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DeadHearts

Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,827
Loc: MICHIGAN
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Pastywhyte]
#19835327 - 04/12/14 10:47 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: I got no problem with people asking questions. If I jumped on someone for simply asking a question I apologize. But I make no apologies for calling out a tek which advocates using spores to inoculate, having holes exposed or opening a lid in open air. These things might have been considered an acceptable practice ten years ago, but we know better today I also dislike the notion that LC is "noob friendly". Agar is noob friendly. If you can get agar down then you are ready for LC.

The thing is these ten year old practices still work and work with great success for many people. Who are you to act like an authority on acceptable practices?
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Pastywhyte
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Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: DeadHearts]
#19835413 - 04/12/14 11:05 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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This hobby is constantly evolving. Mycology is a relatively new discipline. Information from 10 years ago might as well be a cave painting today. Ten years ago we didn't know that:
1) Mushrooms need FAE more than RH
2) Light on a 12/12 schedule is beneficial at all stages
3) Coir can be used as a substrate, it was thought to be good for casing only
Today everyone grows on coir, no one would think to fruit in the dark and most common FC designs are more concerned with FAE than RH. No matter what, Open air inoculation of sterile media is a terrible idea. The end.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Pastywhyte]
#19835421 - 04/12/14 11:09 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: I got no problem with people asking questions. If I jumped on someone for simply asking a question I apologize. But I make no apologies for calling out a tek which advocates using spores to inoculate, having holes exposed or opening a lid in open air. These things might have been considered an acceptable practice ten years ago, but we know better today I also dislike the notion that LC is "noob friendly". Agar is noob friendly. If you can get agar down then you are ready for LC.

amen my brother otto it's a good post and i'm glad it works for ya, not something i will reccomend to anybody i see on the boards and will advise against when i see it, but only because it lacks a standard to ensure a good success rate
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_OttO_
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: cronicr] 1
#19835925 - 04/13/14 01:39 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: amen my brother otto it's a good post and i'm glad it works for ya, not something i will reccomend to anybody i see on the boards and will advise against when i see it, but only because it lacks a standard to ensure a good success rate
Advising anyone against trying something in this hobby is setting them up for more failure than encouraging them to have a crack at a 'questionable' practice that really isn't even questionable at all. Open air innoculations really aren't ridiculous! You guys are talking as if there is only one way to do things and that is strictly by the book! But, if you close the windows, clean the bench and hold your breath - I promise you'll surprise yourself at your results, and these simple steps seem completely manageable to even first time hobbyists.
My argument is that by being too fearful of the 'needing to be completely by-the-book sterile' will scare more people off from even trying in the first place, because it sounds like something they can't get their head around.
Every single thing you try gives you more experience, and experience is the key to going forward with anything we ever do in life, including mycology. Trying an LC presents itself as an easy thing to get your head around and doesnt seem too scary. If you have success with this, you will probably get excited and want to take the hobby further. More people trying = more mushrooms in the world = a good thing in my book. That's my intention.
Quote:
bodhisatta said: LC is completely useless for the new grower; LC really doesn't have a place with cubensis.
This is called 'All or nothing' or 'Black and White' thinking, and is a psychological term used to describe unbalanced or illogical mindsets. It's not fair to use these arguments in spite of the evidence.
Edited by _OttO_ (04/13/14 02:17 AM)
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13shrooms
Lightning Shaman



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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: _OttO_]
#19838062 - 04/13/14 01:56 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
_OttO_ said:
Quote:
bodhisatta said: LC is completely useless for the new grower; LC really doesn't have a place with cubensis.
This is called 'All or nothing' or 'Black and White' thinking, and is a psychological term used to describe unbalanced or illogical mindsets. It's not fair to use these arguments in spite of the evidence.
I wouldnt call it all or nothing 
I would call it RR brainwashing 
He may know his stuff but like you said Otto, its not the only stuff. 
I think it may be the "safest" stuff for a high success rate but for those with a lil patience there are many way to skin a cat. 
all though I have never look back once I used an "otto-matic" monotub 
combined with Large_Dose or Damion5050s coir mixes and some G2G (started with an LC ) you have more than you could ask for 
there is no one specific "gospel" in the myco world, just what works for you based on a "tek" or even a combination of teks from whomever that gets you what you want. 
