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OfflineKonnrade
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Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con?
    #4710052 - 09/25/05 03:53 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

LSD was the reason I chose to go for a chemistry major (well, my fondness of explosives synths helped, but mostly the LSD synth interest). I am interested in learning the facets of chemistry reflected in the synthesis of LSD, as well as getting the kind of credentials a man needs to have a legitimate laboratory that would be less suspicious if the chems were to be procured.

That being said, I'm a general chemistry major at the moment, but I'm in my first semester... still deciding if I want to specialize or not. A general chem bachelor's would be far easier, but organic chem would be tons more useful knowledge. What are you opinions on this? Are the pros of being a qualified organic chemist, combined with the knowledge behind a good LSD synth, worth the extra work on my bachelor's?

*edit* I decided a bit of info about myself would be relevant. For reference, I have an approximate IQ of 156, with specific talent in the field of science as a whole and special interest in chemistry specifically. I have extensive prior education in logic and reasoning. However, I am adverse to large workloads, as I value time at home and feel it should be kept as unsullied as possible by stress from school or work. Organic chemistry is interesting to me, but is more complicated and daunting a subject to me, as the subject matter is as intricate and complex as are the molecules commonly dealt with. I lean towards organic chem ATM but am still mostly ambivolent.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing


Edited by Konnrade (09/25/05 03:57 PM)


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InvisiblePenguarky Tunguin
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Konnrade]
    #4710126 - 09/25/05 04:13 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

So you're getting into chemistry to learn how to create LSD and create it less suspiciously? Seems like a lot of work and a lot of time.


McKennaDMT


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Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.


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OfflineMaJikFungus
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Penguarky Tunguin]
    #4710253 - 09/25/05 04:48 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

I'm not sure getting an BS in organic chem soley for LSD synthesis is such a good idea. A degree in chem is not absolutly necessary to synthesize LSD , just like a degree in mycology is not needed to grow mushrooms and a degree in horticulture is not needed to grow cannabis. Though I admit LSD synthesis is much more difficult than either , you could probably get away with just taking organic chem I&II and studying the procedure carefully.

Basically what I'm trying to say is don't major in something soley for the purpose of creating mind altering substances , but if you really enjoy chem and would like to pursue an actual legitimate career in it then I say go for it.


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OfflineKonnrade
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: MaJikFungus]
    #4710657 - 09/25/05 06:17 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

oh, perhaps I've said the wrong thing. What I mean is that in addition to learning to synthesize it, I'd also like to learn about the field in general. I want to understand the chemistry of LSD, how to synth it, what can yield it. I also think a BS in organic chem would yield large amounts of insight into my prolific interest in ethnobotanicals and entheogens as a whole. Also, if somewhere down the road I need to fall back on this education, I could land a job that could support further education, perhaps into neurochemistry, thus broadening and solidifying my understanding of psychoactive materials.

Also, my chosen career dictates some form of college degree, though the subject of that degree is unimportant if not irrelevant. This means I have to have a degree, just for the sake of having one, so I should just choose one I can have fun learning and benefit from. I won't discuss the career, however, as I'd rather avoid harming my chances. Security is very tight in the occupation I chose to pursue, and there's a chance I won't make it through the screening process allready. No need to increase those chances.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing


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OfflineNCognito
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Konnrade]
    #4710738 - 09/25/05 06:36 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Nothing like making major life decisions based on drugs...you sound like a smart cat...just choose something that you find interesting and fulfilling.


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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: NCognito]
    #4711641 - 09/25/05 11:07 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

here's what Dr. Shulgin has to say on the subject...

http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/shulgin/blg/2005/06/psychedelic-science-how-to-prepare.html

the person asking the question is asking from a botanist point of view, but his answer can pretty much be applied to a wide range of psychedelic science


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OfflineKonnrade
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: dr0mni]
    #4711811 - 09/25/05 11:38 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Hrm... that puts things in a point of view I hadn't necessarily contemplated. I'll have to apply that to my thinking.

Thanks for the link, that was really useful!


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I find your lack of faith disturbing


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Invisiblebadchad
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Konnrade]
    #4712979 - 09/26/05 07:45 AM (11 years, 2 months ago)

If these are your ambitions be prepared to stay in school for quite some time. A bachelor's degree will land you a position as a laboratory technician and little more. Thus, you'll be working under someone else's supervision in someone else's laboratory. Conditions which aren't conducive to what you want to do.


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...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436


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OfflinePsiloman
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Konnrade]
    #4712995 - 09/26/05 08:07 AM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Hmmmm

A difficult desicion.Be sure to have that "fire",that interest that motivates you which ,in my opinion, should go further than "at one point i would like to have access to reagents and equipment to synthesize psychoactives". It would be quite of a disappointment to lets say work on something completely unrelated and wait till you shift finishes to makes that "dirty lil synth".

Personaly i have pursuit academically a field of science.It started with no knowledge of psychoactives. I always though had a fascination on numan consciousness in various forms. Now,when i discovered psychedelics,that such compounds exist and exert their action in a brain with very interesting mechanisms,my PRE-EXISTING fire was fed! I started looking more into it! I developed an interest for botany,for psychopharmacology,for psychology and psychiatry ,a bit about chemistry and for "consciousness studies" in general from Transcranial magnetic stimulation to techniques that can be used in a psychotherapeutic enviroment. Of course,in todays society i cannot pursuit ALL OF THEM to the same degree,if i try i will either be Da Vinci of some sort or "jack of all trades,master of none"..

Still,it opened new horizons for me and i have varied interests.

So you must have the "fire" from the start,i believe i was born with an "inquiring mind in the field of science" because im one of those guys fascinated by things around him ,but always asking an extra "why" most people wont ask.


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Offlineheavensgate
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Psiloman]
    #4713947 - 09/26/05 02:00 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think you would need that just to make lsd...if you have a good amount of chemistry knowledge anyway, and you were really determined to read up on the process, etc, you should be able to pull it off...the main thing that would make it hard is just acquiring the necessary equipment, finding a source for ergotamine tartrate or similar, finding out how to get it into the country and keep it here in large quantities, where to have the lab, finding trusted people to deal with for distribution...


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OfflineKonnrade
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Re: Should I shift my major to Organic chem? Pro/con? [Re: Konnrade]
    #4715565 - 09/26/05 06:57 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

After pondering on it, keeping in mind the input I've gotten, I decided to keep my goal as a bachelor's in standard chemistry. Later on I can build upon that and study other fields, such as organic chem, or pharmacology.

I'll also just take classes on the side here and there that aren't necessary but are useful to my interest. Yes, I had an interest in chemistry, science, and even psychology, prior to my introduction to psychedellics. And then mescaline came along, introduced me to psychedellics as a whole, and just fed into that interest. I realize now that I want to study in this field, perhaps do research in the future (unsanctioned if I need to).

Of course, I'll need more than just a bachelor's degree. I just want to get the more immediate and pressing issues decided before I make plans for any higher degrees.

I know that I dwouldnt need a chem degree to understand LSD synthesis, I'd just need to have paid attention in chem and/or organic chem classes, or done some research. But, I'd rather apply the knowledge I had to learn to do so towards getting a credential, I might as well after all.


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I find your lack of faith disturbing


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