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Offlinemikeyboy
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DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction"
    #4541526 - 08/16/05 09:55 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Was reading up last night about DMT

We know it is released at birth at the stages before death

Some trip reports explain that it is similar to being abducted by aliens

I'm curious as to what other peoples views are on the fact that alien abductions could simply be someones brain inadvertently secreting DMT when it is not supposed to.

If someone was to experience this and not know what was happening and "met" other beings then the first thing (in my oppinion) they would think is that aliens were abducting them.

What everyones thaughts???  :smirk:


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LSD: Defrag for the brain


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InvisibleHanky
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: mikeyboy]
    #4541578 - 08/16/05 10:30 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I allowed this big pink squid monster thing to envelop my head and feel around in my mind on DMT.

I could imagine if that just happened to someone for no reason they might blame aliens. They'ed more likely go mad from such an encounter.


--------------------
Coaster is an idiot...
[quote]Coaster said:
but i thnk everything thats pure is white?
[/quote]




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InvisibleSweetJimmyBrown
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: Hanky]
    #4542567 - 08/16/05 03:35 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I think spontaneous DMT release is a plausible answer. As plausible as an actual encounter? I don't know. Although finding yourself in an alien world surrounded by strange creatures feeling so confused and afraid that you regress into a child-like state DOES sound like DMT and may account for abduction experiences (and prove spontaneous release is possible) how would you account for shared abduction experiences or mass sightings?

Have any shroomerites been abducted? Have they also smoked DMT? How do they compare?


--------------------
Ille dolet vere, qui sine teste dolet.
* * *
I'm as calm as a fruit stand in New york and maybe as strange.
* * *
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Offlineleery11
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: SweetJimmyBrown]
    #4542601 - 08/16/05 03:43 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SweetJimmyBrown said:
how would you account for shared abduction experiences or mass sightings?




the same way you account for feats of "mind reading" and "shared thoughts" when a group of people with similar minds trips together or even just gets drunk together.

Last night I was thinking "i wonder if she's hot" and my friend said out loud "Yeah she's pretty hot" right when I thought it..... you don't even need to be fucked up to share thoughtstreams with people you know.

If someone starts tripping out it's possible others will join them and have similar experiences, especially if they are close to each other.

Haven't you ever had a "shared trip" where you both saw the same things? I haven't because I haven't tripped with people, but I read about it a lot.

My thoughts are there is no way to know. What you see while tripping may be real, it may be hallucinatory... the only way to know for sure is for the beings to teach you something that is completely and totally surprising that could not possibly exist inside your own brain. Like if they told you the winning lotto numbers or something, that might be reason to believe what you are experiencing is external, rather than internal.

I mean, you can explain abductions from a scientific point of view, talk about the dreaming process, drug experiences.... etc... you can explain it from a mystic point of view.... you can explain it any way you want, but there's no real way to know for sure that it was or wasn't "real".


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


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InvisibleSweetJimmyBrown
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: leery11]
    #4542720 - 08/16/05 04:23 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I was actually speaking of a phenomenon I read about in FATE magazine, and possible saw on the Discovery/History channel where two or more abductees "meet" for the first time during an experience and then recognize each other later in real life.

I don't think sightings are part of the DMT/abductee answer. The experiences are for the most part pretty grounded, based in real world situations. There are (possibly) photos of UFOs, think of the Mexico City mass sigtings... hundreds of thousands of people saw the same thing, it was substantiated by photos, videos, and acknowleged by the government.

So what I meant was DMT could be behind the mystery of abductions, but what about related phenomena?

P.S.
I've experienced "shared thought" ESP while tripping in a really dodgy way... it seemed like it was real, but it could be chalked up to climbing my way up to a 200ug acid peak. I've tried in the past to deliberatly project or recieve thoughts on LSD, Psilocybin, Ketamine, MD(M)A, and Ayahuasca but could not concentrate hard enough to find any proof (proof enough for me to believe).


--------------------
Ille dolet vere, qui sine teste dolet.
* * *
I'm as calm as a fruit stand in New york and maybe as strange.
* * *
Simple Grain Recipe


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Offlineleery11
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: SweetJimmyBrown]
    #4542895 - 08/16/05 05:30 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SweetJimmyBrown said:
I was actually speaking of a phenomenon I read about in FATE magazine, and possible saw on the Discovery/History channel where two or more abductees "meet" for the first time during an experience and then recognize each other later in real life.




hmm do you have a link?

Quote:


I don't think sightings are part of the DMT/abductee answer. The experiences are for the most part pretty grounded, based in real world situations. There are (possibly) photos of UFOs, think of the Mexico City mass sigtings... hundreds of thousands of people saw the same thing, it was substantiated by photos, videos, and acknowleged by the government.



yeah i forgot about that.... there's also this video (that looks legit) of some sort of UFO in a major city that all of a sudden accelerates like crazy and disappears way faster than conceivably possible.

But this could all be nefarious governmental doings.

