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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Post Hurricane Looting
    #4605717 - 08/31/05 10:45 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Not talking about people getting basics supplies from stores, but the wholesale and unneccesary thievery going on.

Yup, humans are a more spiritually advanced form of animal - NOT!


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleRavus
Not an EggshellWalker
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Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 7,991
Loc: Cave of the Patriarchs
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Swami]
    #4605739 - 08/31/05 10:49 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Why not? It's survival of the fittest now.

The easiest blow to an area can bring out the best survival methods of human nature, and if there's fresh meat and materials around, you can be damn sure people are going to take it.

Are you saying that if you were a poor person in a ruined city like New Orleans, where the flood waters are rising and ruining the stores anyway, you wouldn't take some products for personal use and enjoyment? I think after thousands of people have died and I'm trapped in a post-disaster environment being flooded by the ocean, I'd have more to worry about than laws.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Ravus]
    #4605770 - 08/31/05 10:54 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Most spiritual doctrines forbid stealing, even in times of hunger, so you can't really say stealing is spiritual


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleRavus
Not an EggshellWalker
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Registered: 07/18/03
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4605789 - 08/31/05 10:58 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Most spiritual doctrines are also bullshit.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Ravus]
    #4605790 - 08/31/05 10:58 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

So a good Bible-belt Christian can be excused for discarding the Ten Commandments or basic social law when there is a little drizzle? How many other scenarios override basic morality? Funny, but I saw no caveats on Moses' tablets or in the Bible nor in the law books. Guess it is OK to steal if you are out of work, dropped out of college, or whenever there is bad weather or just feel like society owes you a 42" plasma TV and a pair of nikes.

Whatever the excuse, true human nature is exposed in all its full glory.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinecrunchytoast
oppositional

Registered: 04/07/05
Posts: 1,133
Loc: aporia
Last seen: 10 years, 26 days
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Swami]
    #4605811 - 08/31/05 11:02 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Whatever the excuse, true human nature is exposed in all its full glory.




desire.


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"consensus on the nature of equilibrium is usually established by periodic conflict." -henry kissinger


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Ravus]
    #4605818 - 08/31/05 11:05 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
Most spiritual doctrines are also bullshit.




well a spiritual doctrine that alows stealing is incomplete because it leaves out many elements, for example the man who ownes, or thinks he ownes the stolen property. You can't build a working system without considering all elements that the system is supose to work for


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: crunchytoast]
    #4605834 - 08/31/05 11:07 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

crunchytoast said:
Quote:

Whatever the excuse, true human nature is exposed in all its full glory.




desire.




While desire might be a justification for anything in your eyes, it the eyes of others it is not. If you steal something from me, to me your desire is not enough of a reason for that.
You are not a 3 year old, the brain of an adult is capable of reacting on more complex patterns than desire-take machanism


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4605842 - 08/31/05 11:09 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Is it really? Why does the human operate than more on simple human nature?

We pretend to have gone beyond it, but in any serious circumstances, such as a fight or a disaster, human nature will always surface above these useless facades.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Invisiblevampirism
Stranger
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Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 8,120
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Swami]
    #4605845 - 08/31/05 11:09 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

does anything change if you consider that those things were going to be covered by insurance anyway?


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Ravus]
    #4605862 - 08/31/05 11:12 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

a monkey has hands to hold things, it would be stupid for him not to use them for that to pick up a bananna

same way, humans have a thinking brain, it would be stupid to disregard it and act on instinct when thinking brain can be used to arange society in ways usefull for everyone


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Offlinecrunchytoast
oppositional

Registered: 04/07/05
Posts: 1,133
Loc: aporia
Last seen: 10 years, 26 days
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4605874 - 08/31/05 11:14 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

While desire might be a justification for anything in your eyes, it the eyes of others it is not. If you steal something from me, to me your desire is not enough of a reason for that.




or maybe if i steal it, then my desire was sufficient reason. and if you stop me from stealing it, my desire was insufficient reason.

Quote:

You are not a 3 year old, the brain of an adult is capable of reacting on more complex patterns than desire-take machanism




how could the complex patterns like morality exist if humans didn't desire them?


--------------------
"consensus on the nature of equilibrium is usually established by periodic conflict." -henry kissinger


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4605900 - 08/31/05 11:19 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
a monkey has hands to hold things, it would be stupid for him not to use them for that to pick up a bananna

same way, humans have a thinking brain, it would be stupid to disregard it and act on instinct when thinking brain can be used to arange society in ways usefull for everyone




The human brain can adapt to many circumstances; in times of peace and order, we can use it to help others and create growth in society. In times of disasters, we can use it to help our own survival and welfare. We have to keep our mindset fluid so as to utilize every potential in every environment we'll face.

