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OfflineEllis Dee
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Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy
    #514197 - 01/08/02 09:23 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

http://www.fresnobee.com/24hour/world/story/208687p-2013661c.html

Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy

The Associated Press
(Published Tuesday, January, 1, 2002 3:02PM)



RIYADH, Saudi Arabia (AP) - Three men in Saudi Arabia were beheaded Tuesday for committing acts of sodomy and "seducing young men," the Interior Ministry said in a statement.
Ali bin Hatan bin Saad, Muhammad bin Suleiman bin Muhammad and Muhammad bin Khalil bin Abdullah were executed in the southwestern mountain resort city of Abha in Asir province, according to the statement carried by the official Saudi Press Agency.

The three men "committed acts of sodomy, married each other, seduced young men and attacked those who rebuked them," the statement said.

The executions were the first this year in Saudi Arabia, where beheadings are public and done with a sword. Last year, at least 81 people were beheaded.

Saudi Arabia follows a strict interpretation of Islam and also imposes the death penalty for murder, rape, drug trafficking and armed robbery.



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Offlinemm.
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514383 - 01/08/02 01:09 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

It's obviously a very different culture over there. The question is, should more liberal countries act to uphold what they see as basic human rights, whether by sanctions/diplomacy/military action etc... or should they respect alternate cultures to the extent that they ignore any human rights abuses and continue to trade with and patronise such nations. The current state of affairs is worse than either of these two options - the west only gets involved when it has an underlying economic or political interest, using human rights abuses as a convenient excuse where possible.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514391 - 01/08/02 01:18 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Are you infering that sodomy is a 'human right'. The three beheaded men committed a very serious crime and they were punished appropriatly in accordance with the law.


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Offlinemm.
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514406 - 01/08/02 01:32 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

I see consenting heterosexual sex as a human right. I see no reason why consenting homosexual sex should be treated any differently. There may be personal moral or religious reasons why someone would think it is unacceptable, but as the act affects no-one other than the particpants, then that person has no business in trying to impose ther views on other people. If we are talking about rape etc then that is a different matter, because there are victims who need to be protected.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514413 - 01/08/02 01:38 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

China shoots drug addicts daily and harvests their organs to sell on the black market; an action Republicans applaud by granting Cina most favored trade status every chance they get.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514429 - 01/08/02 01:48 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Sodomy isn't a human right. Normal sex isn't a human right except in marriage. In the US services adultry is a crime and a court marshal offence(and it's between consenting adults). Sodomy should be a formal crime in the USA just like it is in Saudi Arabia. The act of sodomy affects society unlike you claim. Legalized sodomy has societal implications beyond the participants in it. It's victims are the people in nations where it is permitted.


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InvisiblePGF
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514435 - 01/08/02 01:55 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

should we behead drug users as well?


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Offlinemm.
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514437 - 01/08/02 01:55 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Well I dont beleive in marriage so does that mean I do not have the right to have sex? I would say sex Is more important to most people than taking drugs. That makes you worse than those that would put you in jail for taking shrooms etc.. You cannot expect everyone to live their lives according to your religious beliefs. I do not share your view that homosexual sex advesrely affects the rest of society, provided it done by consenting adults in private - certainly it doesnt affect society more than heterosexual sex does.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514441 - 01/08/02 01:59 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

If sodomy and child molestation were punished with death in the US,
we would not have any Catholic priests here..........


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514447 - 01/08/02 02:06 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Sodomy is wrong. And in Saudi Arabia it's a grave crime. The 3 saudi homos knew what they were doing was a crime and they did it anyway in reckless disregard for their own health and the society in which they lived. And they paid the just consequences of their actions. They got what they knew they deserved.

PGF, we should behead sodomites, not sick people.


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Offlinemm.
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514457 - 01/08/02 02:12 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

In reply to:

Sodomy is wrong. And in Saudi Arabia it's a grave crime. The 3 saudi homos knew what they were doing was a crime and they did it anyway in reckless disregard for their own health and the society in which they lived. And they paid the just consequences of their actions. They got what they knew they deserved.




Do you take drugs?


In reply to:

Drug use is wrong. And in America it's a grave crime. The 3 dope feinds knew what they were doing was a crime and they did it anyway in reckless disregard for their own health and the society in which they lived. And they paid the just consequences of their actions. They got what they knew they deserved.