Quote:


I've experienced "shared thought" ESP while tripping in a really dodgy way... it seemed like it was real, but it could be chalked up to climbing my way up to a 200ug acid peak. I've tried in the past to deliberatly project or recieve thoughts on LSD, Psilocybin, Ketamine, MD(M)A, and Ayahuasca but could not concentrate hard enough to find any proof (proof enough for me to believe).



I don't want to honk my own horn but I just kind of think I'm sort of inclined to naturally pick up on these things, but they're real subtle. I mean it's also partly because people think about the same things over and over again.... but I mean... it's like when you know what hand gestures someone is about to make when you're speaking and you make the same one at almost the exact same time... stuff like that that defies "logic" yet makes sense.

Communication is mostly non-verbal anyway.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


Edited by leery11 (08/16/05 05:34 PM)


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Offlinedante
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: leery11]
    #4542992 - 08/16/05 06:16 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Rick Straussman talks about this in his book DMT: The Spirit Molecule


--------------------
The clouds above us join & separate,
The breeze in the courtyard leaves & returns.
Like is like that, so why not relax?
Who can stop us from celebrating?

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OfflineBigBallZMaN
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: dante]
    #4543211 - 08/16/05 07:23 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I bet DMT is responsible for *some* abduction reports, but not all. Remember that movie "A Fire in the Sky" ? That was a true story about a guy that had all that shit happen to him. I doubt you could blam all that on DMT or any other drug for that matter, seeing as how he couldnt be found and then just appeared.


--------------------
Our body is light, we are immortal.
Our body is love, we are eternal.
Eternal..

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OfflineQuantumMeltdown
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: dante]
    #4543302 - 08/16/05 07:49 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I keep hearing about this Rick Strassman book. Can anyone actually post the part of the book talking about DMT release at Birth(49 days)/Death? Also what are his sources for believing this like studies done on it? I am sure this is just speculation on his part. How can someone prove something like this?


--------------------
-QuantumMeltdown

Total abstinence is so excellent a thing that it cannot be carried to too great an extent. In my passion for it I even carry it so far as to totally abstain from total abstinence itself.
  -Mark Twain

"The time has come the walrus said, little oysters  hide their heads, my Twain of thought is loosely bound I guess its time to Mark this down, Be good and you will be lonesome
Be lonesome and you will be free
Live a lie and you will live to regret it
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OfflineQuantumMeltdown
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: BigBallZMaN]
    #4543306 - 08/16/05 07:51 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Fire in the Sky was nuts bro. I hope that shit never happens to me bro. That movie scared the shit out of me.

I really don't think DMT has anything to do with abductions whether they are real or hoaxes. How many people who ever smoked DMT think its anything like the abduction stories you hear at all? My trip certainly wasn't like that at all. I think some of the false abductions could have more to do with nightmares. Others make me question whether they were real or not. Only the abductee knows for sure.


--------------------
-QuantumMeltdown

Total abstinence is so excellent a thing that it cannot be carried to too great an extent. In my passion for it I even carry it so far as to totally abstain from total abstinence itself.
  -Mark Twain

"The time has come the walrus said, little oysters  hide their heads, my Twain of thought is loosely bound I guess its time to Mark this down, Be good and you will be lonesome
Be lonesome and you will be free
Live a lie and you will live to regret it
That's what livin' is to me
That's what livin' is to me"
Jimmy Buffett


Edited by QuantumMeltdown (08/16/05 07:55 PM)


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: QuantumMeltdown]
    #4545185 - 08/17/05 03:21 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I am without my copy, but here is a good overview. I bolded the only refrence to 49 days, alas it isn't all the info you want.

http://www.rickstrassman.com/dmt/

Quote:


In 1990, I began the first new human research with psychedelic, or hallucinogenic, drugs in the United States in over 20 years. These studies investigated the effects of N,N-dimethyltryptamine, or DMT, an extremely short-acting and powerful psychedelic. During the project's five years, I administered approximately 400 doses of DMT to 60 human volunteers. This research took place at the University of New Mexico's School of Medicine in Albuquerque, where I was tenured Associate Professor of Psychiatry.

I was drawn to DMT because of its presence in all of our bodies. Perhaps excessive DMT production, coming from the mysterious pineal gland, was involved in naturally occurring "psychedelic" states. These might include birth, death and near-death, psychosis, and mystical experiences. Only later, while the study was well under way, did I also begin considering DMT's role in the "alien abduction" experience.

The DMT project was founded on cutting edge brain science, especially the psychopharmacology of serotonin. However, my own background powerfully affected how we prepared people for, and supervised, their drug sessions. One of these was a decades-long relationship with a Zen Buddhist training monastery.

The Spirit Molecule reviews what we know about psychedelic drugs in general, and DMT in particular. It then traces the DMT research project from its earliest intimations through the maze of committees and review boards to its actual performance.

Our research subjects were healthy volunteers. The studies were not intended to be therapeutic, although all of us believed in the potentially beneficial properties of psychedelic drugs. The project generated a wealth of biological and psychological data, much of which I have already published in the scientific literature. On the other hand, I have written nearly nothing about volunteers' stories. I hope these many excerpts from over 1000 pages of my bedside notes provide a sense of the remarkable emotional, psychological, and spiritual effects of this chemical.

