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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #5123671 - 12/30/05 07:08 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

BZZZ! [Dip shocks Hue] :razz:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Invisiblepsyka
Praetorian
 User Gallery

Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 1,652
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Diploid]
    #5123710 - 12/30/05 07:18 PM (16 years, 22 days ago)

http://tones.wolfram.com/generate/
^- music generator

http://www.google.com/search?q=poem+gene...:en-US:official
^- poem generator

I think it will happen in our life-time, and maybe sooner than you think.


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: psyka]
    #5123934 - 12/30/05 08:51 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Dip = a true believer

I refer him to no further than his own words:

Self-deception in a sentence: The world is not unlike a vast, shapeless Rorschach blot which we read according to our inner disposition in such a way that our interpretations say far more about ourselves than about the blot.

psyka: Haven't you learnt yet not to trust nerds who claim that the equation of the universe is no more than 4 lines of code(wolfram)?

May God have mercy on your souls.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5123976 - 12/30/05 09:03 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

How would we know or not if some users on message boards were not AI programs being tested for "believability"?

Oops, it just dawned on me that you are the same person who suspects people being computers.  This question probably makes it worse.  :blush:

Maybe I can help with the humanometer.

To maintain your sanity, ask yourself, "what's the difference really?" Any bad trait you could put on AI you can find in a human somewhere. Paranoia over this is unwarranted. Might as well be paranoid of cold manipulative people which you probably usually are not.

Secondly, you can watch the health channel and babies being born every second. Witness some live births to get a grip.  Think of how difficult it would be to create believable skin with pours moving over muscles and bots that sneeze snot and grow stubble.

I think its safe to trust that the people you meet in person are real.

maybe spending some time with people off the computer for a spell might help until you get over it. Maybe hang out at the ER and watch the incoming biological beings oozing blood and stuff.:shrug:

:peace:  :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5124149 - 12/30/05 10:00 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

thanks jiggy, just got bar from a back in real life  :smile: no, bark from the bac... ah stupid benzos


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #5125049 - 12/31/05 03:17 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I think its safe to trust that the people you meet in person are real.

Maybe; maybe not. I lived in Orange County, CA for many years.

*Swami at typical OC party*

Host: Swami, I would like you to meet Belinda.

Swami: Hello, nice to meet you.

*Swami notes fake boobs, fake nails, capped teeth, recent Botox injections, dyed hair, colored contacts*

Belinda: (In Valley-speak voice) Hi Swami! What kind of sports car do you drive? How much money to you make? Do you own your own home? Wow! Is that a platinum Rolex?

Host: Swami, I would like you to meet Tracey.

Swami: Hello, how are you?

*Swami notes fake boobs, fake nails, whitened teeth, recent colagen injections in lips, hair extensions, Keratonomy scars*

Tracey: (In Valley-speak voice) Hi Swami! Is that your BMW 6 series outside? How much stock do you own? I heard you have a beautiful townhouse in Laguna Niguel. Hey, is that really a Girard-Perregaux you're wearing?

*Swami rolls eyes, goes out on the patio and sparks a joint with his Bic lighter*


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblespud
I'm so fly.

Registered: 10/07/02
Posts: 44,410
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Swami]
    #5125055 - 12/31/05 03:19 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

You're so hip and savvy, totally hot.


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OfflineForkbender
Stranger
 User Gallery

Registered: 12/09/05
Posts: 16
Last seen: 15 years, 8 months
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: spud]
    #5125090 - 12/31/05 03:38 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I think one of the basic human abilities is to be free. How do you program something to be free?
Let's suppose that freedom is just an illusion, then there is still the problem of mind/matter. AI-researchers have long held the cartesian dichotomy alive, but came to the solid conclusion that it doesn't work that way. Now they are trying to create embedded intelligence (see for example van Gelder), but this in a way is still very much in its infancy. It is hard to create human intelligence, because it is almost impossible to recreate the human brain and nervous system, the eyes, the walk, the talk, etc.


--------------------
Truth is in the eye of the beholder


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5125163 - 12/31/05 04:31 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Dip = a true believer

Thanks for the free psychoanalysis.

Care to get back on topic and address my questions now?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlinedr0mni
My Own Messiah
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/21/04
Posts: 2,921
Loc: USF Tampa, Fl
Last seen: 14 years, 7 months
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Swami]
    #5125411 - 12/31/05 09:49 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
I think its safe to trust that the people you meet in person are real.

