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 XAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 22 years, 9 days
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 humidity 
#485925 - 12/10/01 12:09 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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does humidity rise or fall? i am assuming it falls since water molecules are heavier than 02 molecules. i may have just answered my own question. any confirmations?
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"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."
Bob Marley
Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!
http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html
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Necron99
Protect youreyes from flyingsugar!
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 735
Loc: SATx
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
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 Re: humidity [Re: XAZIA]
#485935 - 12/10/01 12:24 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thru osmosis, water particles move from areas of higher concentration to lower. So no matter where you set the intake on your terrarium from your humidifier, the water vapor will eventually fill all areas until it is equalized.
Gas molecules will move freely thru the suspended water molecules, thus O2 rising, and CO2 sinking.
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"Puny earthlings do not yet know the meaning of the word suffering!!"
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 puscle
genius of love
Registered: 01/06/01
Posts: 4,539
Loc: NY
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Re: humidity [Re: XAZIA]
#485937 - 12/10/01 12:25 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yes, humid air is heavy.
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Anno
Experimenter
Registered: 06/17/99
Posts: 24,167
Loc: my room
Last seen: 29 days, 16 hours
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Re: humidity [Re: XAZIA]
#485949 - 12/10/01 12:35 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Air is composed of app. 80 vol% nitrogen and app. 20% oxigene.
Melecular weight of a nitrogen molecule is 28, that of oxigen molecule is 32, that of a water molecule is 18, so water vapor is lighter than air.
Search for diffusion at www.google.com to find out, why water vapor won?t accumulate at the top of the terrarium.
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puscle
genius of love
Registered: 01/06/01
Posts: 4,539
Loc: NY
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Re: humidity [Re: Anno]
#485975 - 12/10/01 12:48 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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It remains heavier. Do the math. Nitrogen + oxygen + water vapour = heavier than dry air.
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Anno
Experimenter
Registered: 06/17/99
Posts: 24,167
Loc: my room
Last seen: 29 days, 16 hours
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Re: humidity [Re: puscle]
#485989 - 12/10/01 01:00 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Hehe, you didn?t seem to have taken the physics and chemistry classes too seriously.
As long we assume the ideal gas low valid here( and it is, because nitrogen and oxigen having a very low boiling points and water vapor only having a small concentration) then each mol( 6.022 x 10E23 particles) of each gas has a volume of 22.4 liter at the atmospheric pressure and 0?C.
1 mol of each of this gas weighs as much as the molecular weight of it, namely 28 g for nitrogen, 32 for oxigen, 18 for water vapor.
Since the density is defined as the mass per volume and the volume is the same, the lightest component of that 3 is water vapor, then nitrogen, then oxigen.
Edited by Anno (12/11/01 09:29 AM)
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Necron99
Protect youreyes from flyingsugar!
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 735
Loc: SATx
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
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Re: humidity [Re: puscle]
#485993 - 12/10/01 01:03 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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If the vapor is cooler than the surrounding air, it's gonna go straight down, but will eventually, over the course of hours, diffuse thru the terrarium temp notwithstanding. The concentration of vapor will be less at the top tho.....
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"Puny earthlings do not yet know the meaning of the word suffering!!"
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puscle
genius of love
Registered: 01/06/01
Posts: 4,539
Loc: NY
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Re: humidity [Re: Anno]
#486004 - 12/10/01 01:11 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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No fair! You're using empirical logic.
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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Re: humidity [Re: Anno]
#486069 - 12/10/01 01:56 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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I get so hard watching great minds at work...
Thankyou Anno, Necron you get a honorable mention for your observation that the surrounding air temp is an important factor.
Puscle? You win some you lose some buddie...lol
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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XAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 22 years, 9 days
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very interesting...i'm printing this thread to do some research. thanx anno, necron, and puscle!!!
--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."
Bob Marley
Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!
http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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Re: humidity [Re: XAZIA]
#486423 - 12/10/01 07:26 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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Your welcome....
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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upupup
guardian
Registered: 08/25/01
Posts: 889
Loc: George "I love Hitler" Bu...
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
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Billy, That pic you have looks just like my wife!
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Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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 Re: humidity [Re: upupup]
#486532 - 12/10/01 08:35 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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yeah right in your freakin dreams...lol
Seriously? Strawberry red hair, HUGE breasts and a KILLER body?
Would you mind if I seen her pic? You have my promise it will not leave my computer hahaa
Lucky dude..
