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Offlinepsychedelix
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anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery)
    #5012391 - 12/03/05 11:39 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)

I dunno about anyone in here, but last night tripping on 2g amazonians in lemon juice, I went into a realm where I saw like a fractal that I am positive for some reason was the source/God.  But then I saw I was on the outer edge of the source, at the edge of this expanding fractal.  The fractal was a cross in the middle and still repeating cross at the edge, where I was, and I have no clue what was when, before or after, but I saw a figure, a lifeform move quickly(the way it moved was unpredictable, a mind of it's own, tripping me the fuck out) one way to another in the void, the outer edge of the fractal.  The face showed itself as a demonic looking, very evil feeling, a face with many faces.  All I felt after that was... am I seeing what I am seeing a deception, or a part of a real vision?
  What I was seeing in both extremes was truly  a question to everything I believe, and I went to myself "what the fuck" and it snapped away to a contrasted point of view.  The feeling inside me sparked an idea that the world is both, good and evil, and if you are looking at it from a total good point or evil point it's a deception.  The greatest mystery in this vision was in perfect balance between the two, that was out of my reach at this time.  I have never seen or felt something so captivating and devine.  I am convinced the mushroom is a powerful psychedelic to the right mind.  Letting the mushroom drive me felt like a guiding hand in this world of geometry in spiritual connection, hard to explain, and far from bs, mushrooms are magic.
  I say mushrooms can go very far with a smaller dose than one might disregard as being enough.  I have taken 5 grams before on an empty stomach and I've tripped harder, except I would have never ventured like I did last night.  Truly mind boggling :psychsplit:


Example of where I felt I resided within the fractal of source (arrow)

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Offlinestemmer
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5012422 - 12/03/05 11:48 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)

I agree with your opinion about dose.
Once your knowledge of science meets up with the ever present fractal imagery. It is very much like what your talking about, but more objective and magical. A voice of reason and things far beyond what you could learn from the normal state of your fractal memory
Theories about genetics, geometry, evolution, a life of being nothing but content, and the self all explode with as much guidance as you felt that night. The magic can become real in the form of the these, more primal logos.

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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: stemmer]
    #5012580 - 12/04/05 12:29 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

heres one i drew

this is sorta a self-portrait from my perspective of the phenomena you are describing.
myself, my surroundings, and my best friend, as one entity.
i saw clearly that i was god, the scourse of all the universe, my companion, my friend, a contrasting point of view for the purpose of making the chaos of non-existance real. the devil, and the shrinking universe around us.
we merged back into one entity and the universe closed in, while similtaneously becomming extremely big from, my, his, and its own point of view.
if you know of heaven or hell, i guess you could say it was there. what was missing was a wonder, a fleeting sense of beauty. accomplishment left us and was filled by a crushing and open potential. reason became self-explanitory, questions became totally obsolete, the answers were readily conceived into existance similtaneously as they were posed.
and the devil grinned, offering comfort but being capable of giving none. nor was god able to accept it, for at this stage the two were unified, in a sense of apology and remorse. a mirrior image of one face and no mirrors.
a mess indeed.
at this stage i could no longer identify with either extreme, NOR the amalgum of the duo (the universe as one)
i was somehow not I, there was no me, and yet there was.
there simply was. a voice without pitch or form called from the abyssmal light. it grew in a triangular split as its infinate nothingness was pulled away from its center to once again bring about existance, and we re-emerged, the drawing is the image of the two extremes, pulling themselves apart and reconfuguring reality in a "forgive and forget" vein.
NOT to end the endless struggle between good and evil,
but rather to ressurect it in all its glory.

to me it seemed that perhaps sometimes, the God and the devil get together and merge, simply because they are tired of struggle, then remember why they are at odds. not because they hate eachother, but because they love the world which is the manifestation OF that struggle.
and in that struggle, it is nessisary for them to forget themselves.

finding themselves they realize they are happier NOT knowing themselves. more real perhaps. to give away all possesion and control and become utterly at the mercy of their conflicting natures, two beings that are one and perceive themselves as many.

