Home | Community | Message Board

MycologyNow.com Spores
Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate, Cultivation Supplies, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Edibles   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5  [ show all ]
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works
    #5137844 - 01/04/06 09:58 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I noticed after reading a few reviews on Amazon and some replies by shroomerites that many consider the Don Juan series nothing more than well-written fiction. Considering Castaneda was completely inaccessible by the media, however, there's almost no chance of proving or disproving his 'tales of power'. The argument is that he portrays himself a little too dense, and often goes back in time in several books to write about the experiences he didnt mention in the predescending series. Looking at that argument as a whole, however, it makes it look quite illogical and silly. The simplicity of the author only pushes Don Juan to break down his vague teachings into more understandeable clusters, and who doesnt always forget a tangent of an event when they're telling a story?

I know he's got some followers here, so what are your views on the authenticity? Truth or Fiction?



--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 30,827
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5137953 - 01/04/06 11:10 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

sometimes I prefer dr. strange, or lobsang rampa's cat; but The Frank Book is most sublime.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5137970 - 01/04/06 11:16 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

My view is this issue is beside the point and so is of no importance whatsoever.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5138124 - 01/04/06 12:33 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

It's for real.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSilentSeed
Soul Surfer

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 117
Loc: Kanata
Last seen: 15 years, 8 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5138130 - 01/04/06 12:35 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Personally, I dont really care. I feel its what you get from reading his works, and how you weave them into your own life. I think thats the most important part.


--------------------
You're unique. Just like everyone else.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 30,827
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5138132 - 01/04/06 12:37 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I agree, precisely.

as if when one takes a step in magic they need to flip out a detective's badge or show their diploma.

our heroes have been trapped in TV land - which of course drains directly into Ixtlan.

even Entertainment Tonight is just fliers and allys but one needs to breathe through that morass of tune and flash to make progress beyond the couch potato stage.

like the temptation of st. anthony.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineAkira
CosmicConsciousness
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/30/05
Posts: 2,283
Loc: Hay Un Mundo Mas Alla
Last seen: 8 years, 11 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5138285 - 01/04/06 01:19 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

If i ever had the chance to live the lucid dream that Tom Cruz did in Vanilla Sky, I would choose to put myself in Castanedas shoes and walk the endless journey to the other side with Don Juan Matus.

And I agree with all of the above. As with the story of Buddha, it does not matter if any of the historical tales are true, what matters are the lessons to be learned.


--------------------

Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5138479 - 01/04/06 02:13 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

however, there's almost no chance of proving or disproving his 'tales of power'.

False. Do more research.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: SilentSeed]
    #5138499 - 01/04/06 02:17 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Personally, I dont really care. I feel its what you get from reading his works, and how you weave them into your own life. I think thats the most important part.

Exactly! So what my cliff-jumping experience didn't go so well and I cracked my luminous egg?

Excuse me, gotta take my wheelchair in for annual maintenance. Back shortly. No wait, first I have to visit my buddy in the sanitorium after he experimented with datura...


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5138591 - 01/04/06 02:38 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Jeesh Swami, You been beating this dead horse every since I've known you. Can you get over the parts that are story/fiction and deal with some of the philosophy in the books.

Here's some quotes for you. Find some to pick apart and we can discuss them. You might have a lot more trouble with these.

http://www.thinkarete.com/quotes/by_teacher/carlos_castaneda


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 30,827
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5138747 - 01/04/06 03:12 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

if you cracked your egg let's make breakfast


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5138752 - 01/04/06 03:12 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

This thread is different. It is about Cantaneda, the singer...  :grin:

Also this was about THE AUTHENTICITY of the works and not a discussion of those interesting quotes you referenced, was it not?

You keep beating the dead horse about me beating the dead horse (and so on). BTW, why does it bother you what I post? Let's examine that? There is some REAL learning to be had.



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (01/04/06 03:23 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5138788 - 01/04/06 03:21 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Start another thread. :evildog:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5138803 - 01/04/06 03:25 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Also this was about THE AUTHENTICITY of the works and not a discussion of those interesting quotes you referenced, was it not?

You are correct. My bad.  :frown:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5138828 - 01/04/06 03:33 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

That's OK. I didn't report you for your blatant off-topic post.  :laugh:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5138832 - 01/04/06 03:34 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I turned myself in knowing full well the mods would never respond. :wink:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5138897 - 01/04/06 03:51 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Touche! :rofl2:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139340 - 01/04/06 05:41 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

You can only take a lie so far. Write 10 books about it, and eventually the truth comes out. Im not out there to prove his works fiction or truth, and after googling a few articles, the arguments questioning the authenticity seem petty and baseless (such as Castaneda being 'too dense').

Also, Castaneda wasnt just a con artist trying to scam people out by playing with their beliefs - he lived what he wrote about till the ripe age of 72. That'd be one long trick to play on people, huh?  :wink:


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5139374 - 01/04/06 05:49 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
My view is this issue is beside the point and so is of no importance whatsoever.