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Edited by mm. (01/08/02 02:14 PM)

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InvisiblePGF
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514465 - 01/08/02 02:19 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

"PGF, we should behead sodomites, not sick people. "

At least someone here agrees with me when I say potheads are sick people.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514467 - 01/08/02 02:19 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

>>>Do you take drugs?

Nowadays if I get any drugs they come from the pharmacy with a valid prescription.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514473 - 01/08/02 02:24 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Religion is a lie. It only exists to deter depression when thinking about death.

When you die, nothing happens. No heaven, no hell. You are dead.

Live your life the way you want now, or waste it worrying about what some greater power thinks of you. If you don't, you may regret it when you are old. But not when you are dead. Cause you will have no awareness when you are dead.

I usually keep to myself on this because I believe in freedom of religion. Or agnosticism. But you post like yours is law.

Your veiws on sex and religion piss me off. Im not gay.
But if i met you, I would put my dick in your ass.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514480 - 01/08/02 02:31 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

How does consenting sex in private between two people of the same sex adversely affect society to the extent that it warrants capital punishment? Try leaving aside your personal religious views on the matter for moment, which in any case should not affect how society deals with a 'crime'


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Psilocyman]
    #514481 - 01/08/02 02:31 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

In reply to:

Your veiws on sex and religion piss me off. Im not gay.
But if i met you, I would put my dick in your ass.



If you put your penis in peoples butt you are gay. Your whole post is awfully fruity for a meathead like you...


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OfflinePsilocyman
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514482 - 01/08/02 02:36 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Notice the word but.
And immediatly after it, "if I met you"

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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Psilocyman]
    #514485 - 01/08/02 02:39 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

In reply to:

Notice the word but.
And immediatly after it, "if I met you"



It doesn't matter. If you want to put your penis in someones butt you are gay. You are gay. Accept it, and stay away from Saudi Arabia.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514499 - 01/08/02 02:58 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

From: Journal of Abnormal Psychology, Vol. 105., No. 3 (1996), pp. 440-445.

Although the causes of homophobia are unclear, several psychoanalytic explanations have emerged from the idea of homophobia as an anxiety-based phenomenon. One psychoanalytic explanation is that anxiety about the possibility of being or becoming a homosexual may be a major factor in homophobia. For example, de Kuyper (1993) has asserted that homophobia is the result of the remnants of homosexuality in the heterosexual resolution of the Oedipal conflict. Whereas these notions are vague, psychoanalytic theories usually postulate that homophobia is a result of repressed homosexual urges or a form of latent homosexuality. Latent homosexuality can be defined as homosexual arousal which the individual is either unaware of or dent. Psychoanalysts use the concept of repressed or latent homosexuality to explain the emotional malaise and irrational attitudes displayed by some individuals who feel guilty about their erotic interests and struggle to deny and repress homosexual impulses. In fact, West stated, 'when placed in a situation that threatens to excite their own unwanted homosexual thoughts, they overreact with panic or anger." Slaby ( 1994 ) contended that anxiety about homosexuality typically does not occur in individuals who are same-sex oriented, but it usually involves individuals who are ostensibly heterosexual and have difficulty integrating their homosexual feelings or activity. The relationship between homophobia and latent homosexuality has not been empirically investigated and is one of the purposes of the present study.

Specifically, the present study was designed to investigate whether homophobic men show more sexual arousal to homosexual cues than nonhomophobic men as suggested by psychoanalytic theory. . . .

The results of this study indicate that individuals who score in the homophobic range and admit negative affect toward homosexuality demonstrate significant sexual arousal to male homosexual erotic stimuli. These individuals were selected on the basis of their report of having only heterosexual arousal and experiences. Furthermore, their ratings of erection and arousal to homosexual stimuli were low and not significantly different from nonhomophobic men who demonstrated no significant increase in penile response to homosexual stimuli. These data are consistent with response discordance where verbal judgments are not consistent with physiological reactivity, as in the case of homophobic individuals viewing homosexual stimuli. Lang (1994 ) has noted that the most dramatic response discordance occurs with reports of feeling and physiologic responses. Another possible explanation is found in various psychoanalytic theories, which have generally explained homophobia as a threat to an individual's own homosexual impulses causing repression, denial, or reaction formation (or all three; West, 1977 ). Generally, these varied explanations conceive of homophobia as one type of latent homosexuality where persons either are unaware of or deny their homosexual urges. These data are consistent with these notions