Im ranting.. 
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A M U Click here ^ for the AMU forum VVV AMUs Free Active/Edible/Exotic Spore Print or Syringe or Edible Culture Trade Thread VVV "Man is the sex organ of the machine world" ~ Marshall McLuhan
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bodhisatta 
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: 13shrooms]
#19838095 - 04/13/14 02:03 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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RR isn't gospel But I do stand by my thoughts on LC, it's like learning how to shift a car like a chick and then being like eh it works.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: bodhisatta]
#19838224 - 04/13/14 02:29 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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otto it's nuthing personel i just much prefer TL'S lc tek due to the things pasty had pointed out amongst others about alcohol"sterilizing" your knife/syringe and i do agree that if ya got the means to try shit(lots of your own prints) you shouldn't be afraid to do so and fail a few times along the way, nice to see ya kicking around here to
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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Psilicon
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: _OttO_]
#19838266 - 04/13/14 02:39 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
_OttO_ said:
Advising anyone against trying something in this hobby is setting them up for more failure than encouraging them to have a crack at a 'questionable' practice that really isn't even questionable at all. Open air innoculations really aren't ridiculous! You guys are talking as if there is only one way to do things and that is strictly by the book! But, if you close the windows, clean the bench and hold your breath - I promise you'll surprise yourself at your results, and these simple steps seem completely manageable to even first time hobbyists.
When I was first starting my bulk attempts, this tek was the first one I turned to. I did exactly what you said, to the letter except for using a significantly smaller amount of spore solution in an attempt to minimize the number of bacterial endospores introduced into the LC.
You grew me a lot of bacteria and trich, Otto, and as a result I quit growing and lurked on and off again for years until I saw that there was a clear consensus for why I failed: your tek. That's why I recommend against it.
Further, I think your insistence that we don't attempt to discourage newbs from using questionable techniques is ridiculous at best. You and I can both agree that if a newb wants to inoculate by dropping in a spore swab taken with a used Q-tip, he is doomed to fail and his opinion should not be respected on the boards in case another newb mistakenly believes this is a good idea. You and I can also agree that this tek falls between sterile technique and the used Q-tip inoculation on a spectrum of cleanliness and success. The question is where it falls, and whether it's responsible to acknowledge this method as valid.
I strongly feel that it could be improved greatly by a cardboard box with two holes in it and cling film taped over the top rather than just sitting around in a Lysol-drenched apartment, lungs burning as the cultivator tries not to exhale. I also feel that since said cardboard box is free, it is irresponsible at best to advocate doing this in open air.
It's now well known that alcohol doesn't sterilize tools. It doesn't even pass the bar for surgery, which requires a far lesser degree of sterility than we need for liquid culture. Did you actually do it by that method, or did you only flame sterilize?
2mL of spore solution is an insane amount that begs for contamination with any syringe.
These are changes I insist on seeing, and will continue to insist on before I can morally call this tek anything but risky at best.
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bodhisatta 
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Registered: 04/30/13
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Psilicon]
#19838469 - 04/13/14 03:23 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: bodhisatta]
#19838789 - 04/13/14 04:33 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks for the testimony van der greigen, that is exactly what I am talking about. Proper sterile tek is not hard, like you said a cardboard box & saran wrap are not hard things to come by and will save a lot of grief. Ditto for the rest of the issues that have been mentioned. Noobs thinking proper sterile tek is hard is easily fixed. Growing nothing but contams will turn people off the hobby quicker.
Far more contam issues on the boards are traced back to LC than for agar. If someone asks me if agar is hard I will tell them no, its much easier than LC. I then will be satisfied that I gave them good info.
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13shrooms
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Pastywhyte]
#19840842 - 04/13/14 11:19 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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this tek did not make anyone fail.. cutting corners made you fail.. while Im not a proponent of sugar based LCs there is nothing wrong with this tek only the person trying it for the first time not understanding the basics yet and jumping in head first.. 
as for TLs tek, he is my understudy of sorts and that tek was worked out by both of us based on Damion5050s LC tek which all we did was remove the dextrose from the orig recipe. 
your guys' argument is comparable to the whole beginners must start with the pftek garbage when monotubs are just as easy.. its about what you know b4 you dive in and dont try to cut corners right off the jump..
if you got contams then it was the users methods not the directions of a "tek" 
and we see who has the TC tags around here, just sayin.. 