I like this view as well :thumbup:


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139377 - 01/04/06 05:49 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

the arguments seem petty and baseless (such as Castaneda being 'too dense').
That is not what I am talking about. There are major timeline discrepancies wherein he claimed to be in the Sonoran Desert when he was actually in LA. (Please - no bi-location excuse!) There are anthropological claims that go against all other sources and nonsensical claims such as the smoking of mushrooms.

Also, Castaneda wasnt just a con artist trying to scam people out by playing with their beliefs
And you know this how - because he lived a normal life span? Are con-artists supposed to die younger?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139457 - 01/04/06 06:09 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
the arguments seem petty and baseless (such as Castaneda being 'too dense').
That is not what I am talking about. There are major timeline discrepancies wherein he claimed to be in the Sonoran Desert when he was actually in LA. (Please - no bi-location excuse!)





Whenever Carlos visited Don Juan, he always found him, whether he went to his house in the Sierras, or the one of his benefactor in Central Mexico. Don Juan was using his 'double' to be at two locations. Why cant I use this cause, with the grounds of the book it seems perfectly natural.

Quote:


There are anthropological claims that go against all other sources and nonsensical claims such as the smoking of mushrooms.





It says nowhere in the book that those were psilocybin mushrooms, thus the heat properties of the chemical are irrelevant. And if they were, he had a special way of smoking them, he didnt apply heat directly.

Quote:


And you know this how - because he lived a normal life span? Are con-artists supposed to die younger?




No, not at all what Im saying. Im talking about his biography, he lived the impeccable lifestyle of a Toltec warrior until his very death. It's pretty hard to keep up a single act for 72 years.

Have you ever read any of the books in full? There's so much timeless wisdom in them, and your assumption is that this is just Castaneda's train of thought taken to paper hoping to make for a quick buck?

Is you argument that Don Juan never existed, or simply that some events were a little exxagerated?

Have you ever messed up a location or timeline of an event when you're telling a story?


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139474 - 01/04/06 06:13 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Why cant I use this cause, with the grounds of the book it seems perfectly natural.
So Carlos could already bilocate before he even knew what it was? Try some logic.

It says nowhere in the book that those were psilocybin mushrooms
And where in my post did you hallucinate that?

he lived the impeccable lifestyle of a Toltec warrior until his very death.
Disregarding the fact that a Yaqui is not a Toltec, once again - how do YOU know this?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139486 - 01/04/06 06:16 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Have you ever messed up a location or timeline of an event when you're telling a story?

Not when keeping a daily journal. Are you saying he was a good novelist or a very sloppy anthroplogist?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139506 - 01/04/06 06:21 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

and your assumption is that this is just Castaneda's train of thought taken to paper hoping to make for a quick buck

Seems you have learned little from them the way your emotions run rampant. I made no comment as to the why of the books, now did I? Did you attend the Castaneda School of Fabrication?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139541 - 01/04/06 06:31 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Why cant I use this cause, with the grounds of the book it seems perfectly natural.
So Carlos could already bilocate before he even knew what it was? Try some logic.




He was told about the double in the third book, I believe, out of his 10. Does it say that he contradicted locations in his first or second issue?

Quote:


It says nowhere in the book that those were psilocybin mushrooms
And where in my post did you hallucinate that?




>>

Quote:

nonsensical claims such as the smoking of mushrooms.




If it wasnt to the psilocybin heat temperature you were referring to then, what are you talking about?

Quote:


he lived the impeccable lifestyle of a Toltec warrior until his very death.
Disregarding the fact that a Yaqui is not a Toltec, once again - how do YOU know this?




I am making an observation based on the short interviews that he had had, the way he spoke, the way he forbid audio and video equipment to not keep himself stagnant, and so forth. No one can really know a man, Im making a decision on his character based on multiple views on the person.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139571 - 01/04/06 06:39 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
and your assumption is that this is just Castaneda's train of thought taken to paper hoping to make for a quick buck

Seems you have learned little from them the way your emotions run rampant.




Low blow! Although I dont see how I lashed out at you from that comment.

Quote:


I made no comment as to the why of the books, now did I?




I'll take that one back, looking over your post, you didnt say it. I mustve made a mental association with another reading.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139609 - 01/04/06 06:49 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Several imaginings and false assumptions unveil a wandering mind. Do YOU follow the teachings of impeccability or just like to be entertained by the books? Knowledge not absorbed is not knowledge.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139633 - 01/04/06 06:56 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I have found it a lifetime of effort to live by the teachings of Don Juan and others. I have failed to perfect it to any major degree. I have been grateful however for all the little gains I have made. It has improved my experience of life somewhat. :wink:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisiblemecreateme
YoUisMEEMsiUoY
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/13/04
Posts: 2,727
Loc: Memphrica
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139647 - 01/04/06 07:00 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

nonsensical claims such as the smoking of mushrooms.




