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OfflineDivine_Madness
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Krishnamurti
    #512943 - 01/07/02 06:59 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Ever read some stuff of him?
I just started (again) with reading a book from him, and I definitly recommend it to anyone here.
Though I would like to put a qoute here, I think its best if you just read some books of him...


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its all placebo


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OfflineDivine_Madness
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #514455 - 01/08/02 02:11 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

For the lazy asses:
http://www.krishnamurti.org
http://www.kinfonet.org/
And for those who dont know, he was more that just another philospher, though, he self does not like to be seen like this...


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its all placebo


Edited by Divine_Madness (01/08/02 02:16 PM)


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #662735 - 06/04/02 12:47 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I also tried to get people to read Krishnamurti on this board but people just arn't willing to check it out.

We should start a Shroomery Krishnamurti movement to raise awareness about Krishnamurti's work. Once people start reading it they will be glad they did.


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OfflineNextGenHippie
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #663850 - 06/05/02 07:51 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

For the lazy asses:

I am too lazy to copy and paste. Please make them into hyperlinks.


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[pot]Think left and think right[pot]
[pot]and think low and think high[pot]
[pot]Oh, the thinks you can think up if only you try[pot]
-Dr. Seuss


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #663878 - 06/05/02 08:08 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

His books are intellectually brilliant, yet somehow dry. I doubt if his writings have truly helped very many (if any!) to progress on the spiritual path.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #665235 - 06/06/02 03:31 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I couldnt disagree more with you, swami. Try reading "The Second Penguin Krishnamurti Reader". I couldn't put it down. And he has helped MANY progress on the spiritual path. Do you have any idea of how many people would go to his lectures and read his books. Not everyone who read his writing may have achieved absolute enlightenment but I'm sure he has helped EVERYONE who has UNDERSTOOD his writings. His writings have helped me beyond words, and I'm only 18. I seriously doubt that you have read very much of his or else you would see how helpful his writings are. He has probably helped more people than any other person in history (except for maybe Buddha, but Krishnamuti's writings are more helpful than Buddha's, because they are clearer, more thorough, and more specific).

So dont diss the guy before you have read at least a few of his books.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #665360 - 06/06/02 04:48 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Try reading "The Second Penguin Krishnamurti Reader". I couldn't put it down.
Many people felt that way about "Silence of the Lambs".

Do you have any idea of how many people would go to his lectures and read his books.
I understand how to form a question.

...but I'm sure he has helped EVERYONE who has UNDERSTOOD his writings.
*Sigh* Once again a tautlogy rises it's ugly head. So anyone who read his works and was not helped, obviously didn't understand. That is quite an egotistical statement and hardly indicative of a spiritually advanced state or an elightened mind.

His writings have helped me beyond words...
Words have helped you to go beyond words... amazing!

I seriously doubt that you have read very much of his or else you would see how helpful his writings are.
Your doubts have nothing to do with reality. (And please refrain from using your lame tautology once again!) I have throughly read a half dozen of his books and found them intellectually stimulating, but did not help me in any real-world fashion.

...but Krishnamuti's writings are more helpful than Buddha's...
As are Dr. Seuss' as the Buddha did no writings.

So dont diss the guy before you have read at least a few of his books.
I have read them and saying that they are dry is "dissing"?

I am most glad that you enjoyed them and found them helpful, but your inability to accept another's opinion reeks of evangelism.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineDivine_Madness
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #666886 - 06/07/02 04:09 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Swami, you really need help.

I think you have greater inability in accepting others opinions than most on this board.


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its all placebo


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #666908 - 06/07/02 04:34 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I am most glad that you enjoyed them and found them helpful...
I guess that statement is not accepting of another's opinion compared to:

...but I'm sure he has helped EVERYONE who has UNDERSTOOD his writings.
Meaning that no other opinion is even remotely possible.

Who has the more inflexible stance?

What type of help are you suggesting, DM? Perhaps I need to read yet another book?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami] * 1
    #667250 - 06/07/02 09:11 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

A few months ago, before I had read any Krishnamurti, I would have argued and defended my points. But that wont solve anything, we would both be wasting energy.


