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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Heteroabsolutism
    #461263 - 11/17/01 12:01 PM (21 years, 10 months ago)

It's basically what I call my belief system. The only thing absolute is now. Right now, I believe that whatever is true to me is the absolute truth until I am corrected by a perceptual shift or by some other person. My thoughts and/or actions depend on my current concept of right is in that situation. Unlike contingent truth, whatever is done in one situation is absolutely right in all situations EXACTLY (same person, place, time, etc...) like that one. Of course, this is assuming that I am always being honest with myself and only do what I know is right in whatever situation I am in. This is not relativism because if someone else has something different to say and they cannot back up their point of view better than I can back up mine, then I am right and they are wrong.
?

So, we see here that socially, heteroabsolutism is quite tricky and much more complex. But when isolated, the heteroabsolutist has nothing but their current perspective of the world to draw conclusions and truths. So, we really can't be pissed at them for making a mistake every once-in-a-while. But, if after significant social interaction (read: correction) they still do not adopt the "righter" stance, then they can no longer be called heteroabsolutists- they can safely be called morons.
?


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #808557 - 08/10/02 08:05 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Hmmmm

Whence cometh such strange but unoriginal ideas?

Is this James talking or Aristotle?

What do you make of the correspondence theory of truth? I'm a big fan despite its obvious flaws. Then again, I've got season tickets to the World Series of Philosophical Pursuit.

Excellent thread! Please, lead on.

Cheers,


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: ]
    #808599 - 08/10/02 08:36 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Whence cometh such strange but unoriginal ideas?
Is this James talking or Aristotle?


The word 'pragmatism' has almost as many foul connotations as 'psychedelic'. And I can't really call it Zen, because there's a religion there...

What do you make of the correspondence theory of truth?
Well, I argued my Epistemology professor into the ground on these same issues... boy did he get frustrated. In the end (just as my philosophy of mind professor in our many arguments on free will vs. determinism), he just said "okay, let's just move on"- the fucker wouldn't even admit that I had him cornered.
I don't like it... I'll have to read up on it again to tell you exactly why as it's been awhile since I forced myself to read all those boring epistemology theories.

Fuck, lemme get a book.... I'll be back.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #808606 - 08/10/02 08:41 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Cool.

I know what you mean about cornering someone on a philosophic point and then having them not admit it or even give an inch. I see that as a REAL function of the ego. With an attitude like that it is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to learn.

Yeah, I gotta clean out the chicken coop. I'll be back laterz.

Piece out, namaste, and dog ciao


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #808640 - 08/10/02 08:56 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

That's a reasonable belief system - similar to my own.

You would change your beliefs based on social interaction (correction) but would you change your belief system? I'm sure you would as you would apply the principles of that belief system to the belief system itself.

But there are many people out there who would gladly change their beliefs (and proclamin their open-mindedness) while their belief systems go unexamined.



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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #808641 - 08/10/02 08:57 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

the fucker wouldn't even admit that I had him cornered.

don't you hate it when that happens?



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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: infidelGOD]
    #808833 - 08/10/02 10:44 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

You would change your beliefs based on social interaction (correction) but would you change your belief system? I'm sure you would as you would apply the principles of that belief system to the belief system itself

It depends. I'm rigid on only one thing: adaptability. I doubt that I would experience anything that would change my adaptable belief system into something rigid (overall).
I figured out my system before I read James... deriving a system on your own (based on your own experience) is much more powerful than adopting someone else's, though finding your ideas (that you thought were unique) in the 100 year old writings of an important philosopher add a little more credence to your ideas.


But there are many people out there who would gladly change their beliefs (and proclamin their open-mindedness) while their belief systems go unexamined.

I think that an unbiased and in-depth study of philosophy (paired up with the occasional, complete ego-loss of a strong entheogenic experience) is a helpful method of putting oneself in the proper state for metaprogramming. It's not a sureshot, but I think it is definitely helpful.


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Anonymous

Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #809092 - 08/10/02 01:48 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

...though finding your ideas (that you thought were unique) in the 100 year old writings of an important philosopher add a little more credence to your ideas.

Careful that you aren't just repeating the same mistakes your predecessor made.

Phaedrus/Poincar??

I think that an unbiased and in-depth study of philosophy (paired up with the occasional, complete ego-loss of a strong entheogenic experience) is a helpful method of putting oneself in the proper state for metaprogramming. It's not a sureshot, but I think it is definitely helpful.

I would agree and add that the phrase, "strong entheogenic experience" might be exchanged for, "strong spiritual experience". They are similar but not exactly the same thing.

Cheers,


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: ]
    #809662 - 08/10/02 06:32 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

...though finding your ideas (that you thought were unique) in the 100 year old writings of an important philosopher add a little more credence to your ideas.
Careful that you aren't just repeating the same mistakes your predecessor made.

Well... yeah. Mistakes must be cleared up. Though I haven't found any major mistakes in any James' writings yet. Of course, I haven't read ALL of James yet (or Nietzsche or, well, anybody- hey, I'm 23).
Some of my ideas I haven't found anywhere yet (I guess I always have to have that 'yet' in there, don't I?), so I guess predecessors only help out for some of my thoughts.


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Offlinewhiterastahippie
lover

Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 718
Loc: look into a child's eyes,...
Last seen: 20 years, 9 months
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #810052 - 08/10/02 11:51 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

if knowledge does not free the self from the self, then ignorance is better than such knowledge.


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Peace and Love to all!


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: whiterastahippie]
    #810256 - 08/11/02 06:02 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Care to elaborate on that?
(It's just too vague.)


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Offlinemirrorsaw
journeyman
Registered: 08/03/02
Posts: 52
Last seen: 21 years, 1 month
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #810395 - 08/11/02 07:16 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

So you believe what you believe, but you keep an open mind.

did you have to dress it up?


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Registered: 11/23/01
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Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: whiterastahippie]
    #810403 - 08/11/02 07:20 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Knowledge is the abyss.


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: mirrorsaw]
    #810415 - 08/11/02 07:28 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

So you believe what you believe, but you keep an open mind.
Close... I don't like what "belief" connotes... we need a new word for belief.
I have WORKING BELIEFS. That's all.

did you have to dress it up?
Always.


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OfflineChubbSubb
Zen Lunatic

Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 612
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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #810647 - 08/11/02 09:50 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

I like your ideas Sclorch
Trev,


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Those who know do not speak.
Those who speak do not know.


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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
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Registered: 10/18/00
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Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #811693 - 08/11/02 07:29 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Sclorch writes:

Though I haven't found any major mistakes in any James' writings yet.

Never fear... you will. Pragmatism is one of the easiest of the pseudo-philosophies to debunk.

pinky


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Adamist]
    #811843 - 08/11/02 10:03 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Knowledge is the abyss

If knowledge is the abyss, what does that make of ignorance?


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Phred]
    #812194 - 08/12/02 05:52 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Never fear... you will. Pragmatism is one of the easiest of the pseudo-philosophies to debunk.

I'd like to hear this... go on.


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Anonymous

Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Phred]
    #812537 - 08/12/02 08:41 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

By all means, I echo Sclorch's sentiment, please show us where James is in error.

I would like it if you would join our little dialectic.

Cheers,


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Anonymous

Re: Heteroabsolutism [Re: Sclorch]
    #812710 - 08/12/02 10:05 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Living in the now is a good thing indeed.


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