So what did you mean? :smirk:


--------------------
No ONE wants to know the ultimate TRUTH, as soon as YOU find IT out, YOU want to forget IT.

You are everything's way of feeling itself.

Happy Schwag, everygodly!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleI_was_the_walrus
eggshells
 User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 05/01/02
Posts: 11,883
Loc: next door
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139656 - 01/04/06 07:02 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

as if when one takes a step in magic they need to flip out a detective's badge or show their diploma.





Im gonna have to go with this one on the discussion. So maybe things happened, maybe things didnt happen. Its all going in circles, and I think its become a personal battle over you two as to who is right...who is going to reign supreme in some pointless battle. You both have good points, but none of you are 100% correct.

Its about the idea of the book.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5139681 - 01/04/06 07:12 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Have you, or anyone else here for that matter seen this?

Enigma of a Sorceror : The Carlos Castaneda Movie

And if you have, would you suggest it?


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139690 - 01/04/06 07:15 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Several imaginings and false assumptions unveil a wandering mind. Do YOU follow the teachings of impeccability or just like to be entertained by the books? Knowledge not absorbed is not knowledge.




Since when was this thread about me, or what I follow?

I am indeed a wandering mind, I never fully accept what I read or hear, no matter how powerful it is. Nothing is 100%, nothing is pure.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5139774 - 01/04/06 07:37 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I have found it a lifetime of effort to live by the teachings of Don Juan
I aspire to be a con-man as well.  :crazy:

I have been grateful however for all the little gains I have made.
Fine, but there are no degrees of bi-location. Progress is impossible in certain arenas; either one can or cannot perform such a feat.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139820 - 01/04/06 07:44 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
I made no comment as to the why of the books, now did I?




Quote:

I aspire to be a con-man as well.




...And you just did.

50 years (considering he started his apprecentiship at 20 something) of fooling people is quite a feat for a con-man, especially with no partners in crime!  :frown:


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflinePhluck
Carpal Tunnel
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/11/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 months, 26 days
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5139906 - 01/04/06 08:01 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

It's not difficult to get people to believe something... and people doubted him for a long time, he certainly didn't fool people forever.

He's a very popular character, people who like his books and want to believe will believe no matter how unlikely it is to be true.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5139919 - 01/04/06 08:04 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

"Do YOU follow the teachings of impeccability or just like to be entertained by the books? Knowledge not absorbed is not knowledge."

That is an excellent statement that embodies how I feel about these works. As a young man I read them for entertainment...as a 25 - 30 something I read them for knowledge and meaning, and I was inspired and influenced beyond what words can say. It pushed me away from a direction that was leading quickly to my death, and inspired me to seek life. I DO know fiction when I read it, and these books I would happily declare fiction...just as I would happily declare the Christian Bible fiction...or The Eldar Edda fiction. That does not mean that these texts do not contain valid teachings. The ideal of the dynamic, impeccable warrior who takes only what is necessary and pressures his world little is a guiding vision to me.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: redgreenvines]
    #5139927 - 01/04/06 08:06 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

"as if when one takes a step in magic they need to flip out a detective's badge or show their diploma."

No diploma or badge? What about a secret decoder ring? I got one when I joined the Carlos Castaneda fan club.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5139935 - 01/04/06 08:09 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

That's all that is important. It's no surprise that folks want to be distracted from that part. If you are challenged by something in these books it's much easier to forget it if you can find a way to discredit the author. Then you can go on your merry way. But for those who took the challenge to any degree, weather they were "real" or fiction was not important.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Phluck]
    #5139936 - 01/04/06 08:09 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Im sorry, but that sounds like a blanket statement. It's an ageless fact that many can play upon's people beliefs and fantasies to create a following, but how can one conjur so much knowledge with so much detail out of thin air? Imagination only goes so far my friend...


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5139955 - 01/04/06 08:12 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Correct. No one has ever defined philosophy as hard boiled fact.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflinePhluck
Carpal Tunnel
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/11/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 months, 26 days
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5140345 - 01/04/06 09:24 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

How are you sure that the knowledge is so deep and valid that it couldn't be thrown together with his imagination?

If it's as deep as you claim it is, would it not require a lifetime or more to validate, to see if it's as wonderful as all that?

Yet you are able to know that this knowledge is powerful and valid, simply by reading a few books?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Phluck]
    #5140364 - 01/04/06 09:31 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I know the knowledge is valid because I have tested it out in my life.

Still his books are not the only place to come across this information. The style in which he wrote it captured my imagination when I was quite young and gave me a direction I was willing to work with. Other than that his books have no special value to me.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Phluck]
    #5140410 - 01/04/06 09:44 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Ah, I wish it was as simple. The awesomeness of Castaneda's work is not just my opinion, however, it is the general consensus of generations of readers. CC was as big of an idol in the cultural movement of the 60s as Leary or Kesey - he's no new age hack.