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Invisiblechodamunky
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness] * 1
    #667810 - 06/07/02 04:44 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I have only read one Krishnamurti book (Total Freedom) and it completely challenged the way I think. There is one point I want to make with regards to his teachings.

You only get something out of Krishnamurti's teachings if you are willing to seriously think about what he is saying. I can tell a thousand people to read his books but what is the point if they don't care and aren't willing to see what he is saying? Passive readers will not learn anything useful from his books, and I do have to admit some it is very thought provoking to the point where it's easy to get lost if you don't take a step back and re-read a section again. Anyhow, I got my mom to read Total Freedom by just asking her questions that came to mind while I was reading the book. She got interested herself in what I was saying and picked up the book without me nagging her to do it.


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Offlinedeepr
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #673720 - 06/11/02 06:06 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

That is quite an egotistical statement and hardly indicative of a spiritually advanced state or an elightened mind.
did he say he was spiritually advanced? no. an 18 year old with an enlightened mind? what are you on about.. have you nothing better to do than try to quash opinions of people who have found happiness or truth and want to express it in some way in order to help others? yes you are older, are you really wiser... ? anyone who wants to post a general comment should be able to, without being grilled by your highness. Do you hold the rule book to the gate of spiritual awareness?

Words have helped you to go beyond words... amazing!
yes swami this is actually possible. although for instance the zen path usually places a greater emphasis on practice, rather than the inferior communication of language, many who have reached an enlightened state have been helped by reading texts such as the four noble truths or teachings associated with them. in effect, yes words help them to reach a situation only describable beyond words. amazing isnt it

As are Dr. Seuss' as the Buddha did no writings.
yes he got his ascetic 'disciples' to scribe them for him... this is what he meant, you should know this, you like to manipulate what people say..

but your inability to accept another's opinion reeks of evangelism.
likewise my troubled friend. may i recommend exercise, breathing practice, maybe intercourse is long overdue, and most of all be healthy...
using your stand-over tactics makes you an unlikely example of spiritual harmony, why not set a good example?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: deepr]
    #673767 - 06/11/02 06:44 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

likewise my troubled friend. may i recommend exercise, breathing practice, maybe intercourse is long overdue, and most of all be healthy...
using your stand-over tactics makes you an unlikely example of spiritual harmony, why not set a good example?


Why not, indeed? I give my take on a book (the subject of this thread) and you ramble on about my sex life and physical conditioning, and give me a lecture while you violate the very principles of the subject of your lecture. Too funny!



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Divine_Madness]
    #674654 - 06/12/02 09:43 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I don't wish to get involved in any internecine squabbles here, but if I'm convinced of anything after persusing this thread it's that this material would be well worth the read...next time I order from Amazon I'll make a point of picking up one or two of the works mentioned......thanks


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"Being crazier than a shithouse rat is not sufficient grounds for banishment"



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Offlinegoatywoaty
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #675302 - 06/12/02 03:47 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

likewise my troubled friend. may i recommend exercise, breathing practice, maybe intercourse is long overdue, and most of all be healthy...

likewise my troubled friend. may i recommend exercise, breathing practice, maybe intercourse is long overdue, and most of all be healthy...


when things get so abstrained from the subject that they no longer matter, you must realize that nothing truly matters if it is done parralel to our own spirituality.


--------------------
[real.eyes.realize.real.lies]
the only reality is the one you make of it, for in the end it becomes what it always was.
______________________________
:::anything above this line is a lie:::



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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #675390 - 06/12/02 04:28 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

I am most glad that you enjoyed them and found them helpful...
I guess that statement is not accepting of another's opinion compared to:

...but I'm sure he has helped EVERYONE who has UNDERSTOOD his writings.
Meaning that no other opinion is even remotely possible.




just to clear things up:

I never said that no other opinion is remotely possible. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. Judging by the way that you spoke of this subject it seemed that you have never read a book by Krishnamurti, or I am underestimating your intelligence and it you merely didn't understand what you read. But I'm sure you would understand, so I assumed that you have never read one of his books. Since you said you have read them, I was wrong, but it is obvious that you dont agree with what he says, or at least you dont make an effort to understand what he says. Again, I could be wrong, but it seems odd that a Krishnamurti reader would behave in the manner that you do. No hard feelings, but which books of his have you read? Also, do you agree with what he says? What don't you agree with, if anything? (Maybe we could have a REAL conversation on this matter, but if you would rather not, thats okay.)