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A M U Click here ^ for the AMU forum VVV AMUs Free Active/Edible/Exotic Spore Print or Syringe or Edible Culture Trade Thread VVV "Man is the sex organ of the machine world" ~ Marshall McLuhan
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Psilicon
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: 13shrooms]
#19840858 - 04/13/14 11:25 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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So which part did you disagree with, mighty TC? Was it that open-air inoculation is a good idea? That alcohol sterilizes? Or was it that 2mL of spore solution is likely to be sterile?
This tek is all about cutting corners. That's the entire problem.
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13shrooms
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Psilicon]
#19840951 - 04/13/14 11:50 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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open air is fine if you have a clean environment and good sterile procedures.. 
when people say that alcohol sterilizes they are referring to it cleans off anything that was on the needle, not that it keeps it clean. and as long as the needle touches nothing once its wiped it is pretty sterile.. or should I say sanitized since we have a semantics nazi among us.. 
and why wouldnt his spore syringe b3 sterile? 
its not like he took his spores from a wild print and sucked them up into his syringe and used it.. clean prints made properly (which wasnt described here) give clean spore syringes and you can use as much spore solution as you want.. heck Ive shot 60cc into a lrg 5qt grain bag with no issues many of times.. as much as 5cc into an LC even.. 
its called common sense not be a mindless drone... 
the part I disagree with is the sugar/honey (as I already stated above), for 1 honey is naturally anti-fungal. and 2 I dont like putting my myc into anaphylactic shock when they go from a super sugar based LC to a low sugar content bag of grains and stall out on me right off the bat.. I only use ELME and water.. extra low on sugar content. 
oh and the noob whining, I disagree with all the whining 
AND THATS THE BOTTOM LINE CUS THIS "MIGHTY TC" SAID SO.. 
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A M U Click here ^ for the AMU forum VVV AMUs Free Active/Edible/Exotic Spore Print or Syringe or Edible Culture Trade Thread VVV "Man is the sex organ of the machine world" ~ Marshall McLuhan
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: 13shrooms]
#19840971 - 04/13/14 11:55 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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 EDIT: that was a bitchin post lol!, but open air anything is never something i will reccomend, let them succeed before they venture off to fuck around on there own prints
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
Edited by cronicr (05/04/14 01:14 AM)
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Psilicon
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: 13shrooms]
#19841265 - 04/14/14 12:53 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
13shrooms said: open air is fine if you have a clean environment and good sterile procedures.. 
A clean environment is one that has around 1000 fungal spores per cubic meter. That's not counting airborne bacteria. Open air isn't fine, and anyone who's bothered to crack open a petri in the open air can confirm this.
Quote:
13shrooms said:when people say that alcohol sterilizes they are referring to it cleans off anything that was on the needle, not that it keeps it clean. and as long as the needle touches nothing once its wiped it is pretty sterile.. or should I say sanitized since we have a semantics nazi among us.. 
We're actually talking about a knife here, not a syringe, and no, I don't think alcohol sanitized works well enough. Neither does Otto, because despite the fact that he says you can do it, in the pictorial you can see him flaming the goddamn thing and trashing a blade that could have been kept in good shape had he used an alcohol wipe.
Quote:
13shrooms said: and why wouldnt his spore syringe b3 sterile? 
Because we're talking about a beginner-friendly tek here, which means the users will likely be using purchased spores.
Quote:
13shrooms said:its not like he took his spores from a wild print and sucked them up into his syringe and used it.. clean prints made properly (which wasnt described here) give clean spore syringes and you can use as much spore solution as you want.. heck Ive shot 60cc into a lrg 5qt grain bag with no issues many of times.. as much as 5cc into an LC even.. 
Heck I've shot one cc into a sealed LC though a flamed needle and a self-healing injection port and had it contaminate.
