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Offlinebeatnicknick
The Innovator
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Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
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Our war is terrorism, research inside
    #5263141 - 02/04/06 04:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

"The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons."

We went to Iraq despite the wishes of 90% of Iraqi citizens to not. Whether Saddam said it was unlawful or not, we are a democracy and we should listen to the people of the land. "unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group" So they didn't want us to come, and we came. The organized group in the definition is obviously the Bush Administration.

"...against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments" Yes this is obvious, we went there to completely change their government, for better or for worse (Hamas won the election, they're a known terrorist group, you decide)

"...often for ideological or political reasons" In this case it is a both.

WE technically are the terrorists, only on a bigger budget, and with lots of bombs so that no one neutral would challenge us if we attacked an county on false beliefs. And we did, there are no WMDs, there is no Osama-Saddam link, we didn't kill off all the terrorists in their own territory, we only created a reason for more to form. There has not been a single prevented terrorist attack on America since 9/11.

We did however manage to make our county rally behind our troops, put up all kinds of patriotic slogans everywhere, discuss their hatred of terrorists and their unification against them. We've decided our right to privacy from the government is no longer needed as long as they have a chance to prevent another 9/11 detect al-Qaeda e-mails, phone calls, and yes, believe it or not, AOL AIM conversations.

Let's look at the defining Characteristics of a fascist nation (www.secularhumanism.org)

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols

2.Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc. 3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.

Disproportionate amount of government funding to the military even when there are so many domestic problems? Hmmm who does that eerily sound like?

7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.


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I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
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Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 18 days
Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: beatnicknick]
    #5263163 - 02/04/06 04:08 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

We went to Iraq despite the wishes of 90% of Iraqi citizens to not.




Source, please.

Quote:

Whether Saddam said it was unlawful or not, we are a democracy and we should listen to the people of the land.




Of course Saddam is going to say it was unlawful. The point is that it wasn't unlawful to resume hostilities which began as a reaction to Hussein's invasion of Kuwait and were suspended only on the condition that Hussein abide by the terms of the conditional cease fire agreement of 1991.

Quote:

Yes this is obvious, we went there to completely change their government, for better or for worse (Hamas won the election, they're a known terrorist group, you decide)




Hamas won the election for control of the PLA. Nothing to do with Iraq.



Phred


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Offlinebeatnicknick
The Innovator
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Registered: 05/25/05
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Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: Phred]
    #5263260 - 02/04/06 04:31 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Hamas won the election for control of the PLA. Nothing to do with Iraq.

Yes you are right about this, I through this in under something my brother said right before I posted it, sorry for the false information.

"Of course Saddam is going to say it was unlawful."
I realise that, that is why I said whether it was unlawful or not, the iraqis didn't want it, and that's who we're doing this for, is it not?

Source, please.

http://www.mydd.com/story/2005/7/15/141556/374

the exact information is majorities ranging from 53 percent in and around Kirkuk to 90 percent in the Sunni cities of Tikrit and Baquba believe the U.S.-led forces will not ``improve the situation in Iraq.''

Sad.


--------------------
I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
Male

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 18 days
Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: beatnicknick]
    #5263291 - 02/04/06 04:38 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

What counts is not how many Iraqis wanted the coalition forces to leave in March of 2005 (which is all the purported information your source provides -- and even at that it doesn't equal 90%) after Hussein had been deposed, but how many wanted the coalition forces to depose him in March of 2003. Two entirely different questions.

When you claimed 90% of Iraqis didn't want Hussein deposed by outsiders, I expected you to provide s source supporting that.



Phred


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Offlinebeatnicknick
The Innovator
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Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
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Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: Phred]
    #5263327 - 02/04/06 04:48 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Yes, the wording of that is bad. I really need to relook at what I write when it's done. If I had revised that post with the comment on Hamas being a terrorist group, and with the revision of the phrase "they didn't want us to invade" to "they don't want us to invade any longer" how would you respond to the rest of it?

I like talking to you because most of the republicans I argue with have absolutley no knowledge of politics and believe in things without having credible sources, while you make sure the points have reasonable back up. I didn't double-check every detail because of this fact, but you have pointed out my mistakes.

So please, respond to rest of the post.


--------------------
I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


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Offlinebeatnicknick
The Innovator
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Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 1,074
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: beatnicknick]
    #5266862 - 02/05/06 05:10 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Go ahead now, respond. I'm interested in hearing your excuse.


--------------------
I don't think for myself. I think as though I'm explaining my thoughts to someone else. I'm concerned only for those listening.


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OfflineRedstorm
Prince of Bugs
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Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 3 months, 11 days
Re: Our war is terrorism, research inside [Re: beatnicknick]
    #5266911 - 02/05/06 05:37 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Give him some time. Some people have a life, you know.


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