He wrote 10 books on the subject! Surely if he was working with his subconsious alone, he wouldntve been able to write over 3000 pages worth of info.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5140466 - 01/04/06 09:59 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I hate to be a "me too" guy, but here it is: Me too! In my opinion the acid test of validity is "does a work contain practical ideas?". I have proven to myself time and again that these works do.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5140505 - 01/04/06 10:08 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

"CC was as big of an idol in the cultural movement of the 60s as Leary or Kesey"

To ascribe Castaneda this importance...to idolize him...goes against everything his writings promote. I understand the spirit in which you said this, but know that "Castaneda" maintained near complete anonymity until his death. Many people do not realize that Carlos Castaneda was an invented name. There is some dispute over what his previous history was before migrating to the U.S. No one related to him in South America has ever been definitively located or interviewed. I maintain that Carlos Castaneda was just as fictional as Don Juan...or just as real maybe. He maintained his lack of personal history to the grave.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140510 - 01/04/06 10:08 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I too have read his books as a young man and was greatly inpired and enlightened by the reading. I also put many things into practice that were in the book as well as things that were in Victor Sanchez' book(sp)The Teachings of Don Carlos...there was also a book called something like, "Toltek Warriors" where another guy claimed to have also been taught by Don Juan. I read that book and felt that it was spot on.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140515 - 01/04/06 10:10 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

That's pretty strange in itself.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5140522 - 01/04/06 10:12 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Not at all. It just shows he lived this philosophy.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140537 - 01/04/06 10:16 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
?Personal history must be constantly renewed by telling parents, relatives, and friends everything one does. On the other hand, for the warrior who has no personal history, no explanations are needed; nobody is angry or disillusioned with his acts. And above all, no one pins him down with their thoughts and their expectations.?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140548 - 01/04/06 10:17 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
"CC was as big of an idol in the cultural movement of the 60s as Leary or Kesey"

To ascribe Castaneda this importance...to idolize him...goes against everything his writings promote. I understand the spirit in which you said this, but know that "Castaneda" maintained near complete anonymity until his death. Many people do not realize that Carlos Castaneda was an invented name. There is some dispute over what his previous history was before migrating to the U.S. No one related to him in South America has ever been definitively located or interviewed. I maintain that Carlos Castaneda was just as fictional as Don Juan...or just as real maybe. He maintained his lack of personal history to the grave.




Just because he is an idol doesnt mean I, in particular, idolize him. He was a very powerful figure in introducing the concept of shamanism to the western world. The reason I said this was to undermine personal opinion of personal bias of the books' power or infuence that Phluck perceived I was implying.

And CC wasnt his real name? Not what wikipedia thinks:

Quote:

Carlos Castaneda (previously Casta?eda) was born in Peru on December 25, 1925 and died in Los Angeles on April 27, 1998. He wrote that he was born in S?o Paulo, Brazil on Christmas Day in 1931, but immigration records show that he was born 6 years earlier in Cajamarca, Peru. He anglicized his name by changing the "?" (in Casta?eda) into "n".




I suppose it doesnt make much difference though.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5140633 - 01/04/06 10:31 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

But for those who took the challenge to any degree, weather they were "real" or fiction was not important.

Is not the integrity of a Warrior of utmost importance? If the author declares fiction as fact, then he certainly is not following the Way. Words coming from a fraud may have value, but carry little weight.

I am not the best racquetball player around (though pretty damn good), but I easily sign up students because they can see what I do, I am honest about my ability, and embody the principles that I teach.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflinePhluck
Carpal Tunnel
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/11/99
Posts: 11,394
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 months, 26 days
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5140663 - 01/04/06 10:40 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Ah, I wish it was as simple. The awesomeness of Castaneda's work is not just my opinion, however, it is the general consensus of generations of readers. CC was as big of an idol in the cultural movement of the 60s as Leary or Kesey - he's no new age hack.

He wrote 10 books on the subject! Surely if he was working with his subconsious alone, he wouldntve been able to write over 3000 pages worth of info.


Miss Read has had many fans over generations as well, and she wrote what? 50 novels?

How many books did Isaac Asimov write? Like 200?

Just writing a lot and having lots of fans doesn't mean you've tapped into a deep truth, it means you've written in a compelling way, and you enjoy writing.

Lots of people have written WAY more than he did, simply writing huge amounts doesn't mean you're using something beyond your imagination.

Just because something feels like it's right, doesn't mean it is. It just means it feels like its right.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5140665 - 01/04/06 10:40 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

His real name was Ceasar Aranna. The Wikipedia entry has changed recently as it reflected this as recently as 6 months ago....remember personal history? This is totally in keeping with what I said. If he had NO personal history why would it be in Wikipedia? An entry has been made in his favor recently apparently. Do some research and you will find I speak truth. Start with the books that have been written about Castaneda while he was alive...start with DeMille who hated Castaneda.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140684 - 01/04/06 10:44 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

"Living with a foster family he next studied parapsychology at Los Angeles City College from 1955 to 1959. Also in 1959 he became an American citizen and that is when he took the name Castaneda."