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13shrooms said:oh and the noob whining, I disagree with all the whining
Don't want any noobs in a beginner tek, eh?
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13shrooms said:AND THATS THE BOTTOM LINE CUS THIS "MIGHTY TC" SAID SO..
Who sounds like RR now?
Look, you can claim that I need to think outside the box or that I'm brainwashed or a newb or whatever. I'll gladly count myself among one of the brainwashed masses (that happens to include every legitimate mycologist, both academic and industrial) that happens to think that open air isn't acceptable for inoculation, and that equipment should be heat-sterilized. All it takes for me to prove I'm right is a couple threads where a shroomerite is complaining about a contaminated syringe, and I can provide them.
And if you can think of a single good reason why someone shouldn't do inoculations in a six-cent SAB instead of the open air, reducing the spore count from potentially thousands to a big, fat zero, let me know as soon as you manage to put the bowl down.
Edited by Psilicon (04/14/14 01:12 AM)
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_OttO_
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Psilicon] 1
#19841457 - 04/14/14 02:24 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
_OttO_ said:
Advising anyone against trying something in this hobby is setting them up for more failure than encouraging them to have a crack at a 'questionable' practice that really isn't even questionable at all. Open air innoculations really aren't ridiculous! You guys are talking as if there is only one way to do things and that is strictly by the book! But, if you close the windows, clean the bench and hold your breath - I promise you'll surprise yourself at your results, and these simple steps seem completely manageable to even first time hobbyists.
When I was first starting my bulk attempts, this tek was the first one I turned to. I did exactly what you said, to the letter except for using a significantly smaller amount of spore solution in an attempt to minimize the number of bacterial endospores introduced into the LC.
You grew me a lot of bacteria and trich, Otto, and as a result I quit growing and lurked on and off again for years until I saw that there was a clear consensus for why I failed: your tek. That's why I recommend against it.
Mate, you grew yourself a lot of bacteria and trich because for some reason you use syringes with bacterial endospores in them. WTF?? 
Quote:
van der griegen said: Further, I think your insistence that we don't attempt to discourage newbs from using questionable techniques is ridiculous at best. You and I can both agree that if a newb wants to inoculate by dropping in a spore swab taken with a used Q-tip, he is doomed to fail and his opinion should not be respected on the boards in case another newb mistakenly believes this is a good idea. You and I can also agree that this tek falls between sterile technique and the used Q-tip inoculation on a spectrum of cleanliness and success. The question is where it falls, and whether it's responsible to acknowledge this method as valid.
This is not comparable to a noob with a used q-tip - again, wtf? A q-tip is a shit method of storing spores anyway, and I definitely wouldn't be dipping one in a LC. There is no comparison here.
Quote:
van der griegen said: I strongly feel that it could be improved greatly by a cardboard box with two holes in it and cling film taped over the top rather than just sitting around in a Lysol-drenched apartment, lungs burning as the cultivator tries not to exhale. I also feel that since said cardboard box is free, it is irresponsible at best to advocate doing this in open air.
I NEVER suggested drenching your apartment in lysol, just wiping down the bench. However, a still air box sounds like an ok addition, I was just trying to keep the tek simple, and this is an extra step + glove boxes are also very awkward..
Remember though, if its just a simple cardboard box then the walls won't be sterile anyway, so its not all too different to just closing the windows in your house and creating a still air environment where you work. There is very little time where things are exposed to the open air during this process - the jar is opened only a crack to drop in spores if using a print, and not at all if using a syringe = VERY little room for contams to enter.
Quote:
van der griegen said: It's now well known that alcohol doesn't sterilize tools. It doesn't even pass the bar for surgery, which requires a far lesser degree of sterility than we need for liquid culture. Did you actually do it by that method, or did you only flame sterilize?
I use to flame sterilise my knife when scraping up prints, although at the beginning I did use alcohol many times without any problem. I wouldn't recommend that though and have omitted it from the tek.
Quote:
van der griegen said: 2mL of spore solution is an insane amount that begs for contamination with any syringe.
2ml is fine, the more you introduce the faster your mycelium will grow. Unless your syringe is contaminated, it doesnn't matter how much you use, don't be ridiculous..