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514508 - 01/08/02 03:02 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)


Between 1933 and 1945, according to Nazi documents, approximately 100,000 men were arrested for homosexuality. Roughly half were sentenced to prison and approximately 10,000 to 15,000 were incarcerated in concentration camps. The death rate of homosexual prisoners in the camps is estimated to be as high as sixty percent (amongst the highest of non-Jewish prisoners), so that by 1945 only about 4,000 survived. These are complex individuals- often bitter, but just as often filled with irony and humor; haunted by their memories, but determined to survive. Their collective story fills a crucial gap in the historical record and is a testament to human resilience in the face of unconscionable cruelty.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #514521 - 01/08/02 03:13 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

mm. Oh come now. For every article on psychology you find I could find 10 with a contrary opinion. I could dig up studies on homosexuality as a mental illness as well. But I won't get in to the tit for tat unless you keep posting BS like that. BTW, your article is bunk. The reasons for my 'homo-phobia' are clear. They are disgusting abominable diseased AIDs spreading perverts that bring judgement on countries which permit them. That's why I don't approve of them.


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"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: PGF]
    #514525 - 01/08/02 03:16 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

PGF, where did you cut and paste that from? Are you comparing the legitamate executions of Saudi criminals to the holocaust? That's not a legitamate comparison.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514527 - 01/08/02 03:19 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

I posted that article because you started to turn this thread into a pathetic childish argument about the sexuality of individual posters. Maybe you would answer my above question now: how does it adversely affect society
.
.
.
Do you so wanna chop their heads off?


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Edited by mm. (01/09/02 12:55 PM)

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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #514544 - 01/08/02 03:30 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Rail_Gun, you have the right to your opinion but if I do say so myself, YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT.  :wink: You say the only drugs you get are from a pharmacy.  You know how many more people die from legal drugs than illegal drugs every year?  Too many to count.  Just think about how many people in Saudi that make the rules break them everyday and you will see why everyone is on your ass.


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Invisibleisis
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #515241 - 01/09/02 08:47 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Homophobic hate leads to violence. I know if you had your way, you would have all of us killed for our perverted ways. You would have our heads chopped off. You rejoice in the murdering of these three men. That is what it was. They were murdered.You call yourself a man of God. I hope you don't wonder why some gay people are afraid of stepping into a church. It is because of homophobic hateful jerks like. You want my head cut off, and somehow that is suppose to minister the love of God to me. Yet, I don't hear you spewing your hate at any of the other sins. I don't hear you calling for the beheading of a man who cheats on his wive. Should we behead those that have sex outside of marrige. Let's just cut all our heads off.
I was never hateful like you, but I was a judgemental Christian. I was wrong, and so are you.Now I belong to the group of people you judge and hate. It has been a humbling experience to be on the other side.
Unfortunately,you are not alone.Thank God you are in the minority or I would fear for my life everyday. You may say you don't hate gays,but your posts paint another story.
I don't share you beliefs and I don't share your hate towards any group of people. For this, Iam most thankful. You are a frightening person. If you mirror your God, then I want no part of him for he seems an ugly creature. That is the message you are sending. Fortuanatelly I know better. The type of homophobia you express over and over again leads to violence against gay people and to the murder of innocent victims. Homophobia lead to the murder of Mathew Sheppard. If a man hits on me, Iam flattered. I don't go and beat him to death for doing so. I say thanks. Just simply Thanks.


Edited by isis (01/09/02 07:24 PM)

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InvisibleCaptain Jack
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #515418 - 01/09/02 12:57 PM (22 years, 5 months ago)

I still want Rail Gun to address this:

"How does consenting sex in private between two people of the same sex adversely affect society to the extent that it warrants capital punishment? Try leaving aside your personal religious views on the matter for moment, which in any case should not affect how society deals with a 'crime' "


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: isis]
    #518105 - 01/12/02 02:02 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

as a side note i am all for lesbians...they are sooooo interesting...why is that?..really i want to know


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Captain Jack]
    #518107 - 01/12/02 02:07 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

****How does consenting sex in private between two people of the same sex adversely affect society****

if it affects society adversely is up to the individual and is really not a topic that can be debated..if one finds it sick and the other not..who's right?

