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OfflineSkootz
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Registered: 07/06/05
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potency question
    #4604620 - 08/31/05 07:28 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Are there any methods to increase the potency my shrooms?


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OfflinetheBRINK
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Re: potency question [Re: Skootz]
    #4604662 - 08/31/05 07:38 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

spawn to poo


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InvisibleHolydiver
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Re: potency question [Re: theBRINK]
    #4604674 - 08/31/05 07:42 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

theBRINK said:
spawn to poo


:thumbup:


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: potency question [Re: Holydiver]
    #4605875 - 08/31/05 11:14 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

over-incubate grain spawn for 1-3 months beyond colonization then use as spawn to a bulk substrate.


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
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PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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OfflineHotnuts
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Re: potency question [Re: mycofile]
    #4606531 - 09/01/05 01:03 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

mycofile said:
over-incubate grain spawn for 1-3 months beyond colonization then use as spawn to a bulk substrate.




Why in the world would someone over incubate spawn for 1-3 months?


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Invisiblekrishnamurti
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Registered: 06/27/05
Posts: 382
Re: potency question [Re: Hotnuts]
    #4606541 - 09/01/05 01:07 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

DO NOT QUESTION THE MYCOFILE!!


jk, i would like to know if it really works.


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Offlinebob_smith93456
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Registered: 07/28/05
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Re: potency question [Re: krishnamurti]
    #4606575 - 09/01/05 01:14 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Me too


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Offlineblackout
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Re: potency question [Re: mycofile]
    #4607067 - 09/01/05 05:29 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

mycofile said:
over-incubate grain spawn for 1-3 months beyond colonization then use as spawn to a bulk substrate.




In other threads you say that using striaght over incubated grain will increase potency too. In your opinion which will produce the most potent shrooms, a litre of overincubated grain cased and fruited straight, or 1/2 litre of overincubated grain spawned to 1/2 litre of substrate.

I only do small grows so have no interst in spawning, though I have added straw in the past. I would only bother to spawn if you thought it increases potency even further.


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OfflineHotnuts
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Re: potency question [Re: blackout]
    #4607526 - 09/01/05 11:56 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Over incubating spawn is rediculous. No harm intended. Allowing your spawn to set around for an extra few months will give bacteria a chance to thrive or it will dry out. Besides; if you're using it to spawn a bulk substrate, why does one let that happen? It makes no sense IMO......


Edited by hotnutz (09/01/05 02:35 PM)


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Offlineblackout
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Re: potency question [Re: Hotnuts]
    #4608084 - 09/01/05 02:25 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Its not meant to make sense, it is meant to make them potent! I would like to know what is going on to make them stronger. But I would prefer them to be more potent and not know why, than not give it a go at all. I have a colonised jar at the moment from the same LC as 2 casings that are just about to start pinning. I am going to save the jar until a later date now.

Mycofile has claimed up to 2-5x as strong, thats a big claim alright, but from a highly respected member with a lot of experience growing and probably dosing too. He is not trying to sell anything so has no reason to be bullshitting. Its not some newbie spouting crap about how he did x,y and z and these are super strong. Somebody eating on an empty stomach one day and full the next, without any idea of tolerance etc.

check out this thread
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=Forum4&Number=4069248


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Offlinewaixingren
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Re: potency question [Re: mycofile]
    #4608109 - 09/01/05 02:29 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

mycofile said:
over-incubate grain spawn for 1-3 months beyond colonization




EXACTLY! i have the exact same theory. i know it works ive done it. im glad to see other people think the same thing.

--waixingren


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OfflineHotnuts
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Re: potency question [Re: blackout]
    #4608116 - 09/01/05 02:30 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I (might!!!) understand doing this with a cake or something along those lines, but not spawn material. Spawn material needs to be used after colonization or refridgerated until it's used. Allowing your spawn to incubate for months after colonization is NOT a good thing, no matter who tells you different. That's a fact.


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Offlineblackout
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Re: potency question [Re: Hotnuts]
    #4608141 - 09/01/05 02:37 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I would figure over incubated grain will yield less, as mentioned in TMC, it is wasting nutrients by spending time over colonising. But if I got 1/2 the yeild at twice the potency I would be very very happy.
I do not think it would lead to a half in yield though.
There is no fact, or data showing it will not increase potency. And I think mycofile is going to announce some actual scientific data about this subject soon.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: potency question [Re: blackout]
    #4608795 - 09/01/05 04:39 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

OK, my theory on the mechanism at play:

Ecologically speaking, A cubensis cultures primary objective is to reproduce. To reproduce, it must capture it's substrate first. Production of psilocybin/psilocin is not something that is understood, but it is known that it is not a primary objective of a cube culture. So, when you start your spawn, the cultures objectives, in order are to 1. Fully colonize the substrate 2. Reproduce as soon as possible 3. Produce psilocybin/psilocin.