"In contrast Castaneda claimed that he was born at S?o Paulo, Brazil, into a well-known family of Italian descent which was not true. He claimed to his wife that he had been born on "Christmas day" in Italy, and that his mother had finished school in "Switzerland." Instead his mother as Times Magazine team found out, was raised in Lima just like his father."

This is more accurate, but has flaws it credits his father with the name Ceasar...from this:
http://sociologyesoscience.com/esoterica/castan.html


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140686 - 01/04/06 10:44 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

LIke Icey said, the three of us (and others) have only had this conversation a dozen times now. This is only possible because we have erased the personal history of the other 11 times. :lol:


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5140697 - 01/04/06 10:46 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I agree in it's futility.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5140714 - 01/04/06 10:50 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I can get away with it because I claim no special shamanic philosophy, but Don Juan would frown on you and the Iceman frivolously wasting time in such an anti-warriorlike manner. You must go back and reread the part about death stalking us.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5140721 - 01/04/06 10:51 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I agree...I am contributing to the conspiracy of the immortals...


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5140731 - 01/04/06 10:53 PM (16 years, 20 days ago)

If I was held accountable for living the perfect warrior life, I would have to throw myself on the mercy of the court.

As I have stated before It's a life time journey and I am still a beginner.  :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleMushmanTheManic
Stranger

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 4,587
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5141391 - 01/05/06 01:02 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

I am Ceasar Aranna.
The brujo I referred to as Don Juan Matus is real!
He is currently standing on his head in the Gobi desert while running for president.
You can contact him at (815) 443-2350
(You may need to buy a calling card.)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5142192 - 01/05/06 06:55 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

LIke Icey said, the three of us (and others) have only had this conversation a dozen times now. This is only possible because we have erased the personal history of the other 11 times.




LOL


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinea_h_w
Stranger
Registered: 10/13/04
Posts: 236
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5142206 - 01/05/06 07:23 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

just a comment on smoking shrooms. castaneda was in contact with gordon wasson, allegedly the only person ever allowed to see the original notes from which the books were written. wasson never claimed castaneda's work to be a fraud, and castaneda himself suggests that the shrooms were only partially smoked. and yes he suspects them to be psilocybe shrooms, but because of being ground to a very fine powder which lay at the bottom of the smoking mixture, most of the shrooms would be actually ingested and not smoked. it's all in the books...


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Invisibleredgreenvines
irregular verb
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 30,827
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5142238 - 01/05/06 08:37 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

The Matrix was Bill and Ted's Impeccable Adventure?


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: a_h_w]
    #5142332 - 01/05/06 10:23 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

most of the shrooms would be actually ingested and not smoked

Um, no. I want you to put whatever mixture you choose in a pipe and inhale while directing some contents to your lungs and some to your stomach. Make me a believer.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #5142413 - 01/05/06 10:58 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

You always seem to have something important to add to the conversation.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineHeffy
BrauMeister
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3,262
Loc: International Traveller
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5142649 - 01/05/06 12:24 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

He clearly states in the book (not an exact quote) that to the best of his knowledge the mushrooms were from the "genus psilocybe" most likely "psilocybe mexicana".


--------------------
I am the king of Rome, and above grammar! - Emperor Sigismund


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5142676 - 01/05/06 12:34 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

most of the shrooms would be actually ingested and not smoked



True. It's in the books. My recollection also remembers him having to let it dry for at least a year, and was mixed with other flowers/plants.
Also realize that the English language, and most others at that, are all very limited at being able to describe things that fall outside the framework of ordinary human society.
Don Juan was utilizing the predestined relationship arranged by the higher powers that be. Don Juan found his disciples just like in the Taoist cultivation practice tradition. The master seeks a disciple. Don Juan "seek-ed" or "found" his disciples (Like Carlos in the Arizona bus station). Carlos Castaneda, Broken Eagle Feather(author of the Toltec Warrior book I mentioned) The other disciples mentioned in the Castaneda books, etc. Don Juan imparted his knowledge just as other Enlightened being did/do and Carlos was predestined to write about his experiences as a "bridge of knowledge" to the western world.

This was all arranged countless ages ago.

Heres some info that seems applicable.
AMAZON.COM-
Having lived among Mesoamerican Indians for 15 years, the anthropologist Victor Sanchez informs his readers that Toltecs do not believe in their gods but perceive them directly. Sanchez identifies these natives as living descendants of the famous Toltec sages of Pre-Columbian times and, noting that their "separate reality" cannot be understood unless directly experienced, he takes us into their world, introducing their rituals and beliefs, which, incredibly, seem to substantiate much of Carlos Castaneda's depiction of Indian spirituality. In their profound communion with nature, the living Toltecs have much to teach the urban spiritual warrior.