would you beleive, that being touched in this way, and seeing it as i do, i have ZERO pride. if anything, i feel guilty for being the epicenter of that union.

its my blessing and curse.

blessed by god to know that there is a finality, yet not to an end.
and cursed by the devil to know that every misstep i can take is a building block of that endless finality.

that the path to heaven it harder for the pious than the profane comes with a snicker from the back of my most twisted and tortured dreams.

the universe to me reflects my perception of it.
sometimes, small, and fragile like a baby. the balance so delicate, my responsibility great.
sometimes it seems intangeble, indestructable, and awesome.

theres really no words in speakable language that can impart true nature. merely parts of it, very small parts, created to give it potency in the minds who ARE it.

lately, as there is such a thing, i have been exhausted to walk that road, tho i know, somehow i will again, that I was meant to and that whatever happens, whatever action or inaction i take, i will find myself on that very fammiliar road. and it is quite literally a road. i have opened my eyes from time to time and looked to my feet and recognized that i have wandered back upon it.

and im still here.

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Offlinestemmer
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5012681 - 12/04/05 01:08 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

That is a great point and a really interesting piece of art.

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Offlinepsychedelix
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5012961 - 12/04/05 04:44 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

w..o..w
I rated you wise friend. What you speak of was a wider manifestation of what I was seeing. For me, when I first tried mushrooms, they were something just trippy, and I didn't know of their true meaning. Somehow, as of very recently, I have discovered a new and profound respect for this marvelous life form. The most amazing part is it takes us to a place that teaches far more important lessons about who we are, and it leaves us in a state of thought, and peace. The sketch/drawing you have is astonishing(<=no better word), and this has inspired me to start recording everything I experience, because it's value is awesome. Honestly when I saw that sketch/drawing, it made alot of sense. You sound like a REAL person, and even though this is the internet, I still believe you're more real than many people I know.
Keep doing what you do, I think the world has something to learn from the philosophy you acknowledge...

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Offlinecoda
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5013470 - 12/04/05 11:14 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

ive never seen what you've seen, but, ive experienced something that i like to call the "arm of god". Was tripping on 4.5 g's of EQ poo shrooms at a festival this fall. Decided to do a bulb of n20 in front of the fire while my buddy was finding more wood. Ended up floating in this black void when all of a sudden i felt very warm and calm (it was like 20 degrees outside) and i just saw this "fractal" (cant be more specific, but it looked like and arm made out of spheres) come towards me and encircle me. I stayed in this void for a good 5 min before slowly dissolving back to reality. As soon as i left the void i instanly became freezing cold and instantly afraid. Unfortunately i got lost in some heavy mind loops and ended up in the fetal position in my tent praying for the trip to end.

Truly a rough ride but that one small experience will stick with me forever.


--------------------
To get really high is to forget yourself. And to forget yourself is to see everything else. And to see everything else is to become an understanding molecule in evolution, a conscious tool of the universe. And I think every human being should be a conscious tool of the universe. . . .

-JG

i really am glad you came back to us instead of taking the other path. *hug*

-A_S (RIP your final words to me will never be forgotten)



Don't fuck with the laughing jesus.

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5013532 - 12/04/05 11:31 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

The Infinite Universes my friends are a wonderful place to live in. And fractals are the *key* to the Universe. They were discovered just 30 years ago. They are the mandalas of the 20th century.

Recently, a spanish *physicist*, together with a team of doctors, has discovered how to stop the development of cancer using fractal geometry. He knew nothing about medicine and began working on it after his grandmother died. He has been working without *any* monetary help from any institution, just by himself, for the last 13 years, during 16 hours a day. Everybody dispissed him.

Fast forward to May 2005. It's a discovery that has been published on Lancet, the most prestigious medical journal in the world, and in other medical journals and might mean the end of certain types of cancer.