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van der griegen said: These are changes I insist on seeing, and will continue to insist on before I can morally call this tek anything but risky at best.
I have edited the tek, please read over it.
Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
13shrooms said: open air is fine if you have a clean environment and good sterile procedures.. 
A clean environment is one that has around 1000 fungal spores per cubic meter. That's not counting airborne bacteria. Open air isn't fine, and anyone who's bothered to crack open a petri in the open air can confirm this.
Not in my experience - try your agar plate experiment in a still room on a clean bench with smooth motions and report back with your results... 
Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
13shrooms said:when people say that alcohol sterilizes they are referring to it cleans off anything that was on the needle, not that it keeps it clean. and as long as the needle touches nothing once its wiped it is pretty sterile.. or should I say sanitized since we have a semantics nazi among us.. 
We're actually talking about a knife here, not a syringe, and no, I don't think alcohol sanitized works well enough. Neither does Otto, because despite the fact that he says you can do it, in the pictorial you can see him flaming the goddamn thing and trashing a blade that could have been kept in good shape had he used an alcohol wipe.
Ok some good points have been raised. I agree with flame sterilizing over alcohol, I'll change that bit for you van der griegen.
In the pics I was using a mycology dedicated knife that cost 20c at a second hand shop that I didn't care about ruining.
Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
13shrooms said: and why wouldnt his spore syringe b3 sterile? 
Because we're talking about a beginner-friendly tek here, which means the users will likely be using purchased spores.
Purchased spores should be sterile or the company would go out of business. Use a reputable source.
My whole philosophy on growing and life in general is to keep it simple, so I like to achieve whatever goal with the most economical/minimal amount of work.
With this in mind, I NEVER made any spore syringes after my first few, it just seemed like a waste of a step and an extra avenue for contams to enter. I only ever went from home grown print to LC...
So, I only included the spore syringe step for anyone who happened to be using one. If you look closely the syringe is actually empty, it was purely a visual reference. Having said that, if you had a spore syringe I would assume it is sterile so there isn't any problem there.
On the topic of open air inoculation - Look at just how much you need to expose the LC to contams if you only open the lid a *crack*. Your house is a big glove box anyway if you shut the windows first and wait for the air to settle, wipe your bench and move slowly.
I have edited the original tek on your behalf van der griegen, and included any notes to edits I did. Please have a read and see if it sits better with you now? I even put in a motivational speech to stop people like yourself from giving up if they don't succeed the first time...
Edited by _OttO_ (04/14/14 04:51 AM)
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,808
Loc: Canada
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: _OttO_]
#19841770 - 04/14/14 05:46 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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I might not be a TC but, I can't believe what I am reading. Open air with sterile media is not a good idea.
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: I will say that open air inoculations of anything except pasteurized substrate with fully colonized grain spawn contams on me in days, no exceptions.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18484893#18484893
Quote:
FooMan said: Do you live in a bubble? Advising people to do agar or any other type of sterile work in open air is just ridiculous. Any serious mycologist knows better.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5741264#5741264
These are just 2 I pulled from a quick search which yielded hundreds of hits As for open air agar, this guy found what happens when you expose a plate for just a few seconds in open air. He was working in a very still and sanitized environment, and had gotten away doing G2G like this. Was good enough to post his findings
As for spore syringes from trusted sources, they too are not infallible. I have had contams in spore syringes on occasion and when I emailed the vendor they merely asked for the lot number so they could test the batch, then replaced the syringe. They did this because they know that syringes are not always clean. Firing 2 cc of ms solution into a LC is risky IMO. It would only take a quick search to find hundreds of posts where you can obviously see the source of contam in a grain jar or pf cake was directly from the inoculate.
Like I said, I like LC. But it needs to be done with a certain level of care and attention to sterile tek. I won't beat this horse any longer. However I will direct any people with issues due to this tek to your thread 13, hope you won't mind.
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13shrooms
Lightning Shaman



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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Psilicon] 1
#19841898 - 04/14/14 07:03 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: I might not be a TC but, I can't believe what I am reading. Open air with sterile media is not a good idea.