From Publishers Weekly
In the vein of the Don Juan classics by Carlos Castaneda, Sanchez's book is a compelling spiritual autobiography. In 1986 anthropologist Sanchez went to Mexico to study the social customs of the Wirrarika tribe; his visit became an astonishing encounter with the alteration in reality that the non-European system of belief manifests. Yet, it is also an anti-anthropology text, as the author asserts that classical academic anthropology's theoretical framework had little to offer him when his encounter with the Indian system of belief became spiritual pilgrimage. Sanchez frees himself from what he calls the "neurotic fantasies" of academic mindsets and learns to explore the alternative universe underlying our interpersonal relationships and our everyday world. Sanchez's examination of the ways that psychoactive substances like LSD and peyote generate religious states of consciousness, as well as his exploration of the religious traditions and practices of the Toltecs and Aztecs, make his work valuable religious research. This is an interesting read and a revealing examination of a sacred terrain.
Copyright 1996 Reed Business Information, Inc.

Editorial Reviews
From AudioFile
In this ambitious work, Victor Sanchez distills many of the teachings and practical applications contained in Carlos Castaneda's first eight books. THE TEACHINGS assumes a listener's familiarity with the lexicon of Castaneda's world, and the vocabulary can be initially overwhelming. The exercises though are infinitely practical and are explained clearly. Some of the techniques presented include: "not doing," experiencing the body as an energy field, the magic of attention and intention, the power of silence, and working with dreams. Woven throughout the audio is the imperative to honor and reconnect with the beauty of the natural world. Michael Toms, host of the popular "New Dimensions Radio," is a superb narrator. C.S. ? AudioFile 2000, Portland, Maine-- Copyright ? AudioFile, Portland, Maine--This text refers to the Audio Cassette edition.

Midwest Book Review
Familiarize yourself with the spiritual transformative teachings of Don Carlos of the Castaneda shaman fame; then use this to provide practical applications of his philosophy to everyday life. Chapters present segments of his ideas and blend in exercises and applications to everyday life.


Edited by Cubenisseur (01/05/06 12:44 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5142714 - 01/05/06 12:43 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

A Toltec Path - A Users Guide to the teachings of don Juan Matus, Carlos Castaneda, and other Toltec Seers.

"The basis of this book is the exploration of Castaneda's books and verification of their teachings through personal experience...It is noe my intention to present the definitive statement about the Toltec Way...nor do I consider this a substitute for Castaneda's work. There is simply no replacing the accounts of his interaction with Don Juan.
"What I have tried to do is distill Castaneda's work in order to present features of the Toltec Way that most anyone traveling it crosses. Just as Castaneda's work is influenced by his personality, this distillation is based on my experience, interests, and goals. One goal is providing sufficient context so that you don't lose you bearings, or can quickly reclaim them, if you travel past the boundry markers of your reality-in essence, keeping your pouch of perception open to the mysteries of self and world."
-Ken Eagle Feather


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5144160 - 01/05/06 08:10 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

You are correct about inhalation/ingestion being an improbable ingestion technique. For the record, Gordon Wasson contacted Castaneda and inquired as to the species of mushroom involved. Castaneda told him Psilocybe Mexicana. This method of ingestion would not provide a hallucinogenic experience with a psilocybe. This was an error on Castanedas part. It is hard to imagine that in the 60s Castaneda had not had at least a casual mushroom experience. I think that all of the drug references were merely a hook to entice young counter-culture readers. He dispensed with it altogether after the third book. His peyote experiences, it is worth noting, had an element of authenticity.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5144178 - 01/05/06 08:17 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

His peyote experiences, it is worth noting, had an element of authenticity.

I never turned into a crow, but did become an ass once.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5144180 - 01/05/06 08:17 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

When Castaneda presented these ideas it was original. Ken Eagle Feather (a white man not an Indian...check the pseudonym) just regurgitated Castaneda's work while refusing to give homage to his influence. The idea that Don Juan taught this guy is remote since Don Juan was most likely created from an amalgamation of shamen that Castaneda had met...a work of Castaneda's imagination. Eagle Feather brought nothing new to the table. I did enjoy Sanchez' analysis of Castaneda's work, though. Miguel Ruiz presented some original material in this vein, and is a competant writer as well.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5144186 - 01/05/06 08:19 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

I like Ruiz' works very much, too.  :thumbup:

His chapter on treating your partner the way you treat your dog was especially on-target.  :grin:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5144187 - 01/05/06 08:20 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

He did not turn into anything while on peyote. Your memory is rusty...that was "mushrooms"...and it wasn't a crow, but a sparrow or some shit. Read "A Separate Reality" and you will get a precise description of a native ceremony overseen by a "Road Man".