"Regulation of neutrophilia by granulocyte colony-stimulating factor: a new cancer therapy that reversed a case of terminal hepatocellular carcinoma"
http://www.terapia-cancer.org/docs/Journal_of_Clinical_Research_MAY_2005.pdf

"Fractal tumor contours question therapy strategies The Lancet Oncology", Lancet Oncology
http://www.terapia-cancer.org/docs/The_Lancet_oncology.PDF

More info and papers in english: http://www.terapia-cancer.org

About cosmology and the Universe. Andrei Linde is one of the most prestigious scientists regarding the Universe.

Recent versions of inflationary theory assert that instead of being a single, expanding ball of fire described by the big bang theory, the universe looks like a huge growing fractal. It consists of many inflating balls that produce new balls, which in turn produce more new balls, ad infinitum. Therefore the evolution of the universe has no end and may have no beginning. After inflation the universe becomes divided into different exponentially large domains inside which properties of elementary particles and even dimension of space-time may be different. Thus, the new cosmological theory leads to a considerable modification of the standard point of view on the structure and evolution of the universe and on our own place in the world.

"The universe globally looks not like an expanding ball, but like a huge fractal consisting of exponentially large domains permanently produced during inflation."
The Self-Reproducing Inflationary Universe
http://www.stanford.edu/%7Ealinde/1032226.pdf
http://www.stanford.edu/~alinde/


Nature speaks. Wise Humans listen. Enjoy being alive. It's a true miracle.

http://www.fourmilab.ch/images/Romanesco/

Edited by infinitedot (12/05/05 06:46 AM)

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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: infinitedot]
    #5013609 - 12/04/05 11:54 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

gotta love the fractal christmas cauliflower.
i always want to buy them and put them on a shelf.

sounds pretty vain now eh?

the same phenomena exist in all plants, starting from leaves and culminating in fruiting parts.

the golden mean.

however, dispite its beauty and complexity, its quite simply explained. something folding upon itself to make use of finate space or cornstructive resources will naturally create a spiral, as each section grows, and upon itself more sections, the speed of growth is incresed proportional to the size. this presents a finate area of infinate potential. a fractal. life.
heres a drawing ive done depicting that exact principle.

its incomplete and flawed by color choice. but the point is made.
notice the ratios simmilar to life imagery, the shape of a fetus with newforming limb buds and eyes, even umbilical cord, notice the facial potential, need a little help?
here.


recognizing this potential, we gain the ability to form MANY interlocking suggestions, finding comonality in ALL things.

that perhaps thing really ARE all one and that perhaps perception is an illusion, a self-justifying vice of the consious mind, creating complex explanations for simple suggestions of energy patterns. fire an atom at ANYTHING and all you hit is empty space. but to our sence of self and physical boundies (ego functions) its as solid as the nose on our face. heres some trasendental image fractal play. ive posted these many times BTW. but i love to use them to describe meaning.

and an egyptian motiff

these of course, are journal entries
i havent worked on it in a while, but i will again rather soon i beleive.

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5014563 - 12/04/05 04:48 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Philosophical Implications of Inflationary Cosmology

Abstract

"Recent developments in cosmology indicate that every history having a nonzero probability is realized in infinitely many distinct regions of spacetime. Thus, it appears that the universe contains infinitely many civilizations exactly like our own, as well as infinitely many civiliations that differ from our own in any way permitted by physical laws. We explore the implications of this conclusion for ethical theory and for the doomsday argument. In the infinite universe, we find that the doomsday argument applies only to effects which change the average lifetime of all civilizations, and not those which affect our civilization alone."

http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/archive/00001341/

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: infinitedot]
    #5014588 - 12/04/05 04:53 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)

