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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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patriotism
    #4633067 - 09/08/05 08:03 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Is it dangerous, or something to be proud of?


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Offlinepsychomime
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Re: patriotism [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4633071 - 09/08/05 08:07 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

depends how fanatical one gets about it. I find Hue's patriotism inspiring while I find looner2's to be worrying.


Edited by psychomime (09/08/05 09:29 AM)


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OfflineDelusion_of_Self
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Registered: 03/14/05
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Re: patriotism [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4633072 - 09/08/05 08:07 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

It can be very dangerous and it centainly brings us more apart.


--------------------
"It is never a question of belief; the only scientific attitude one can take on any subject is whether it is true. The law of gravitation worked as efficiently before Newton as after him. The cosmos would be fairly chaotic if its laws could not operate without the sanction of human belief." -- Sri Yukteswar


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: patriotism [Re: Delusion_of_Self]
    #4633119 - 09/08/05 09:02 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Patriotism is a wonderful thing. It not only ties a group of people to history and culture, but it ensures safety and survival from outside threats. Being united under patriotism is a powerful force and should be nurtured and encouraged at youth to adulthood.


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: patriotism [Re: looner2]
    #4633132 - 09/08/05 09:15 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I don't think it ties people together, it separates them in smaller groups.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineGulGen
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Re: patriotism [Re: looner2]
    #4633169 - 09/08/05 10:00 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Patriotism is a wonderful thing. It not only ties a group of people to history and culture, but it ensures safety and survival from outside threats. Being united under patriotism is a powerful force and should be nurtured and encouraged at youth to adulthood.




Yes, I agree completely. :thumbup: It is a powerful force and should be nurtured at all times. If our fine history and culture is to be preserved, we must make sure that our children follow our one true path and not be blinded by others. We must teach them to defend themselves against outside pressures to our ways however they can.

Praise Allah! Death to the infidels! Those Americans must pay for insulting our ways! :mad: :mad2:

Fuck peace and unity and all that, blind patriotism is obviously the way to go. I mean, just where would we be today if nobody cared enough to fight over things like who's omnipotent imaginary friend was real and who's was made up?


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OfflineGomp
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Re: patriotism [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4633182 - 09/08/05 10:18 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Yes!

:smile:


--------------------


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Disclaimer!?


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: patriotism [Re: looner2]
    #4633234 - 09/08/05 10:44 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
...but it ensures safety and survival from outside threats.





Yes, to quote George W. Bush, "America is weak, but if we intimidate them, they will leave us alone".

It's sort of pathetically sad, really, that type of primitive mentality. :frown:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: patriotism [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4633237 - 09/08/05 10:47 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks for saying that before I had to.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: patriotism [Re: Icelander]
    #4633239 - 09/08/05 10:48 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Patriotism is good, but I would say zealous "flag waving" is bad.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: patriotism [Re: Redstorm]
    #4633258 - 09/08/05 10:56 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
Patriotism is good, but I would say zealous "flag waving" is bad.




...pancakes gooood, rain baaaad...

would you care to elaborate?


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: patriotism [Re: Redstorm]
    #4633267 - 09/08/05 11:01 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
Patriotism is good, but I would say zealous "flag waving" is bad.




I would call into greater question that which we are patriotic of, the true aspects that make up that which we are patriotic of, and whether or not we allow our patriotism to impede our perceptions and understandings of reality.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: patriotism [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4633356 - 09/08/05 12:02 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Depends what you mean by patriotism. To me, patriotism is about wanting what's best for your country. It's not about blindly following your leaders or having a "United We Stand" bumper sticker on your car. Jingoism, on the other hand, needs to go.


--------------------


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: patriotism [Re: Silversoul]
    #4633497 - 09/08/05 12:45 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I think we've been through this discussion before. I quit using the word patriot to describe myself ( I consider myself one ) because it tends to lump me in with people like looner, and I definitely do not agree with his views. In fact I consider his views unpatriotic.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: patriotism [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4633505 - 09/08/05 12:48 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
It's sort of pathetically sad, really, that type of primitive mentality. :frown:





What primitive mentality?


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleSwami
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Re: patriotism [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4633514 - 09/08/05 12:54 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Patriotism means believing you are part of an arbitrary subset of humanity. It is a fallacious and primitive idea that no longer serves us.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblelooner2
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Re: patriotism [Re: Swami]
    #4633536 - 09/08/05 01:04 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Patriotism means believing you are part of an arbitrary subset of humanity. It is a fallacious and primitive idea that no longer serves us.




Your first sentence is right on. This arbitrary subset is the line of a border.

However, these lines are far from fallacious because they are in fact, real. The nation contained within these lines is the largest of any arbitrary subset of human beings and is the most powerful.

Struggle manifests itself through interaction between different nations and loyalty to your nation ensures your survival against the forces of others.

To think otherwise or imagine that you are part of something that does not exist is the most primitive thinking of all, and has dangerous consequences.


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: patriotism [Re: looner2]
    #4637365 - 09/09/05 12:09 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

The trouble with you position is always the same. My country right or wrong. From a spiritual perspective that's insane. You become a sheep, pawn and idiot for anyone in control of your country. Its the worse form of insanity and no human evolution is possible. You might as well be a reptile.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblelooner2
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Registered: 06/20/04
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Re: patriotism [Re: Icelander]
    #4637392 - 09/09/05 12:20 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
The trouble with you position is always the same. My country right or wrong.




I never said that. Why are you making things up?


Quote:

Icelander said:From a spiritual perspective that's insane.




I don't give a shit about a spiritual perspective, I give a shit about reality. This forum also deals with philosophy, which is an attempt at understanding reality.

Quote:

Icelander said:You become a sheep, pawn and idiot for anyone in control of your country. Its the worse form of insanity and no human evolution is possible. You might as well be a reptile.




It gets tiring trying to pull shit of peoples posts in an attempt to discern what they are trying to say.

Elections, governments, laws...etc... do they ring a bell with you in anyway? There is structure and order to a government and country.


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: patriotism [Re: looner2]
    #4637464 - 09/09/05 12:42 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
The trouble with you position is always the same. My country right or wrong.




I never said that. Why are you making things up?


Quote:

Icelander said:From a spiritual perspective that's insane.




I don't give a shit about a spiritual perspective, I give a shit about reality. This forum also deals with philosophy, which is an attempt at understanding reality.

Quote:

Icelander said:You become a sheep, pawn and idiot for anyone in control of your country. Its the worse form of insanity and no human evolution is possible. You might as well be a reptile.




It gets tiring trying to pull shit of peoples posts in an attempt to discern what they are trying to say.

Elections, governments, laws...etc... do they ring a bell with you in anyway? There is structure and order to a government and country.




In a previous thread on this subject you made the statement that we are to follow the decisions of our govt and we should not question their decisions. Remember?

If you don't give a shit about spirit then why would you care about anything but survival of your physical body. The scope of your life experience is limited IMO because of your lack of experience with your own spiritual being. You can't use what you don't understand.

I live on earth because I was born here. There is where my allegiance is. My aim is to evolve past the separation of individual Govts. This is a process and cannot be done at once. The first step is to become a country of principles and values that reflect what we preach to the world. If we say we care about human life and world peace and love and God. Then we have to quite lying cheating and stealing. Of course actually I don't believe these changes will come about through politics. They are individual changes in the human heart done by ordinary people like you and me. I don't believe majority rules every aspect of my life. I am willing to sacrifice myself for my truth to the best of my ability. If that doesn't jibe with my countrys rules then I am a country unto myself.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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