By allowing the culture to achieve colonization of the substrate, but preventing it from fruiting, you are allowing the culture plenty of time to do other things that it is good at, just not as important, biologically speaking, as reproduction. Namely, producing active goodies.

Now, I may not be right with this theory. Another possibility is just that older cultures have accumulated more secondary metabolites of various types, not just psilocybin and psilocin. These chemicals are then used by the culture as precursers to elevate the potency of the fruits. Kind of like adding tryptamine to the substrate, except the increased potency seems to be as much psilocybin as 'cin with over-incubated spawn. This could be because whatever the precursers are, they bypass the downregulation of psilocybin, or it could be that some yet unidentified alkaloid is present in the over-incubated spawn.

Regardless, it works. I almost hate talking about it because it's always controversial. Hell I'd bash it if I hadn't discovered it myself on accident. So, try it if you like.

I've tripped as hard as I can handle with people around on a 1.5" piece of stem before.

Regardless, there is definitely some kind of difference between fresh spawn and over-incubated spawn. This spawn was used a little over 1 month beyond full colonization, incubating at 75-ish degrees:

does it look a little different than fresh spawn?


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


Edited by mycofile (09/01/05 05:52 PM)


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OfflineShroomArtist84
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Registered: 08/09/05
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Re: potency question [Re: mycofile]
    #4609224 - 09/01/05 06:19 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

spawny spawny


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OfflinetheBRINK
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Re: potency question [Re: ShroomArtist84]
    #4609327 - 09/01/05 06:50 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

myco- what part of the fruit did that peice come from? did you have to dig it up, or did it fruit that above the substrate?

there must be some way to increase potency, like in marijuana: it is far more potent now than it was 10 years ago because we have learned more about it and what exactly causes the prodution of thc. i think if we did the same kind of research, to find what makes mushrooms produce psilocybin and psilocin as well as other alkaloids, we'll have a better understanding on what we must do to increase potency. i guess we'd have to have access to lab equip and all that... maybe one day...

but until then, increasing yeilds is the best way of my knowledge to increase the potency by having more to eat.


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InvisibleEonTan
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Re: potency question [Re: mycofile]
    #4609345 - 09/01/05 06:54 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think that aged spawn put into fresh substrate will yield higher potency fruits. I believe that an old jar of spawn cased and fruited will yield higher potency fruits then a fresh jar of spawn cased and fruited.

From everything I have ever learned about secondary metabolite production it doesn't seem logical that using it as spawn would result in more active fruits. But casing and fruiting the old spawn directly seems logical for increased secondary metabolites. Should also yield a very heavy first flush if water is available, or result in alot of aborts due to lots of nutes and not enough water to mature them.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: potency question [Re: EonTan]
    #4609890 - 09/01/05 09:05 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

EonTan, if you think that directly casing aged grain would make for more active fruits, why not when it's spawned? Keeping in mind that I'm recomending high spawn rates (25-50%), the bulk substrate is acting as much as it does in the rez effect as anything else.

Also, I've fruited aged grain before and it was noticably stronger. The few times I did it though it didn't seem as healthy or fruit as well. I think that the bulk sub re-invigorates the culture, allowing for full, heavy and multiple flushes. Things I dind't get as much of off cased grain directly.

And regardless, it may not be logical (although I think my second theory in the post above makes it logical), and you might not think it will work, but it does...


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: potency question [Re: theBRINK]
    #4609900 - 09/01/05 09:09 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


myco- what part of the fruit did that peice come from? did you have to dig it up, or did it fruit that above the substrate?



Which piece? The piece of spawn in the picture, or the 1.5" piece of stem I achieved level 4 from? The picture is just a hunk of WBS grain spawn. It was incubated in spawn bags, and used as spawn after a little more than a month past full colonization. If you are talking about the piece of stem, it was of just the base of a normal 8" or so shroom.


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: potency question [Re: Hotnuts]
    #4611370 - 09/02/05 03:39 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Allowing your spawn to incubate for months after colonization is NOT a good thing, no matter who tells you different



Naw, you're right. Incubating spawn for months is a bad thing. It ends up pissing all over itself like this:



Yeah, Who would use such nasty looking spawn? I mean, who cares if it can grow the most potent shrooms you've ever dreamed about? The flushes are bound to be wimpy, right? I mean, didn't stamets say that spawn MUST be refrigerated if it can't be used at peak vitality (within just a few days of colonization)? And didn't he have some ominous warning for people who dared to do differently? Well, I read his words too. And I expected fruits from over-incubated spawn to be pidly, low yielding, mutated, and generally fucked up. Well, then explain this, which came from that bag above:



Don't believe everything you read, try it for yourself. Unless you still have some theoretical reason why over-incubation is bad?


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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