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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: Asante]
    #5298796 - 02/14/06 11:17 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The static build/discharge theory is pure speculation, but a rubber balloon is 100 times more succeptable to creating static than a polyethylene bag.




Sorry, but it is not pure speculation, it is a hard fact.  I posted the amount of energy needed to initiate a detonation in the gas mixture mentioned. This small bit of energy is easily obtainable from static electricity.  Polyethylene is famous for generating static charges.  I was not posting speculation, but facts.  If you need sources, I can provide those as well.  Most balloons are made from neoprene or latex, neither of which generate near the static charge that polyethylene does.

Quote:

I think you have that ass-backward. Without being mixed with oxygen or air, acetylene burns MUCH slower, not faster.




Nope, you have it ass-backwards and WS was correct.  There is a large difference between detonation and deflagration.  Gun powder deflagrates while dynamite detonates.  Pure acetylene will detonate without any oxygen present at all, under certain conditions.  I outlined these conditions in my previous post.  A detonation is much more powerful than a deflagration, and by definition, propagates much faster... faster than the speed of sound in the substance decomposing... again, by definition.  When you see the large fireball... that is the acetylene deflagrating.  When you see a bright flash and a loud crack, that is the acetylene detonating.  Changes in gas composition, container size, and pressure will influence the chance of a slow burn versus a fast detonation.

Quote:

Torn eardrums, though painful and deafening are not permanently damaged. They heal. The deafness is only temporary.




Again, incorrect.  Although most people do recover completely from a perforated eardrum, both the size of the tear and the location of the tear can cause permanent hearing impairment. 

Quote:

Acetylene is provided as a gas dissolved in a solvent such as acetone (rather than compressed to a liquid) because such a cilinder would blow up the entire workshop if it fell over.




Almost correct... the tank wouldn't need to fall over... acetylene over 30 psi can spontaneously detonate.

Quote:

especially when they are handled.




The most dangerous time is when he is filling the bag... but the nature of the materials involved would allow for a detonation to occur at any time the bag is being handled... and possibly even when not being handled, though that would be unlikely.

Quote:

Realize this though... Pretty much everything you do in life that's exciting and fun involves a certain amount of risk.




Yes, and I have done my share of extreme activities... technical rock climbing, SCUBA diving, spelunking, etc... but the difference is that I don't try to convince people that these activities are, in your words, "VERY SAFE".  People die all the time doing these activities.  People die all the time working with explosives.  Although I love the art and science of pyrotechnics, I certainly do not lie to myself about the dangers.  I know that every time I mix up a new batch of stars, that I may end up killing myself, no matter how safe I am.

Anyway... I'm done with the warnings... I have been working with explosives and pyrotechnics for more than fifteen years... I have worked in an explosives research lab, testing explosives for the US military... If you can name it, I probably tested it, and there is a good chance that I have manufactured it as well... I still have all my fingers, though many of those that I have worked with do not.  If you think I am over the top, go post your acetylene bag experiences on rec.pyrotechnics and see what the professionals have to say about it... :grin:


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: TM]
    #5298922 - 02/14/06 11:46 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

You, Wiccan, are not completely correct. You are conflagrating and composing and exaggerating and assuming and simply fabricating.
Stop already.




:smile: way to deal with that!


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InvisibleTM
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: Seuss]
    #5298979 - 02/14/06 12:04 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

The speculation I was referring to was when you said static was the likely cause of that balloon in the car going boom.
Pure speculation there. No one will ever know for sure exactly what caused it to blow.


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"Have some congratulatory drugs." - C. Montgomery Burns

I'll probably always do drugs, so that just contributes to the addiction to The Shroomery... It's a vicious circle of bliss. :tongue2:

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InvisibleAsante
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: TM]
    #5299211 - 02/14/06 01:22 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The speculation I was referring to was when you said static was the likely cause of that balloon in the car going boom.
Pure speculation there. No one will ever know for sure exactly what caused it to blow.




True, that part is speculation, but it wasn't intended as anything but that and clearly marked as such:

Quote:

static electricity is a major hazard. That likely blew up the car in the news article, static between the balloon and synthetic upholstery of the car seat.




Many things could've, but static electricity is one of the major dangers of this method so its realistic to assume it was that.

If you can rig your acetylene bags in a way that nobody is near them when they fill and sit until you fire them you've eliminated most hazards. Perhaps you could fill the bag with oxygen first and then supply the required acetylene in the field through a long thin hose from firing distance. That way you are far away all the while and mostly out of harm's way. Its not completely safe but it beats the hands on approach.

If you want to do it the usual way then use goggles & quality earplugs at the very least when you are filling and handling the bag. You're in a shitload of trouble when the bag blows and you're near (its quite a blast) and your eyes and especially ears are most in danger. When you're at a safe distance you can remove em.

I don't know how big your thrashbags are but you said something about it setting off car alarms over a distance and you enjoying the concussion from afar, and that alone says enough about the size of your blasts.

Be careful man, we don't want to come up one Shroomerite short at the evening headcount :smile:


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InvisibleTM
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: Asante]
    #5299255 - 02/14/06 01:38 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks for your genuine concern and wisely thought out suggestions.

What you don't understand is that I don't do this on any kind of regular basis and haven't done it for over 20 years,
so, if I ever do make another trash bag bomb, I'll keep it in mind, as should everyone interested in trying this.

Peace.


--------------------
================================================



"Have some congratulatory drugs." - C. Montgomery Burns

I'll probably always do drugs, so that just contributes to the addiction to The Shroomery... It's a vicious circle of bliss. :tongue2:

TM™ :cool:


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Invisiblegdman
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Re: Trash Bag Bomb... Anyone Else Ever Done This? [Re: TM]
    #5300329 - 02/14/06 06:46 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
Locked before it gets out of hand again.


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