****....to the extent that it warrants capital punishment? *****

it shouldn't..this should be reserved for rapists and murderers

****Try leaving aside your personal religious views on the matter for moment****

i'm not really a religous person but i think homo's have a right to do what they do and be left alone as long as i'm not being forced to accept it...it's all good.

****which in any case should not affect how society deals with a 'crime' ****

that's you opinion and you have a right to it. many crimes are based on a religious belief...murder is just one of them, afdultry is another. One person's crime is anothers night out.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Innvertigo]
    #518232 - 01/12/02 05:38 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

LOL. I think it is because the image of two beautiful women together is sexy as hell. It is easier for us to accept two woman being intimate. Even as friends woman are allowed to hold hands,hug, touch,caress.

Edited by isis (01/12/02 05:19 PM)

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Religion and murder [Re: Innvertigo]
    #518428 - 01/12/02 11:36 AM (22 years, 5 months ago)

Innvertigo writes:

"many crimes are based on a religious belief...murder is just one of them, afdultry is another"

The two are completely different. You are quite correct to say that adultery's dassification as a criminal act is entirely due to subjective societal mores or religious beliefs.

But murder is OBJECTIVELY a criminal act. Even atheists consider murder a crime: murder was a crime in the officially atheist Soviet Union. As a matter of fact, there has been no society in recorded history for whom murder was not treated as a criminal matter. The same is true of theft.

pinky




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OfflineElPrimo
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Re: Religion and murder [Re: Phred]
    #554830 - 02/17/02 09:49 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

15 of the 19 hijackers on 9/11 were from Saudi Arabia. But you won't hear much of anything about that. we have a puppet dictatorship we support there so we can get cheap oil. We support these dictatorships all over the world so we can exploit native populations for cheap bannanas, textiles and other items. Saudi Arabia is one of the strictist regimes in the world. Not too much different from the Taliban.

The US doesn't believe in helping Democracy around the world. That's a propaganda sham. And after the last election here, it's apparent the US doesn't really care about counting the votes in America either.

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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: PGF]
    #561612 - 02/24/02 02:13 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

Sex not a right except in marriage? where in the new testament does it say homosexuality is wrong,a sin, or anything else? People that cry scream and beat the bible cover the most are usually the ones that dont have a clue whats in there. As for Saudi Arabia just another example of what happens when religon controls government.

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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: thenetherworld]
    #561634 - 02/24/02 02:44 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

In reply to:

where in the new testament does it say homosexuality is wrong,a sin, or anything else?



Romans 1:18-32, I Corinthians 6:9-11, I Timothy 1:10, and Jude 7.

And for your OT references see Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13, Genesis 19

Homosexual sex is a sin and no one that is an active homosexual will enter heaven:

1 Corinthians 6:9-11:
9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

I hope this clarifies things for you. Take care.


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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #561662 - 02/24/02 03:32 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

Oh yeah a quote from a book of complete fiction and fairy tales that screws the entire world every single time it gets the chance. But how could lil ole me contradict a book as hypocritical as the bible. Judge not, but all it does is lead its blind followers to judge, turn the other cheek induces attack after attack after attack, I think jesus was gay, thats why he always liked the "guys". I also believe jesus was just another guy looking for glory and followers, look what a cult he inspired. Everything else people use dailey, teach in school, or anything else has to be proven and backed up, mmmmmmmmmm, wonder what would happen to christianity if society did that to their myths?

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Offlinethenetherworld
journeyman
Registered: 02/05/02
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Re: Religion and murder [Re: Phred]
    #561665 - 02/24/02 03:34 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

ON the issue of adultery, well originally it was a crime against ownership. Meaning it was punishable because women dont have many rights in religous societies.

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OfflineJammer
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Registered: 11/04/00
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Re: Religion and murder [Re: thenetherworld]
    #562067 - 02/25/02 12:06 AM (22 years, 3 months ago)

All I can say is:

LONG LIVE LESBIAN PORN STARS!!