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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tripyfungi
Stranger
Registered: 10/30/01
Posts: 45
Loc: BC, Canada
Last seen: 21 years, 10 months
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Re: humidity [Re: Anno]
#486543 - 12/10/01 08:40 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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ummm..pretty sure that water molecules are made from 2 hydrogen and one oxygen molecule....why were you saying nitrogen??
Hence H2O....where does nitrogen come in?
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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I think Anno was referring to "air" when he mentioned the nitrogen and "oxigene"...
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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Trail_Blazer
enthusiast
Registered: 11/07/01
Posts: 364
Last seen: 18 years, 11 months
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He was talking about dry air containing nitrogen, not water vapor tripyfungi.
And what are you talking about, water is made of mercury, uranium, and various other toxic waste molecules. Well at least thats true here in jersey.
Peace
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[green]There is a fine line between genius and insanity, I have erased this line.[/green]
Visit FSR
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Necron99
Protect youreyes from flyingsugar!
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 735
Loc: SATx
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
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Anno was saying (I think) that air comprises large qauntities of nitrogen,much smaller quantities of oxygen and that the water vapor is present in the air in even smaller quantity and therefore, lighter.....
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"Puny earthlings do not yet know the meaning of the word suffering!!"
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Anno
Experimenter
Registered: 06/17/99
Posts: 24,167
Loc: my room
Last seen: 29 days, 16 hours
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Re: humidity [Re: Necron99]
#486759 - 12/10/01 11:48 PM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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I stated that water vapor is lighter because if it?s smaller molecular weight.
Please read the links under http://www.google.com/search?q=water+vapor+lighter+than+air&hl=en&btnG=Google-Suche&lr=.
Quote:
"Humidity and air density
Most people who haven't studied physics or chemistry find it hard to believe that humid air is lighter, or less dense, than dry air. How can the air become lighter if we add water vapor to it?
Scientists have known this for a long time. The first was Isaac Newton, who stated that humid air is less dense than dry air in 1717 in his book, Optics. But, other scientists didn't generally understand this until later in that century.
To see why humid air is less dense than dry air, we need to turn to one of the laws of nature the Italian physicist Amadeo Avogadro discovered in the early 1800s. In simple terms, he found that a fixed volume of gas, say one cubic meter, at the same temperature and pressure, would always have the same number of molecules no matter what gas is in the container. Most beginning chemistry books explain how this works.
Imagine a cubic foot of perfectly dry air. It contains about 78% nitrogen molecules, which each have an atomic weight of 28. Another 21% of the air is oxygen, with each molecule having an atomic weight of 32. The final one percent is a mixture of other gases, which we won't worry about. Molecules are free to move in and out of our cubic foot of air. What Avogadro discovered leads us to conclude that if we added water vapor molecules to our cubic foot of air, some of the nitrogen and oxygen molecules would leave ? remember, the total number of molecules in our cubic foot of air stays the same. The water molecules that replace nitrogen or oxygen have an atomic weight of 18. This is lighter than both nitrogen and oxygen. In other words, replacing nitrogen and oxygen with water vapor decreases the weight of the air in the cubic foot; that is, it's density decreases.
Wait a minute, you might say, "I know water's heavier than air." True, liquid water is heavier, or more dense, than air. But, the water that makes the air humid isn't liquid. It's water vapor, which is a gas that is lighter than nitrogen or oxygen.
Compared to the differences made by temperature and air pressure, humidity has a small effect on the air's density. But, humid air is lighter than dry air at the same temperature and pressure."
Edited by Anno (12/11/01 12:05 AM)
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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Re: humidity [Re: Anno]
#487148 - 12/11/01 07:48 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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I learned something today, excellent post...
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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Necron99
Protect youreyes from flyingsugar!
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 735
Loc: SATx
Last seen: 11 years, 7 months
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Agreed.
Thx Anno.
When I was young I never thought I'd regret getting so stoned all thru high school.....
Thx for the link, too.....
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"Puny earthlings do not yet know the meaning of the word suffering!!"
Edited by Necron99 (12/11/01 07:54 AM)
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XAZIA
glitter goddess
Registered: 08/22/01
Posts: 678
Loc: oklahoma
Last seen: 22 years, 9 days
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Re: humidity [Re: Necron99]
#487225 - 12/11/01 09:50 AM (22 years, 9 months ago) |
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i understand completely!! excellent info anno, appreciate the link, and this definitely helps me with my set-up!!
--------------------
"Emancipate yourself from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds."
Bob Marley
Remember, EGOISM is the beginning, the source, and the root of EVIL!
http://www.fanaticus.com/pf-tek.htm
http://www.mycotopia.net/teks/hongus.html
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