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5144391 - 01/05/06 09:17 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Part of my point on the mushroom thing was that if he dried them out for a year in some gourd(I would think that the potency would decrease/chemical change of some sort) with a potion of other plants, the effects from using Don Juan's medicinal recipe is sure to do some magic to you.
I recall in one book where he smoked the mixture and started falling into and through the walls and floor. Then Don Genero was "swimming" on the ground. Dude was tripping hard as usual. Like taking "power walks" at night with don Juan hunting for tigers...MINGA, tripping big time if you ask me!  :dancing:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5144483 - 01/05/06 09:41 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

There is no known hallucinogen...or ethnic plant drug...or any plant drug that is ingested in this manner. I am very familiar with hallucinogenic plants and mixtures and their shamanic use, but there is no parallel for this or reason to think this would work without physically injuring the user by inhaling burning matter. Once again, the drug references seemed to be a hook and quite beside the point of the books in my opinion.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5145359 - 01/06/06 01:29 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Cubenisseur said:
Then Don Genero was "swimming" on the ground. Dude was tripping hard as usual. Like taking "power walks" at night with don Juan hunting for tigers...MINGA, tripping big time if you ask me!  :dancing:




Don Genaro was swimming, and doing other things like sitting on a tree (not a branch, on a tree itself, body perpendicular to the trunk, defying gravity) when Carlos was sober to demonstrate the nagual. Also, in the Active Side of Infinity, Carlos' friend Bill talks about Shamans turning into clouds or water right in front of his eyes. Now, whether Don Juan did exist or not is truly a mystery, but do these metaphysical transformations really occur in this world?

(I'm desperate for a first-hand experience)


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5145418 - 01/06/06 01:42 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

but do these metaphysical transformations really occur in this world?

No.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5145577 - 01/06/06 02:26 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

You're reinforcing your obvious stance on the subject. Enjoy your dull grind of materialism ... I'ma gonna chase the white rabbit.

:zoom:


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5145606 - 01/06/06 02:34 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

"For instance, there are Cloud Shamans who turn into clouds, into mist. I have never seen this happen, but I knew a Cloud Shaman. I never saw him disappearing or turning into mist in front of my eyes, but I chased him once, and he simply vanished in an area where there was no place for him to hide. Although I didn't see him turning into a cloud, he disappeared. I couldn't explain where he went. There were no rocks or vegetation around the place where he ended up. I was there half a minute after he was, but the Shaman was gone."


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5145688 - 01/06/06 03:04 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

You're reinforcing your obvious stance on the subject.

Bzzzzt!  :thumbdown:

Reread the part where Carlos asks Don Juan this very question then get back to me.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5145694 - 01/06/06 03:06 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

I couldn't explain where he went.

Nor can most folks explain Criss Angel's levitation. Lack of understanding does NOT equal real magick.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5145714 - 01/06/06 03:19 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Bzzzzt!  :thumbdown:

Reread the part where Carlos asks Don Juan this very question then get back to me.




Ha, well you got me.

I was quick to write my response, didnt formulate properly of what I wanted to say. 

In fact, Im gonna refrain from rephrasing the question, it serves no purpose. Live and learn baby.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5145722 - 01/06/06 03:24 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
I couldn't explain where he went.

Nor can most folks explain Criss Angel's levitation. Lack of understanding does NOT equal real magick.




Criss Angel is a whole another story. The fact that all he does is just acting with hired actors portrayed as innocent bystanders sounds absurd to me. If it was just camera work, this would get exposed on the internet way before he got past his first season.

But the fact that he can take a woman's ring in a restaurant, have it disappear on the table right in front of her eyes and appear in her drink of water inside an ice cube really fucks with my logic. As much as shamans turning into clouds. There's just no reasonable explanation, but my debunking nature just cant take it for granted. Thats why I really want to experience it with my own two eyes.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5145736 - 01/06/06 03:31 AM (16 years, 19 days ago)

There's just no reasonable explanation

That you are currently aware of.

Herein lies the problem with all these stories, paranormal and otherwise. Of course there is a reasonable explanation, but people tend to think if their mighty intellect /knowledge base cannot grasp it, then it must be magic. This is an egocentric fallacy. You and I don't know how to design a CPU chip, but so what?

Let me repeat: Ignorance <> mystical event.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5145999 - 01/06/06 09:14 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

For Swami,

What can be understood with modern human knowledge is extremely shallow and tiny; it is far from truly coming to terms with the truth of the universe. Some people even dare not face, touch upon, or admit the facts of phenomena that objectively exist, because they are too conservative and unwilling to change their conventional thinking.



Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5146118 - 01/06/06 11:08 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Let me repeat: Ignorance <> mystical event

I don't think there is anyway to know if all so called mystical events are based in ignorance. Being a skeptic I keep an open mind.  :wink:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMisanthrope
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 10/06/05
Posts: 79
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5146126 - 01/06/06 11:10 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Herein lies the problem with all these stories, paranormal and otherwise. Of course there is a reasonable explanation, but people tend to think if their mighty intellect /knowledge base cannot grasp it, then it must be magic. This is an egocentric fallacy. You and I don't know how to design a CPU chip, but so what?

Let me repeat: Ignorance <> mystical event.




Do you mean to say that everyone who believes the events described in Carlos Castaneda's books, cannot intellectually grasp the concept that he might be full of shit? Or cannot wrap their minds around the possibility that certain reports of his may be metaphorical, exaggerated, or simply the man's delusions?