MATRIX

Universe creation on a computer

Abstract

"The purpose of this paper is to provide an account of the epistemology and metaphysics of universe creation on a computer. The paper begins with F.J.Tipler's argument that our experience is indistinguishable from the experience of someone embedded in a perfect computer simulation of our own universe, hence we cannot know whether or not we are part of such a computer program ourselves. Tipler's argument is treated as a special case of epistemological scepticism, in a similar vein to `brain-in-a-vat' arguments. It is argued that the hypothesis that our universe is a program running on a digital computer in another universe generates empirical predictions, and is therefore a falsifiable hypothesis. The computer program hypothesis is also treated as a hypothesis about what exists beyond the physical world, and is compared with Kant's metaphysics of noumena. It is proposed that a theory about what exists beyond the physical world should be formulated with the precise concepts of mathematics, and should generate physical predictions. It is argued that if our universe is a program running on a digital computer, then our universe must have compact spatial topology, and the possibilities of observationally testing this prediction are considered. The possibility of testing the computer program hypothesis with the value of the density parameter Omega_0 is also analysed. The informational requirements for a computer to represent a universeexactly and completely are considered. Consequent doubt is thrown upon Tipler's claim that if a hierarchy of computer universes exists, we would not be able to know which `level of implementation' our universe exists at. It is then argued that a digital computer simulation of a universe cannot exist as a universe. However, the paper concludes with the acknowledgement that an analog computer simulation can be objectively related to the thing it represents, hence an analog computer simulation of a universe could, in principle, exist as a universe."

http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/archive/00001891/

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OfflineGomp
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: Mitchnast]
    #5014621 - 12/04/05 05:02 PM (18 years, 3 months ago)


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Offlinepsychedelix
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: Gomp]
    #5016269 - 12/05/05 12:24 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

I am reading and I am thinking at a speed accellerating faster than light.  This stuff is hardcore boys. I will ponder something and write it sometime...
:uptosomething:

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Offlinewjames
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5016647 - 12/05/05 06:04 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Well, first, thanks for explaining your experience :smile:

I've had analogous kinds of experiences.  For me, such an experience is kind of "iffy" in the first place:  if one admits there might be such a thing as the devil or trickster, then it it could be that the *whole experience* is a trick.  Mystics and sages all talk about the danger of "the devil appearing in the guise of an angel of light."
It's a problem.

Second, one has to separate the experience itself from one's attempts to fit the experience into concepts--to make sense of it.  What I mean is that maybe it would be better to try *not* to understand the experience in verbal or logical terms.  Just let the experience be the experience.  (I don't know how realistic that is, though--it's just an idea.)

Anyway, back the first point, I think the important question one needs to ask about these kinds of experience is:  What are the practical implications of the experience for how you live life when *not* tripping?  If if makes you a better person, more loving, more unselfish, more connected, more successful, more involved, then it's more likely to be good.  But if it just makes you a "trippier" person, more convinced that you have some special knowledge that other people don't have or aren't worthy of, isolates you, makes you disdainful of social institutions and traditions, makes you think you need more entheogens, stronger doses, and different varieties, then you need to seriously ask whether the whole experience is an illusion.

I'm not suggesting this is the case with you or your experience, but I think it's a genuine risk of using entheogens and needs to get  more out in the open.

Edited by wjames (12/05/05 06:28 AM)

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: wjames]
    #5016651 - 12/05/05 06:11 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Now compare your idea of being at the end of a fractal with this other picture from the NASA, taken from http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_or/m_or3.html



?Are we, like galaxies scattered throughout the Universe, at the VERY end of a fractal that it's indeed connected to the Source?

Food for thought.

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: wjames]
    #5016666 - 12/05/05 06:22 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

wjames said:
What are the practical implications of the experience for how you live life when *not* tripping?




VERY good question.

My personal answer is a feeling of awe at the miracle of Life, humility, the feeling that it all makes sense, being nothingness and everythingness at the same time, that gives meaning to one word:

Happiness.

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Invisibleinfinitedot
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: infinitedot]
    #5016678 - 12/05/05 06:34 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Science experiments with 4% of what the Universe is.

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Offlinepsychedelix
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: infinitedot]
    #5016716 - 12/05/05 07:28 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


if one admits there might be such a thing as the devil or trickster, then it it could be that the *whole experience* is a trick. Mystics and sages all talk about the danger of "the devil appearing in the guise of an angel of light."
It's a problem.





