraq? I have. I fought there. The people have their own feuds to settle with one another. Their will be blood shed. Nation building is a dirty business. Show me a nation in history that didn't shed blood since its conception. Being a student of history, I challenge you to show me one.You see the people there? Ever see the look in thier eyes as they went to the polling station? Were do you get your news? Your willing to take the word of an Iraqi Prime minister under Saddam telling you that human rights are worse now? The "knowledge" of the untested like you makes me sick. I glad there are people like you with your mindset, I would keep you as far away from my flank in a firefight as possible.
It's like you spent our rent money on a big screen TV. I'm trying to explain to you that while having a big screen TV is nice, the money would be much better spent elsewhere.
-------------------- -------------------------------- Mp3 of the month: The Apple-Glass Cyndrome - Someday
|
|