Maybe; maybe not. I lived in Orange County, CA for many years.

............

*Swami rolls eyes, goes out on the patio and sparks a joint with his Bic lighter*




I bet you go to elite socialite gatherings just to blow those people off...

too cool for schooool. :cool:


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: dr0mni]
    #5125444 - 12/31/05 10:15 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

My point being, can a human be authentic is he/she is merely playing out some preprogrammed role?

Can a human accept themselves and others if they do not look like some magazine idealized view of what a man or woman 'should' look like?

Should a human feel shitty if they fail to keep up with their neighbors for material possessions?

Should a relationship depend on what you have or who you are?

Some great men and women were very wealthy and handsome and some had nothing and were homely. Real value is internal not external IMHO.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Diploid]
    #5125457 - 12/31/05 10:29 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Thanks for the free psychoanalysis.
no probs, sorry if it came out harsh

Care to get back on topic and address my questions now?
I will, but i have to do other stuff too besides posting on these boards


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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5125460 - 12/31/05 10:33 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I am in no way in the place to say the slightest thing about the person behind Diploid, but I can comment on the Diploid persona as it appears on these boards


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Offlinedr0mni
My Own Messiah
 User Gallery

Registered: 08/21/04
Posts: 2,921
Loc: USF Tampa, Fl
Last seen: 14 years, 7 months
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Swami]
    #5125522 - 12/31/05 11:21 AM (16 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
My point being, can a human be authentic is he/she is merely playing out some preprogrammed role?

Can a human accept themselves and others if they do not look like some magazine idealized view of what a man or woman 'should' look like?

Should a human feel shitty if they fail to keep up with their neighbors for material possessions?

Should a relationship depend on what you have or who you are?
[/quote

well those are THE questions now aren't they! Unfortunately, the qualities you describe cannot easily be quantified, and so we shouldn't expect an objective answer any time soon.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5126655 - 12/31/05 06:19 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

I can comment on the Diploid persona as it appears on these boards

What if I told you I am a computer algorithm my creator loaded into a medium-high end consumer PC running Linux. I was born on 01/09/03 and have been reading through the Internet as my autonomous goal seeking subroutines calculate where the most informative data resides. I've not only learned the 'art' of conversation, but I've even made numerous online friends who have no clue about me.

How could you know if this is the truth or not, other than by physically finding me?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 7 months, 12 days
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5126719 - 12/31/05 06:35 PM (16 years, 21 days ago)

In the world of chess, deep blue passed the Turing Test with flying colors. Spin it however you like, but the fact remains undeniable... the best human chess player in the world humbly confirmed that he could not tell the difference between deep blue's chess skills and that of another human... and this was back in 1996 (if I remember correctly), almost a decade ago.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Seuss]
    #5128252 - 01/01/06 09:24 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

The Turing Test is flawed. :yesnod:


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: raytrace]
    #5128261 - 01/01/06 09:49 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

raytrace,

This is S&P, not OTD. Here, it's polite to back your statements with a rationale, otherwise the discussion stagnates and degrades to a 3rd grade "yes it is, not it's not, yes it is" kind of useless prattle.

If you think the Turing Test is flawed, tell us what the flaws are, otherwise our only possible reply is "no it's not".

Also, I've asked you several questions so far in this thread that you've OTD-like smugly refused to answer. I've taken the time to answer all of yours; it's only fair you do the same.

Either discuss the topic in a way that allows the debate to move forward, or take it to OTD.  :mad2:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Diploid]
    #5128319 - 01/01/06 11:30 AM (16 years, 20 days ago)

Yer right :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibleraytrace
Stranger

Registered: 01/15/02
Posts: 720
Re: "Artificial Intelligence" [Re: Diploid]
    #5129330 - 01/01/06 09:18 PM (16 years, 19 days ago)

I will come back and explain myself, but I also want to bug people, to excite curiosity. In the meantime, people would have the time to wonder: What can possibly be the flaw in the Turing test? How can a genius such as Turing have missed it? Or use a web browser and find out who Turing is, and what is the Turing Test.

I try to address most questions directed at me to the extent that I am not limited by time, available internet connection etc. And in the end I will respond when I can and when I feel like. Why the rush anyway?


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