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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
LVT and oil
    #4660774 - 09/14/05 05:18 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

As I understand it the underlying ideology behind Georgism is that man did not create the land and thus no single man has the right say I own this land. Rather people become tenants of the land which is for lack of better word owned by the community.

How does such a system deal with oil or other non-renewable resources? If I were to become tenant of a certain parcel of land and then extracted all valuable resources and sold them I would be taking away permanently from the community. I would in effect be staking claim to something that man didn't create and thus it would appear be at odds with Georgism. The same could be said about oil. If a company became the tenant of a certain piece of land and extracted all the oil they would be taking something that wasn't really theirs.

How does Georgism deal with such situations?


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: LVT and oil [Re: cb9fl]
    #4660874 - 09/14/05 05:35 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
As I understand it the underlying ideology behind Georgism is that man did not create the land and thus no single man has the right say I own this land. Rather people become tenants of the land which is for lack of better word owned by the community.



To some extent, yes. It might be helpful to look at in terms of how Proudhoun differentiated between property and possession. One may possess land under a Georgist system. They simply may not use that possession to extract profit(rent) from others.

Quote:

How does such a system deal with oil or other non-renewable resources? If I were to become tenant of a certain parcel of land and then extracted all valuable resources and sold them I would be taking away permanently from the community. I would in effect be staking claim to something that man didn't create and thus it would appear be at odds with Georgism. The same could be said about oil. If a company became the tenant of a certain piece of land and extracted all the oil they would be taking something that wasn't really theirs.

How does Georgism deal with such situations?



The principle behind land value taxation may also be applied to natural resources, in proportion to their scarcity. An tax could be placed on the extraction oil from the ground if it reflects the loss to society incurred by it. Unlike LVT, this tax would affect the price of petroleum, and thus petroleum-based products. However, if that price reflects its social cost, I would consider it to be a justified price increase. The same principle can be applied to things like logging, fishing, hunting, and the broadcast spectrum.


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: LVT and oil [Re: Silversoul]
    #4660895 - 09/14/05 05:39 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Diamonds, silicon, gold ... wouldn't it have to apply to anything the tenant took from the land?

How would the tax associated with extracting materials from the land be calculated and who would implement it?


--------------------
It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: LVT and oil [Re: cb9fl]
    #4660967 - 09/14/05 05:51 PM (11 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
Diamonds, silicon, gold ... wouldn't it have to apply to anything the tenant took from the land?



Pretty much, though the rate of taxation would depend upon its scarcity, social value, renewability, and reusability. Since oil is used up in a way in which it cannot be reused, it warrants a tax for its extraction. However, a diamond, as they say, is forever. They can be reused, and there doesn't seem to be any threat of a diamond shortage, so they would warrant little if any tax(though the damage done by mining might warrant some sort of compensation). If you picked up something that was commonplace and had no real social value, such as a stick or rock, there would obviously be no need for a tax on such items. When looking at renewable resources such as timber, you have to take into account how long it would take for a forested area to regrow, and the social cost of cutting it down.

Quote:

How would the tax associated with extracting materials from the land be calculated and who would implement it?



As I mentioned, you have to take into account factors such as scarcity, social value, renewability, and reusability, as well as some others that I probably haven't thought about. I can assure you, however, that the calculations can be done by any trained economist who studies such things.


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