That is exactly something I thought about... but then again you also brought up something very real as well...
Quote:


Second, one has to separate the experience itself from one's attempts to fit the experience into concepts--to make sense of it. What I mean is that maybe it would be better to try *not* to understand the experience in verbal or logical terms. Just let the experience be the experience. (I don't know how realistic that is, though--it's just an idea.)




:yinyang:
this implicates everything, and it brings forth the hardest thing for humans to understand which is:
"All contradicts itself"
I truly believe that everything in all reality contradicts itself in some way that I cannot begin to explain, it would take me a few hundred hours to write.  As a kid(the following is something I've only told my mother and a few other people), I used to have these nightmares that involved black spheres of nothingness yet wholeness that would grow larger and larger, like fighting for space, evetually to the point where it was 'too much'.  I would wake up sweating and at times crying.  All those spheres started out as one little sphere just in the center of everything, and it split into more spheres(in multiples, considering I was only 3-5 years old, how would I be aware of this?no clue) and the newly conceived ones would grow larger and larger and they would start amalgamating again until the last two remained, from there they don't join, they fight for space, until the point reached where I couldn't go on.  When I'd wake up I would hallucinate strange things, and I can't remember any images in my waking state, all I knew was that I was seeing things ina waking state.  I was a kid and thought it was just a part of dreaming, but I eventually asked my mom...
  My parents took me to a psychologist, but never came up with anything that would differ me from normal.  He told my parent's to read me happy stories and make sure I would drink a herbal tea that had sedative qualities before bedtime.

Whatever, that apparently worked according to my mom, but I remember having a milder version of the dream when I was 8 or so, that's when we came back to Canada, and it could've been triggered by all the stress I was putting up with.
Edit: <>Now that I've read considerable material on psychedelics, I can understand that maybe as a developing child, my pineal gland was active, and it might have triggered a trip-out experience... makes me feel weird just by thinking that a gland in my own brain(as a KID) can give me a dose high enough for me to hallucinate and trip(AS A KID :stars:), but I haven't researched this completely, maybe what I'm saying isn't possible = \ <>

I have no clue why I wrote something so personal[it connects with the whole topic though], but I guess it gets off my chest something that has been a burden to me since childhood, and my constant wondering of what everything is, makes me think that those dreams were something of similar significance with the trip I experienced the other night.  But what makes me think again is whether it is possible that psychedelics trigger deep conscious memory of self perception.  I wouldn't know for sure, but I do know, what I saw on mushrooms was news to me at the time I was experiencing it.  I do know it can't be just a coincidence that I saw something others have as well, but a vague connection between the two spheres can lead me to relate them to the essence of good and evil...

I'm starting to think that I'm thinking too much so I'm going to try and just not think about this for the next few days and see if I can come to an acceptance or understanding.

  I wouldn't mind if more people voice their opinions on this subject,  my thoughts are all over the place and one question that pops into my head triggers a next 10.  Thanks to everyone that is contributing to this, means alot.
:thumbup:

:yinyang:

Edited by psychedelix (12/05/05 07:44 AM)

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Offlinepsychedelix
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5016721 - 12/05/05 07:31 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


My personal answer is a feeling of awe at the miracle of Life, humility, the feeling that it all makes sense, being nothingness and everythingness at the same time, that gives meaning to one word:

Happiness.





That is something worth thinking about, thanks.