Like I said, I like LC. But it needs to be done with a certain level of care and attention to sterile tek. I won't beat this horse any longer. However I will direct any people with issues due to this tek to your thread 13, hope you won't mind.
noone ever said it was a good idea only that it can be done. 
if any of you know my posts you know I dont do most of the things that are being complained about.. Im only driving this point because of the blame put on this tek.. what do you guys think I started with? you see how long ago my orig post was in this thread? years ago..
if you know me you know these methods arent how I help others only that it can be done cheap and easy if need be.. I have seen this tek work just fine and it doesnt deserve the scrutiny it receiving... 
I have a Q&A thread and no where in it will you find me giving bad advice. 
but for those that dont know me or my advice and want to "call me out" and point fingers and whine and complain when things dont go your way.. might as well put me on iggy. 
Quote:
van der griegen said:
Quote:
13shrooms said:oh and the noob whining, I disagree with all the whining
Don't want any noobs in a beginner tek, eh?
Quote:
13shrooms said:AND THATS THE BOTTOM LINE CUS THIS "MIGHTY TC" SAID SO..
Who sounds like RR now?
that was meant as a joke because you took a shot at my tag simply because I mentioned we have it for a reason.. 
as for the noob comment, I said the whining is my issue not the noobs 
me thinks you have a reading comprehension issue and cherry pick your arguing points only to make yourself sound even more noobish. 
its a good thing Im not a commercial grower like RR or any of his myco buddies that make a living doing this stuff.  when you guys see them talking about open air is bad and be sterile 100% of the time etc. its because they have a business selling food to p[eople.. they have much higher standards and gov regulations they have to follow if they want o be a profitable business. Im a dude that has a home hobby and dont nee all the nit picky crap that commercial growers need.. whole different game being played here.. 
but anyway.. no one forced you to try.. your lack of experiance is your issue here 
Im out this is OttOs deal not mine so I will quit with my 

Quote:
van der griegen said: let me know as soon as you manage to put the bowl down.
never.
--------------------
A M U Click here ^ for the AMU forum VVV AMUs Free Active/Edible/Exotic Spore Print or Syringe or Edible Culture Trade Thread VVV "Man is the sex organ of the machine world" ~ Marshall McLuhan
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_OttO_
Over Stimulated



Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 2,588
Loc: Up Over
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: Pastywhyte] 1
#19841944 - 04/14/14 07:26 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Pastywhyte said: I might not be a TC but, I can't believe what I am reading. Open air with sterile media is not a good idea.
I never said it was great, I just said for me, it works 98% of the time with this method as the LC media isn't actually really ever exposed to the open air.
This is a very simple way to get a really good success rate. Which might encourage people, instead of scare them off = more mushrooms = better world to live in. If you still miss this point, I give up.
I also suggested trying opening some agar media on a clean bench with clean gloved hands in a still room YOURSELF and see YOUR results. Don't link me to someone else's thread, with no explanation of their conditions or sterile technique.
Quote:
Pastywhyte said: As for spore syringes from trusted sources, they too are not infallible. I have had contams in spore syringes on occasion and when I emailed the vendor they merely asked for the lot number so they could test the batch, then replaced the syringe. They did this because they know that syringes are not always clean. Firing 2 cc of ms solution into a LC is risky IMO. It would only take a quick search to find hundreds of posts where you can obviously see the source of contam in a grain jar or pf cake was directly from the inoculate.
Treat your syringe as if its sterile, innoculating with more or less is, again, irrelevant.
Quote:
Pastywhyte said: Like I said, I like LC. But it needs to be done with a certain level of care and attention to sterile tek.
As does all areas of mycology.
Using Spore print -> LC -> grain jar -> bucket of bulk was the easiest way I could find to get a self sustainable mushroom rotation going with a minimum of fuss. I had 95%+ success, and I have NEVER owned or used a glove box, in the time I was experimenting. Not once. Try it out.
Here's a few pics of the results -




Edited by _OttO_ (04/14/14 07:36 AM)
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Really Nice Guy


Registered: 08/26/12
Posts: 7,057
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
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Re: A *beginner friendly* method for making Liquid Culture [Re: _OttO_]
#19844857 - 04/14/14 05:43 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks, OttO. That means a lot to me.
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