--------------------
>>Jammer>>

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Offlinenugsarenice
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Re: Religion and murder [Re: Jammer]
    #562467 - 02/25/02 11:06 AM (22 years, 3 months ago)

These laws on sodomy in Saudi Arabia probably exist for the same reason that we have laws on the books in the u.s. about similar issues. The laws such as oral sex, and anal sex, are both illegal. So my view on this happening is that the ruling government, which is highly controversial right now, with the huge uprising of religious groups which are not sympathetic to u.s. war interests, this government decided to assasinate persons with propaganda backing claims that can still instill hate in people. These laws in the u.s. might be enforced one day as well. Let's say I was going to sell secrets to the chinese government, and everyone knew it, then the government would set up a propanganda and framing campaign, so intricate to be compared to a shakespeare novel, this campaign would have put me in jail for getting oral sex, leaving me unfree to sell secrets.
If these laws are not important, or ever were not important, why do they exist?
Who here does not or ever has not recieved oral sex?

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OfflineCoolMojo
Imagination iswhat you make ofit
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Re: Religion and murder [Re: nugsarenice]
    #562485 - 02/25/02 11:28 AM (22 years, 3 months ago)

First of all there is nothing wrong with being homophobic. EVERYONE!!!! is entitled to heir opinion, so if Rail gun wants to hate homosexuals that is HIS human right. Asuming he isn't running around beating people for their sexual practices ofcourse.
Not that I agree with him, in fact as I see it its none of my god damn business what somebody is doing to get off aslong as it doesn't violate anothers humans rights as in the case of rape or child molestation. I don't see a problem with the execution if by seducing young men it means these guys where raping 12 year old boys. That is a violation of THEIR rights and its my opinion people sick enough to hurt children deserve severe punishment. Thats my opinion and I'm entitled to it.
As for drug laws in saudi, it would surprise a few of y ou too know that for posesion or drug use the laws are very kind. The prevailing view on drug use in saudi is that drug users are just victims of the horible drug trafficers. So importing 30 pounds of hash will get you beheaded, getting busted with a few grams of hash oil will get you diddly. They rely on the "shame" of being a drug user to "set people straight" instead of a big jail sentance. In some ways its better (for drug users of any kind) Then in the U.K., U.S, or Canada. Personally I don't like the drug pushers, but have a great respect for drug cutivators who do it for the experience and not the profit. A small nit picking difference to some I know but I see it as a much larger distinction.

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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: thenetherworld]
    #562514 - 02/25/02 11:54 AM (22 years, 3 months ago)

thenetherworld, if you didn't want to know the scriptures about homos then why did you ask for them? I don't go out of my way to thump the bible but if I'm asked I can thump pretty good. And you asked. And you infered that the new testament didn't condemn homos. Well you asked and it does so I told you. If you don't want to know these things then don't ask anymore. And I think it's pretty lame to say that where does it say this or that and then when someone shows you to attack the item you asked about.

Later man.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

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Offlinemm.
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Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #562543 - 02/25/02 12:23 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

Rail_Gun - in Corinthians 6:9-11 it also lists drunkards along with homosexuals. If you are using that passage to justify your view that it is right to behead gay people, do you think it is also right to behead drunk people? ok it might be a 'sin' in God's eyes, but nowhere in the New Testemant does it say that homosexuals should be put to death. Jesus would certainly not have advocated such a thing. The Old Testament laws of Leviticus applied only to the 'children of Israel', not the Philistines or the Hitites or Amorites or anyone else and are not relevant to modern life as these tribes no longer exist.

It's not your dislike of homosexuals I have a problem with - that's your perogative as long as you dont impose it on others by advocating they should be executed.


--------------------
MAPS.org: supporting psychedelic and medical marijuana research since 1986

Edited by mm. (02/25/02 12:28 PM)

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Offlinethenetherworld
journeyman
Registered: 02/05/02
Posts: 67
Last seen: 19 years, 4 months
Re: Saudi Arabia beheads 3 men for sodomy [Re: mm.]
    #563159 - 02/25/02 11:00 PM (22 years, 3 months ago)

I just thought it was funny that the language in the verses you quoted dont sound like the writing in the bible I read, but then the bible is interpreted and written for the purposes of whoever is doing it this generation isnt it?

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