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #675396 - 06/12/02 04:30 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

FreakQlibrium, thats very good to hear. Be sure to post what you think.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #675792 - 06/12/02 08:56 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

...or I am underestimating your intelligence and it you merely didn't understand what you read.
Actually the correct phrasing would be that you OVER-ESTIMATED my intelligence, but an intelligent person would know the difference. Is that you, Yoda? (it you merely)?

But I'm sure you would understand, so I assumed that you have never read one of his books.
One of many incorrect assumptions.

Since you said you have read them, I was wrong,
Yes, you were.

...but it is obvious that you dont agree with what he says, or at least
Not obvious at all, reread my orginal post.

...you dont make an effort to understand what he says. (I never said that no other opinion is remotely possible. I don't know how you came to that conclusion. )
Gee, how did I come to that conclusion? If I am not a cheerleader for his books, then I either don't have the mental capacity to grok his insights or I am too lazy.

Lets review my options according to Buddha1:

A. Enamored with Krishnamurti's spiritually advanced and life-changing views

B. Insufficient neural horsepower

C. Lazy

I must have missed the part where he stated the importance of making rash judgements.

Again, I could be wrong,
Yes, you could.

but it seems odd that a Krishnamurti reader would behave in the manner that you do.
Funny that you didn't take the other Krishnamurti readers to task for getting personal. Because they found his writings useful, you can overlook their unacceptable social behaviour? Where is the evidence of these fantastic changes that come over everyone who reads (and understands) his writings?

No hard feelings,
Why would there be hard feelings? I merely offered an alternative opinion on a book.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #677303 - 06/13/02 07:00 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

You're a big Hume fan aren't you, Swami.

You're right about the lazy thing, but only when its something I dont want to do. I was merely explaining my thought proceess in the last post, to show you how I originally come to a false 'opinion'. I wasn't making an attack on you, thats why I kept saying I was wrong, or I could be wrong, because I'm a bit of a Hume fan myself.

I'm not gonna waste my time picking away at your post and explaining what I meant. Thats not my cup of tea. If you have any serious views of your own, not just a critical view of someone elses view, post it. What do you enjoy reading and why?


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OfflineTypingwords
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #677363 - 06/13/02 07:56 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks alot guys, you know it takes two to ruin a perfectly good thread. I was looking forward to reading about everyone's opinions on my beloved krishnamurti (he's all i've been reading lately), but instead I was forced into a pile of crap I thought I'd never get out of. Swami, don't you agree that if everyone read his books and fully understood them and they applied his teachings to real life, then there would be heaven on earth? That is what is important to understand about krishnamurti. I don't think his teachings are so dry as to make that an impossibility.


--------------------
everything everyone everywhere.
forever and ever


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Typingwords]
    #677582 - 06/14/02 02:35 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Typingwords, I completely agree with you but you must understand that that type of reasoning doesnt work with swami. If what you say is slightly disputeable, and almost whatever you say will be, then he will point out your flawed arguement. It's good to be skeptical though, but it's also important to be able to have firendly conversations (obviously not to Swami though).

So Typingwords, which books have you read by K.?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Typingwords]
    #677653 - 06/14/02 04:01 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Swami, don't you agree that if everyone read his books and fully understood them and they applied his teachings to real life, then there would be heaven on earth?

I would agree, but then the same could be said about many books. How many Christians truly practice the teachings of Christ, or Muslims, the teachings of Mohammed? There is a huge gap between entertainment, intellectual stimulation and actually living the word.

I would like to hear specifically how application of his teachings has significantly changed your life.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineTypingwords
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #677803 - 06/14/02 06:23 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I guess you're right, but krishnamurti's ideas seem to ring true more than all that other bullshit, and I think most people are able to recognize the truth in what he says, which makes it easier for them to live out the teachings.

As for how his ideas have specifically changed my life, well, I can't say that they have...yet. That is why I keep reading it so often, trying to pound the ideas into my head and shed my mind's lousy conditioned habits. However, I am slowly but surely feeling a change in my thought process. Basically my mind is becoming more attentive to everything.