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Offlineleery11
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: psychedelix]
    #5017000 - 12/05/05 09:29 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

i've seen the devil a few times.

the most perplexing was sober in my dreams. I was about to leave this huge "hotel with apartments in it" just this massive complex of things..... as I decided I didn't really give a damn about the plot of my dream.

and this guy starts yelling at me trying to distract me, and i ignore him.

and he wants me to listen to his radio station. and i ignore him.

but then these boxes appear that say "tool" on them, and well, this keeps me from leaving (i was going to see the "apartment manager" actually.... is that supposed to be God?) and .... so in the boxes are magic 8 balls (symbolising my lack of ability to make decisions, I often flip coins sometimes.....) and then this guy comes up to me, the one who was yelling... and as i look at him he morphs red and looks kind of devilish.

and like, he's trying to tempt me with omniscience, and it's kind of freaking me out... and i ask how i can get him to leave, and he points at this statue of jesus, but it looks all fake and plastic and he's like a midget or something.

so i say the lords prayer..... and ... as i get to a certain part (I HATE DOGMA, so i was doing this out of fear! just to hope i can keep myself safe) as i get to a certain part, he holds up this little like army man toy or something, symbolising me, and he was about to drop it, which would KILL ME if I finished praying.

so i didn't finish praying, and immediately woke up.

and as i woke up i had psychedelic visuals, the devil moved up to a higher plane of subconsciousness and turned into freddy krueger.

so obviously, this is internal... i mean, all the symbolism, etc, it's subjective, relating to my life.... and i think it's kind of fake, since it took the form of freddy, but yeah.....

then like on herb sometimes i encounter what i think to be the "devil"

God? Not so much... the first few times I got high I said "God?" and heard a strong voice saying "yes?"

Though I did have a dream 2 days ago where I was hooked up to a God machine... some sort of tube that connected me to "pure light" and I asked it questions, but I got suspicious because I asked if it was Yahweh, and it said yes, but I don't really believe in Yahweh, so I thought it was just my mind making things up, so I tried to control God's mind to see if it was just a dream character, but I couldn't.

I asked it only like two questions and I don't remember exactly what, but they weren't profound questions nor did I get profound actions.

I remember asking to be taken up to meet God as gently as possible though.

side tangent on the lords prayer: I'm starting to think that Jesus exists symbolically in the collective unconscious of mankind...... that he can help you, but he's not necessarily ... like a literal being..... just a symbol to meditate upon to understand love and the negation of ego, to help you transcend up to a higher state of functioning, and i think his... death, the crucifix, is in the heart chakra, symbolising selfless sacrifice, and this helps you go up into the throat, etc....

anyway, so the lords prayer itself, structurally, is a pretty good prayer.... i mean our father who art in heaven? Well yes, think abou the crown chakra, the white light that is supposed to be gained from opening it...... thy will be done on earth (the root) as it is in heaven (the crown) ..... lead us not into temptation (abandon desires... attachments) but deliver us from evil (this i don't like, because if you believe that things are evil, this keeps you from love and makes you reside in fear) etc, etc... for thine is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever, amen.

so i mean, it's kind of just a general prayer for protection and liberation from your human failing and temptations. but if you take it in a christian sense ... well i don't like taking it in a christian sense.

and also... the way catholics cross their hearts.... it just reminds me of what i said about jesus being crucified in your heart..... it's like a way to gesture the negation of your ego...... (while high i had a vision of myself being crucified over my heart, in order to still my mind and aid me in rising above ordinary consciousness)

yeah..... symbolism. But symbolism is not true divinity, it's just a way of getting there.

scattered thoughts.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!

Edited by leery11 (12/05/05 09:36 AM)

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Offlinepsychedelix
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Re: anyone ever see god(source) & the devil(trickery) [Re: leery11]
    #5017048 - 12/05/05 09:46 AM (18 years, 3 months ago)

o.kay
That sounds far out man, but dreams about religious figures don't make my jaw drop. I was born into an Orthodox Christian family, and the icons, stories, and the respective fear of God was plotted into my brain after I was 9 or 10. Personally, I don't have too much respect for what the church has become, but I am a firm believer in Jesus, Buddha and so on. Their philosophies of life make sense, and prove they are lessons from a higher consciousness. So even though your dream may have been very symbolic, personally, I, wouldn't take it that serious, but it all depends on your belief.

Believing in God is what separates man from animal... but I wouldn't stick by that statement, it's just something I wanted to say, who knows if it even makes sense, animals could believe in God more than we do.

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