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InvisibleMoonshoe
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what goes up MUST come down?
    #4691603 - 09/21/05 08:31 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

im wondering if this is an unbeatable rule of life. What goes up must come down, the bigger they all the harder they fall, everything gives rise to its opposite, yin becomes yang etc etc.

I mean this in referance to my spiritual progress. I seem to go in waves or swing like a pendulum. I get on a streak, my cognitive functions are clearer, my emotions are more joyous, things start to click, my life becomes healthier, more productive and more abundant in joy and love. I begin to percieve spiritual truths more clearly, i start to feel quite high from vibes and life without drugs, and i feel like im just going to keep rising until i "break through"


and then i munch out and jack off and smoke some weed or go on a drinking binge or whatever... not that i degenerate into some seriously destructive cycle, its all in moderation, and nothing abnormal for a teenager, but its definetly a return to the physical plane, the realm of sensation, the ten thousand things, maya or whatever. Buying back into the illusion.

Conversly, usually the day after a party binge, the morning after, is when i feel the most clear headed, the most determined to realign my life, and i start going up again...

you guys get what im saying? it feels like the human psyche demands this constant give and take, this balance between the higher and lower realms. what goes up, must come down. Not that i dont notice a kind of slow, gradual progress, but its like 3 steps forward, 2 steps back.

I wonder is there a way to conquer this and just keep going up up up?

and if so, is that even healthy?

can anyone relate?

:confused:...... :grin:


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OfflineMJF
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4691645 - 09/21/05 08:39 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

sorry to long and too drunk for me to read..
but....

what i think about when i read your thread subject is...

singular duality.


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Offlineqhr0me
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: MJF]
    #4692003 - 09/21/05 09:48 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

mjf, i figured i'd google 'what the fuck is a singular duality' and this came up. is that what you had in mind?-)

moonshoe, non-duality is the way to not give a shit which way you go!


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4692094 - 09/21/05 10:07 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

I think you are right.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4692477 - 09/21/05 11:23 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

The Western Hermetic Tradition of the union of opposites [Conjunctio Oppositorum].

The Tree of Life, upon which we must also balance the opposing principles and arrive at harmony in order to ascend. Apparently, this is The Way - the only Way. Otherwise there is that 'wailing and gnashing of teeth, and being thrown into outer darkness' (Bible lore, not Ghostbusters)  :wink:


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #4692608 - 09/21/05 11:46 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

i know exactly what you mean, i find myself in the same cycle. however i think the down periods can be helpful overall in driving you upwards, as you say after you come down is when you feel most determined to go back up. for me going down helps remind me why i'm going up in the first place, it shows me what i want to leave behind and why. gradually i gain more strength and no longer fall prey to temptation because i look back at the past and see where giving into that temptation lead me and i see that it did not lead to satisfaction. eventually you should reach a point where you stop comming down, you stop desiring to come down and you're greatest pleasure is the joy of rising higher and higher.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Deviate]
    #4693888 - 09/22/05 05:22 AM (11 years, 2 months ago)

the up and down is given, like rolling hills, but they are rising in the distance as the path progresses, eventually the troughs are higher than the peaks from before:

the above illustration of the MOON is largely about unconscious and dreams - i remember the rolling hills depicted, and how encouraging that image can be.
in answer
coming down need not be as far as going up.
(past the peak of development up and down have been transcended)


Edited by redgreenvines (09/22/05 06:08 AM)


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4694106 - 09/22/05 09:18 AM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Without the downs how will you recognize the ups? That's the gist of what I'm thinking. Every down makes the next up that much more meaningful.


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OfflineGomp
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4695202 - 09/22/05 03:00 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

no... lies...


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OfflineMJF
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4695274 - 09/22/05 03:12 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

what is that symbol to the right of the moon?


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: MJF]
    #4695381 - 09/22/05 03:38 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

18 yods are depicted around the moon
yods are considered representative of the hand of god == unseen power

18 is this card's number hence the 18 yods
(18 is also the number for chai or life generally taken as an auspicious thing)
1+8=9 (numerologically pointing at the Hermit card #9, which is Yod itself - depicting a wizened man who has renounced the world and gone up that mountain)

I like to consider that the 18 yods or unseen influences, take the attention off the rolling hills or any other mundane element which may have become "galling or disappointing" - such as the complaint embedded in title of this thread.

So once you lift your eyes up, you can see not only the origin from the sea (mind is the water), a goal in the distance which is high and full of perspective or wisdom, the gradually rising peaks and troughs (this thread topic), but also the preponderance of unseen influences (nature & life) which are worth observing all around us.

This observance of all nature gets us off of the worry about the particular path's hardships and gets us right into the essence of what is happenning - the moment as we make our way.


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OfflineMJF
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4695387 - 09/22/05 03:41 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

no the symbol to the right of "The Moon"


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OnlineAsanteA
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4695440 - 09/22/05 03:56 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

If you believe in logic and some other assorted sci stuff then most things have their ups and downs but eventually return to the middle road.

But! In Germany in the first half of the 20th century there was a man who actually won the first prize in a huge lottery three times in a row.

A casino in Monte Carlo had a roulette wheel that on one evening had a streak of some 60 times "black" without interruption.

In a universe with 100.000.000 galaxies of 100.000.000 stars each there is no telling how far you might rise, how high you might soar.

Science dictates it utmostly unlikely but you could start winning the lottery every single day of the rest of your life.

Similarly you might go up-up-up spiritually for the rest of your life for years on end, and will it not return to baseline before you die in lessay the year 2100.

So yes, things tend to return to baseline, but that does not mean that what goes up actually has to come down in your lifetime :heart:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: MJF]
    #4695460 - 09/22/05 03:59 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

that is a hebrew letter for this card which is 18 kaf


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OfflineMJF
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4695462 - 09/22/05 04:01 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

interesting. what kind of cards are those?


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4695487 - 09/22/05 04:08 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

This law only applies to the mediocre; give an object enough energy in its rise upwards, and it will never come back down.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Moonshoe]
    #4695510 - 09/22/05 04:15 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

I was reading this thread and as I read my brother suddenly sent me a link on msn. I was aiming for the first chapter but accidentally hit the second, and I guess I'll have to play along.

Under Heaven all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness.
All can know good as good only because there is evil.
Therefore having and not having arise together.
Difficult and easy complement each other.
Long and short contrast with each other;
High and low rest upon each other;
Voice and sound harmonise each other;
Front and back follow one another.
Therefore the sage goes about doing nothing, teaching no talking.
The ten thousand things rise and fall without cease, creating, yet not possessing, working, yet not taking credit, work is done, then forgotten.
Therefore it lasts for ever.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: dorkus]
    #4695520 - 09/22/05 04:17 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Lao Tzu?


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Invisibledorkus
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: Veritas]
    #4695692 - 09/22/05 04:58 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

It is. :sun:


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: what goes up MUST come down? [Re: dorkus]
    #4695712 - 09/22/05 05:02 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

:kiss:


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