And to Buddha1, I am currently reading "Think on these Things", "Commentaries on Living third series", and a biography type book called "Krishnamurti: 100 years"


--------------------
everything everyone everywhere.
forever and ever


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Typingwords]
    #678167 - 06/14/02 09:33 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Krishnamurti has helped me understand my emotions and my thought process better. Recently I broke up with my girlfriend of over a year and a half. We were living together and were very close. If I had never read any Krishnamurti, I would have been very depressed and in a terrible state of self pity. I would have analyzed the situation again and again, I know I would have done this because I have acted this way in similar past events. Because of reading K. I have realized that she is not my life, and that the attachment I developed towards her was self destructive. I was a little depressed for a week, but that was mostly due to confusion and complicated events that I'm not going to get into. I realized that by dwelling in these memories of the past I was making my life much harder than it needed to be. I enjoy myself more now, on a daily basis, and I appreciate nature and beauty more since reading K. I have always been calm and laid back, but I have even more control over my emotions now. Keep in mind I'm far from being 'enlightened' but I'm probably on the right path.

Typingwords, I just finished 'The second penguin Krishnamurti reader' and I own 'total freedom' but I havn't started reading it yet. I was going to buy a Krishnamurti book for a close friend of mine but I'm not sure which would be the best for a first time K. reader. I was thinking either 'Think on these Things', because it looked pretty straightforward, or 'The second penguin Krishnamurti reader' because I've read it and I enjoyed it. Which would you recomend?



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OfflineTypingwords
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #681144 - 06/15/02 10:23 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah, i've never read that penguin one, but it sounds pretty cool just by the name! But I did just give "Think on these Things" to a friend and she really liked it. And it's the first Krishnamurti thing I ever read and it totally blew my mind right away. I love the straightforwardness. He just tells it like it is. And you're left with your jaw hanging.


--------------------
everything everyone everywhere.
forever and ever


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Typingwords]
    #685057 - 06/18/02 01:45 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

the penguin one is two books in one. 'The Only Revolution' and "The Urgency for Change'. They were both very good. I think I'll chech out 'Think on These Things' next. I know what you mean about it blowing your mind away. It seems so odd that Krishnamurti isn't a household name, but it probably ill be in a hundred years or so.

To anyone reading this who has yet to read any Krishnamurti:
Check it out. He doesn't tell you how to live or what to do, he simply explains the world we live in and how it conditions our mind. It's not hard to read, or boring, so if you have any urge for a 'higher knowledge' check it out.


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OfflineHunabKu
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Typingwords]
    #685110 - 06/18/02 03:27 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Typingwords: It always takes two.

Buddha said: "A few months ago, before I had read any Krishnamurti, I would have argued and defended my points. But that wont solve anything, we would both be wasting energy."

Hey man, a few months ago, before I realized, I would have read Krishnamurti. Put that in your hand and clap it.





Edited by HunabKu (06/18/02 06:16 AM)


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: HunabKu]
    #685845 - 06/18/02 09:44 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

HunabKu, before you realized what?

I never said I was perfect or enlightened or right. I make mistakes, and often, I'm still young, but I make many less mistakes since reading Krishnamurti. Dont judge me by my posts, and don't judge Krishnamurti by my posts, I dont put a lot of thought or time into my posts. They're full of mistakes and contridictions (not to mention spelling errors).


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #685917 - 06/18/02 10:08 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Awareness, which is meditation-in-action, should be reflected in the smallest things that you do; even typing out a post. Sloppiness and laziness have no place in a Master's (or potential Master's) daily practice.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Swami]
    #686396 - 06/18/02 02:31 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

True Swami, but right now the internet and message boards arn't a priority for me. I don't need to prove myself to anyone, I post for fun and for interesting discussions. Originally I didn't write much about Krishnamurti or his ideas in this forum and others because I have only been reading K. for a few months. By no means do I feel comfortable or capable representing his concepts and his teachings. I did not post about them because I didn't want to distort the message. But it seems as though people need some incentive to read, so I took a stab at posting. I realize now that I should have made my standpoint clearer. I wasn't trying to give rock solid arguements, I was just trying to convey my thoughts and feelings K.'s work to inspire people to read his books. I wasn't expecting David Hume to respond.