And I'm sure they used their brains; it's not easy getting through metal barricades to the gun shop.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Swami]
    #4606007 - 08/31/05 11:40 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

The Looters are the minority, meaning smaller percentage of all those affected. The perspective gets blown if you see hundreds of looters and forget to realise millions are desparately affected.

Many many more are "volunteering" there time and giving away resources to help others in that disaster. Other countries, 12 now have offered assistance. People are packing up their trucks and cars from as far as Michigan and CT to drive down and do what they can, on their own dime and time. People are writing donation checks as we speak. Nurses and doctors are driving and flying in to help for free.

A lot of unselfish generousity is pouring out of americans now as well.

Much more goodness of humanity is being drawn from this then bad.

Just wanted to keep this in perspective.

Until you are in their shoes, I don't think one can fathom the desperation those people are experiencing. Many of them were desperate before. NO has a 35% poverty rate as it is. The U.S. shouldn't have a poverty rate at all.

I think the bulk of the volunteers and generousity of donaters are redeeming the human race. :thumbup: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlineacoustic
barrmmmFFF
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Registered: 04/02/05
Posts: 137
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4606092 - 08/31/05 11:54 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

man who doesnt dream about raiding a store.. they got a chance to do it...jealousy


--------------------



"May the wind always be at your back, And the sun upon your face, And the winds of destiny carry you aloft, To Dance with the stars..."


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Offlineincubaby_421
half naked andfull witted
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Registered: 08/14/04
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: acoustic]
    #4606134 - 09/01/05 12:01 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

eat the dead bodies, simply ignore the doctrines like you always have, and for the love of goddess... SAVE BOURBON STREET!...

no, really though, there is a very good point to saying that human nature is exposed in its truest form(s), people are not good, people are greedy beings, the majrity of us at least.


--------------------
"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd



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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4606159 - 09/01/05 12:04 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Here are two quick examples that touched me. One lady on the radio said her 11 year old daughter, after watching the news, gave her mom all of her recent B-Day gift money and asked if she would buy water and get it to those people. An 11 year old giving up their B-Day cash to help? :eek:

Another family up north with 3 kids is offering to host a family that just became homeless. WOW! :eek:

This one is challenging me to keep from judging.

Listen to this one. This family with 3 young kids, left there home and made it through safe with there car.

What's the first thing they did when it was over and they were ordered not to go back. They went back. Their homes was TOTALED. On the way out, they ran out of gas, and blew a flat on the crappy roads. They sat in their car in a parking lot waiting for a store to open.

3 different people, gave them food and drinks, gas and a tire repair kit. They were all happy now. The news man asked, "Now what are you going to do?

The mom said, "take all of this back home" :wtf:

They are going to use what gas and little surplus they have to drive back into a disaster zone with 3 young children to a pile of rubble. I admit, I called them stupid.

Boggles the mind.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlineincubaby_421
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4606183 - 09/01/05 12:08 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

touching, indeed....

i cant help but wonder if these people are in shock from just losinf everything, i mean... seriously... is society really that far gone? please dont answer that, im afraid...


--------------------
"yet the more i dig, the more i consume, the more i unfold... the less protected i feel.
i am the spit on the hair of the son of an electron, swimming around the nucleus of a cell inside the sperm of a killer bee, and my purpose is as nebulous as why weve been bestowed with the capacity to give a shit" Brandon Boyd



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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Mr. Dogma Free
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Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 20,796
Loc: The Hand
Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: Swami]
    #4606330 - 09/01/05 12:34 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I always think it is amusing when people try to justify stealing if it is to feed themselves. It is still stealing. The only question is to what degree.

Now, some people would find jewelry or the latest TV to be absolutely "necessary" to their well being. Who are we to judge the level of their needs?

I had predicted a death toll of 20,000 for this one based on the full brunt Class 5 hitting to the west side of NO. It sounds like we will be in the thousands even with the early turn north.


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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Offlineleviticus2013
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Registered: 11/15/04
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Re: Post Hurricane Looting [Re: incubaby_421]
    #4606513 - 09/01/05 12:59 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

You people who say they shouldnt take what they need have never felt hunger.  You dont know how it is to have nothing.  Hunger is not only in the belly.  To consider it "stealing" when they all have nothing is GREED!  And to blame them for being stuck in this poverty unable to move becuase of poverty is just plain special.  Most of you know that this was intentionaly designed like this.  You know the people who escaped from the terrordome told every one what they are doing to them.  This is why the gunshops were looted and the gangs out there were already heavily armed.  Looks like they are creating an unstable environment to make people flip out.  If this was cuased by someone messing with the ionisphere the path of the destruction is not the only miscalculation.    I think the reason this was aloud to happen was for mass release and the begining of the end :mushroom2:.


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