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Offlinekungpow
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Coir and Overlay!!! (Update w/Pic)
    #5284963 - 02/10/06 08:41 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I am starting to get pissed off with my coir/verm casing mix. I am having some problems with overlay in a few spots on my casing. I have 10lbs of poo in a 66qt tub and everything went fine through the spawn and then I cased. I waited without peaking for 3 days then I checked on the casing and seen a few spots of myc poking up through the casing layer. I patched and took out of the darkness. It has been 5 days since I brought it out and there are no pins. BUt I have a few spots of overlay. This is the second monotub that I have done and I have never had this problem.

My question is what should I do about it? Should I leave those spots alone and see what happens. Or should I scrape just the spots. They are pretty small, about the size of a 50 cent piece. If you would like pics I can post tonight. I have family over right now so I can't be taking pics.

Thanks alot
~Peace Out


Edited by kungpow (02/10/06 09:58 PM)


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InvisibleAtheist
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kungpow]
    #5285062 - 02/10/06 09:13 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Ya its fine. Overlay doesnt do shit, just keep waiting and give lots of FAE.


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InvisibleFungusMan
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: Atheist]
    #5285067 - 02/10/06 09:14 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Pics would help. Are you sure its overlay?


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Offlinekilgore_trout
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: FungusMan]
    #5285090 - 02/10/06 09:21 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

if you do anything at all, if the spots are really large enough to care before next flush, i would gently break up the overlay at the top and patch it with a very thin layer of casing material. dont even disturb the casing material, just bust up the overlay a little bit and lightly patch.

give us a pic, you prob dont have to do shit, at least until after this flush.


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kilgore_trout]
    #5285470 - 02/10/06 11:10 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

When you put a layer of coir over a manure bed, you're adding a second layer of substrate, not casing. That's why coir overlays so bad. Peat/verm is suitable for casing mix. Coir is at least as nutritious as cow manure, so imho is not suitable for casing. The reason some report success with coir 'casing' is because cubes fruit just fine without a casing, although flushes will be better and yields higher with a proper casing layer.
RR


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Offlinekilgore_trout
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #5285559 - 02/10/06 11:31 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

yeah, this has had a lot of discussion lately. coir has nutrients. many think it is as inert as verm. its nutritive properties lead to overlay.

it may be used in a proper casing layer if you don't go over like 20% coir. i use some coir, but its mostly peat and verm. you really have to watch coir casings.


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #5285575 - 02/10/06 11:38 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
When you put a layer of coir over a manure bed, you're adding a second layer of substrate, not casing. That's why coir overlays so bad. Peat/verm is suitable for casing mix. Coir is at least as nutritious as cow manure, so imho is not suitable for casing. The reason some report success with coir 'casing' is because cubes fruit just fine without a casing, although flushes will be better and yields higher with a proper casing layer.
RR



I totally agree and would like to reiterate once again read my pinning strategy and learn what overlay actually is people, there is a total misconception out there where people are thinking totally colonized casings are overlayed. True overlay is stroma type growth thick and dense impervious to water, it is also a vegetative growth not a generative (fruiting) growth. Vegetative growth is forced when using coir as the myc has to colonize it and digest the nutes as opposed to just growing up and thru it. This is all explained in my pinning strategy, well worth the read.


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Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
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Offlinekungpow
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: hyphae]
    #5285807 - 02/10/06 01:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

So you would you guys suggest just using verm for now on instead of verm coir. My verm coir mix is 60/40. I remember reading about coir causing this problem lately but I haven't had any problems until now. There are just a few small spots that look like it is overlaying. I don't think I am going to do anything unless it gets really bad. My casing layer might be 5-10% overlayed.

Maybe soon I will start using verm peat. I could prolly pick everything up at homedepot for that mix.

~Peace Out


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kungpow]
    #5286755 - 02/10/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

You could use coir/verm still just make sure you boil it and strain it and rinse it good first that will take out alot. Just lightly patch that way those areas won't prematurely pin which will fuck up your initial pinset totally. By lightly I mean sprinkle just enough so the white goes away 1/16" or so. Basically so light can't penetrate is all. Timing is the biggest key to awesome pinsets CONSISTANTLY!


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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Offlinekungpow
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: hyphae]
    #5287335 - 02/10/06 09:20 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Well I am trying to initiate pinning right now. I have had it out of darkness since monday. So hopefully I will see some pins by this coming monday. It looks like they are starting to form. I will light patch those overlayed areas though. I've got rhizos popping up through on some spots of the casing. Actually I will go take that pic right now. BRB!!!


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Offlinekungpow
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kungpow]
    #5287432 - 02/10/06 09:56 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Well here is the pic. I am actually a little bit worried about this casing now. I seen some green when I took the pic. You can see it a little bit in the pic. It is in a few of the overlayed spots. I immediately took a sterilized spoon and took those parts off and recased with casing mix. before I put the new casing on those spots I looked for more green and it looks like I caught it right in the beginning. Hopefully I saved it. I would be pissed if I lost 10lbs of poo to green mold.

but about the overlay. The green circles are my concerned spots. Here is the pic.



Thanks for the help
~Peace Out


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InvisibleJaeger
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kungpow] * 1
    #5287455 - 02/10/06 10:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Doesn't look like overlay to this n00b.


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Offlinekungpow
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: Jaeger]
    #5287743 - 02/11/06 12:44 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I said that it was only on a very small percentage of the casing. I just don't like to see overlay because I've never had probs with it before. I am also worried about the green spots. I hope I caught it before it could do any damage.


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InvisibleFungusMan
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: kungpow]
    #5287772 - 02/11/06 01:08 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

That isnt even a 1/10 close to overlay,lol. Looks pretty normal to me.


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Offlinetokey666
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: FungusMan]
    #5288113 - 02/11/06 08:43 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Looks good to me!

I hope that mold won't come back. When I get it, I do what you did with the spoon. But it doesn't seem to help. It kept coming back in those areas for me. I hope yours is different!


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OfflineRemainRandom50
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: tokey666]
    #5288210 - 02/11/06 09:32 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

IMO just dont go through with a casing layer. If your stuff spawns perfectly with the poo. then when its fully colonized, birth that. no casing layer needed.


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: Coir and Overlay!!! [Re: RemainRandom50]
    #5288488 - 02/11/06 12:01 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

RemainRandom50 said:
IMO just dont go through with a casing layer.  If your stuff spawns perfectly with the poo.  then when its fully colonized, birth that.  no casing layer needed.




When putting the time and effort into a hobby like this you will want to get the biggest bang for the buck, here casing layers are just that, the best bang you can get they can improve yields tremendously. Go ahead a try one with and one without if done right you will be blown away by the results! :wink: They provide the needed moisture for those heavy flushes which puts alot less stress on your substrate, there is just too many pro's and absolutely no con's for casing layers IME.


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"


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