Edited by Misanthrope (01/06/06 11:15 AM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSinbad
Living TheMoment
Male

Registered: 12/23/04
Posts: 2,571
Loc: Under The Bodhi Tree
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Swami]
    #5146143 - 01/06/06 11:17 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
There's just no reasonable explanation

That you are currently aware of.

Herein lies the problem with all these stories, paranormal and otherwise. Of course there is a reasonable explanation, but people tend to think if their mighty intellect /knowledge base cannot grasp it, then it must be magic.




Assumptions are just as flawed as blind faith. Do you really believe that there has to be a logical, reasonable explanation to every event that takes place in the phenomenal universe?


--------------------


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Sinbad]
    #5146153 - 01/06/06 11:27 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

This is the same conclusion that I draw. Each manifestation of our Universe seems magical to me, and because we have something called science and logic that attempts to contain it does not explain any of it to me really. The fact that more is going on then I can contain or understand is a given in my book.

Still, that's no reason to believe things just because they massage our fears.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMisanthrope
Stranger
 User Gallery
Registered: 10/06/05
Posts: 79
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Icelander]
    #5146161 - 01/06/06 11:31 AM (16 years, 18 days ago)

http://www.webster.com/dictionary/magic
"2a : an extraordinary power or influence seemingly from a supernatural source"

I fail to see how the word is misused when talking about matters where there's no accepted scientific terms or formulas that describe the events in question.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineCubenisseur
Mad Props
Male

Registered: 12/04/05
Posts: 1,392
Loc: Indian Land
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Misanthrope]
    #5146317 - 01/06/06 12:45 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

The best definition of science that I have heard is that it is like a blind man grouping an elephant.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5146400 - 01/06/06 01:13 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Nothing like a group of elephants that I have herd of.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Cubenisseur]
    #5146470 - 01/06/06 01:32 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Kinky! Do you have a link? :smile:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,679
Loc: On the Border
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5147357 - 01/06/06 04:52 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

" there are Cloud Shamans who turn into clouds, into mist. I have never seen this happen"

I am an Ass Shaman. If you say something I don't like I will turn into an ass right in front of you. Many people have seen me exhibit this power.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5147368 - 01/06/06 04:54 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

:rotfl:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5148188 - 01/06/06 07:24 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

I remember this one thread on pedophiles... :mushroom2:




:rofl2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (01/06/06 07:25 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineFospher
Crime FightingMaster Criminal
Male

Registered: 02/09/05
Posts: 2,033
Loc: The Netherlands
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5148691 - 01/06/06 10:13 PM (16 years, 18 days ago)

Well thats nice of you.


--------------------
010001100100001001000101!


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinecharliewired
Stranger
Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 24
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5150766 - 01/07/06 03:11 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

I was very disappointed to read stories from people close to CC - that told a tale of a cult like environment, full of chickypoo "appentices", and in which CC was the primary sperm dispensor, I also read alot of evidence that has been pointed out where CC contradicts himself in terms of being in 2 places at once, eating imaginary fungus, and things of this nature. it was a shame - I agree the books are well researched though and personally I got some very useful stuff out of them - They are a great tale if nothing else.
Cheers
Charliewired


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: charliewired]
    #5151146 - 01/07/06 05:37 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

CC= bad boy. :grin:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa

Registered: 05/29/04
Posts: 17,230
Re: Authenticity of Carlos Cantaneda's Works [Re: Fospher]
    #5151161 - 01/07/06 05:47 PM (16 years, 17 days ago)

one mans preception on reality is just that. One masn preception. Fiction to all that don't know wernt there and so on.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract, Kratom Powder For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   North Spore Bulk Substrate, Cultivation Supplies, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Edibles   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Thoughts on Magick...
( 1 2 3 4 all )
Anonymous 5,674 68 11/20/01 04:40 AM
by Swami
* techno magic Traveller 1,201 11 11/21/01 12:30 PM
by skaMariaPastora
* Carlos Castaneda, thoughts anyone?
( 1 2 3 all )
Cosmic_Monkey 7,061 47 07/18/10 06:21 PM
by OrgoneConclusion
* Science, Paranormal and usefulness lucid 422 1 06/19/03 09:01 PM
by lucid
* Testing your Paranormal Hypothesis
( 1 2 3 4 5 all )
Swami 7,776 91 06/05/03 12:43 AM
by spiritshaper
* A brief comment on Liber ABA (Magick in Theory & Practice) Demon 681 1 02/04/03 05:32 PM
by MarkostheGnostic
* Anyone experienced in the practice of magick?
( 1 2 all )
Earth_Droid 2,028 20 01/28/03 01:03 PM
by Glacius
* Spiritual (and other paranormal) Bashing Swami 928 12 08/09/03 03:58 AM
by Lazerouth

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
6,113 topic views. 1 members, 2 guests and 10 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Print Topic | ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2022 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.072 seconds spending 0.014 seconds on 18 queries.