Then, after your post, I realized that what I said was being turned into an arguement, a debate about his ideas. I wasn't looking for a debate, I was merely trying to spread awareness of Krishnamurti's work. I am very grateful to the people who first introduced me to K's work, so I decided to pass the favor on, because I'm sure that there are many like me who have never heard of K.

But I realized I had made some ignorant remarks so I tried to clear thing up, by explaining how I came to a false conclusion. But once again I was unsuccessful and made minor mistakes. I was too caught up in trying to convey an idea that I did not realize how my statements could be misinterpreted, and I also made many assumtions that I should not have made. But I am learning, so thank you Swami for your skeptical insight and your beautiful execution of the 'Descartes method of doubt/inquiry'.

By the way, Krishnamurti is also a skeptic (not directed at Swami because I'm sure he allready knows). K. on awareness:

"Let us begin as though we know nothing about it at all and start from scratch. Let us not make any assertions, dogmatic or subtle, but let us explore this question which, if one really went into it very deeply, would reveal an extraordinary state that the mind has probably never touched by superficial awareness. Let us start from the superficial and work through."
-J. Krishnamurti, The Urgency of Change, The Second Penguin Krishnamurti Reader.


Edited by Buddha1 (06/18/02 02:32 PM)


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OfflineHunabKu
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #686474 - 06/18/02 03:29 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Buddha1, I realized, period. When I'm posting I can only be groggy. But if I'm not posting, I'm awake. Think about those metaphors. If you look a little into the Tao, you'll see that anyone who espouses in books isn't important. The mountain isn't a result of the path. The light isn't a result of your eyes. Just remember that your "enlightenment" isn't a result of Krish or anybody else. It's a matter of realization.


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OfflineBuddha1
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: HunabKu]
    #686504 - 06/18/02 03:51 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

Just remember that your "enlightenment" isn't a result of Krish or anybody else. It's a matter of realization.




Well said. Krishnamurti is helping me come to this realization. He is helping me explore what this means, and his books have a potential to help many others come to this realization. If it had not been for others promoting Krishnamurti's work, I may have never contemplated this realization. I am very glad that people have taken the time to promote his work, and I decided to do the same. I know that no one but myself can free my mind, but K. helps me understand why my mind is not free. He helps me see reality clearer and understand what seeing reality clearly is. And this "realization" or "enlightenment" is seeing reality clearly.


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Invisiblechodamunky
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: Buddha1]
    #686577 - 06/18/02 04:31 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

To you guys who are really into krishnamurti right now:

If I may make a suggestion, don't get too caught up in what he is saying. If you use his books as a crutch you will never become "totally free". One Krishnamurti reader suggested that you should throw away the book after you read it. I have to say that is a bit silly but the point does come across right?


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: chodamunky]
    #686857 - 06/18/02 06:51 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Of course. "If you find the buddah on the road, kill him." Look at where the finger is pointing to, not at the finger

Krishnamurti is a magnificent intellect telling you to use the intellect to go beyond the intellect. Don't get caught in the trap along that way that is easy to fall into. If you REALLY want people to get into Krishnmurti, interest them, not by your admiration of the man or his words, but by the NEW state of clarity that you have entered into.

Think on These Things.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (06/19/02 01:33 AM)


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OfflineBuddha1
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Registered: 05/22/02
Posts: 73
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Re: Krishnamurti [Re: chodamunky]
    #687234 - 06/19/02 12:45 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

In reply to:

If I may make a suggestion, don't get too caught up in what he is saying. If you use his books as a crutch you will never become "totally free". One Krishnamurti reader suggested that you should throw away the book after you read it.




I dont throw away the book when I'm done, I give it away, and I tell whoever I give it to to give it away when they are done.

In reply to:

If you REALLY want people to get into Krishnmurti, interest them, not by your admiration of the man or his words, but by the NEW state of clarity that you have entered into.




I am not saying that I admire him or his words. I understand much of what he says. His teachings have helped me see clearer. Any Krishnamurti reader should know not to idolize or follow anyone, I am no exception. But like I said earlier, I have a long way to go.

I dont worship Krishnamurti or praise him or follow him. I listen to what he says. He is a being like any other, but he can see much clearer than most. It is not Krishnamurti that is great and that helps me, it is what he says.


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