Problems inside and outside of the research environment led to the end of these studies in 1995. Despite the difficulties we encountered, I am optimistic about the possible benefits of the controlled use of these drugs. Based upon what we learned in the New Mexico research, I offer a wide-ranging vision for DMT's role in our lives, and conclude by proposing a research agenda and optimal setting for future work with DMT and related drugs.

The late Willis Harman possessed one of the most discerning minds to apply himself to the field of psychedelic research. Willis, earlier in his career, had published the first and only scientific study using psychedelics to enhance the creative process. When I met him 30 years later in 1994, he was president of Institute of Noetic Sciences, an organization founded by the sixth man to walk on the moon, Edgar Mitchell. Mitchell's mystical experience, stimulated by viewing the Earth on his return home, inspired him to study phenomenon outside the range of traditional science, which nevertheless might yield to a broader application of the scientific method.

During a long walk together along the central California coastal range one day, he said firmly, "At the very least, we must enlarge the discussion about psychedelics." It is in response to his request that I include highly speculative ideas and my own personal motivations for performing this research. This approach will satisfy no-one in every respect. There is intense friction between what we know intellectually or even intuitively, and what we experience with the aid of DMT. As one of our volunteers exclaimed after his first high dose session, "Wow! I never expected that!" Or, as Dogen, a thirteenth century Japanese Buddhist teacher said, "We must always be disturbed by the truth." Enthusiasts of the psychedelic drug culture may dislike the conclusion that DMT has no beneficial effects in and of itself; rather, the context in which people take them is at least as important. Proponents of drug control may condemn what they read as encouragement to take psychedelic drugs and a glorification of the DMT experience. Practitioners and spokespersons of traditional religions may reject the suggestion that spiritual states can be accessed, and mystical information gained, through drugs. Those who have undergone "alien abduction," and their advocates, may interpret as a challenge to the "reality" of their experiences my suggestion that DMT is intimately involved in these events. Opponents and supporters of abortion rights may find fault with my proposal that pineal DMT release at 49 days after conception marks the entrance of the spirit into the fetus.

Brain researchers may object to the suggestion that DMT affects the brain's ability to receive information, rather than generating those perceptions themselves. They also may dismiss the proposal that DMT can allow our brains to perceive dark matter or parallel universes, realms of existence inhabited by conscious entities.

However, if I did not describe all the ideas behind the DMT studies, and the entire range of our volunteers' experiences, I would not be telling the entire tale. At best, The Spirit Molecule would have little effect on the scope of discussion about psychedelics; at worst, the book would reduce the field. Nor would I be honest if I did not share my own speculations and theories based upon decades of study, and listening to hundreds of DMT sessions. This is why I did it. This is what happened. This is what I think about it.

It is so important for us to understand consciousness. It is just as important to place psychedelic drugs in general, and DMT in particular, into a personal and cultural matrix where we do the most good, and the least harm. In such a wide open area of inquiry, it is best that we reject no ideas until we actually disprove them. It is in the interest of enlarging the discussion about psychedelic drugs that I've written The Spirit Molecule.




--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineRoseM
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: Rose]
    #4545230 - 08/17/05 03:31 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

This sheds more light. on the topic at hand. Perhaps it was theorized, however he makes a compelling case. If the pineal is formed at 49 days, and it is... it is not far fetched at all to believe DMT is first present at that time. We know as well, DMT is released at or near death, and we know the DMT experience is often very similar to a near death experience. Dr S. suggests this is when the Spirit enters and leaves the being, however that is clearly a theory.

http://www.rickstrassman.com/dmt/chaptersummaries.html

Quote:

The Psychedelic Pineal
A "DMT theory of pineal function" has great appeal, as many of the necessary ingredients and enzymes for its formation exist in remarkably high concentrations in the pineal. Building upon existing data, I present several scenarios in which the pineal may produce DMT instead of melatonin. I speculate about endogenous DMT's role in dreams, meditation, birth, near-death, and death. I suggest that the individual's life-force enters the body through the pineal at 49 days after conception, and leaves it through the pineal gland at death. This 49-day prenatal period corresponds to the first signs of fetal pineal tissue, the differentiation of the gonads into male and female, and how long it takes between the death of an individual and its soul's next rebirth according to the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. I suggest a meta-physical model in which biological, psychological, and spiritual drives or impulses all may exist in a dynamic tension within this spirit gland.




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Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleSweetJimmyBrown
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: Rose]
    #4546864 - 08/17/05 03:44 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

MMMM... Extract of pineal.

I don't have a link for the FATE article, it's a magazine. I'll do some searching tonight about it and post it.

Well I've never been abducted but I do suffer from sleep paralysis, and I've had some strange visions of near-invisible beings creeping in the shadows. These half-dreams are pretty real and are often used to explain away abduction experiences and I can definatly see why. I'd swear up and down that it was reality if such strange stuff wasn't going on (watching myself walk into the room, seeing the wall pull apart from the room).

By the way, I do have some good news. Last week on Coast To Coast AM, George Noory was intereviewing a woman who is in psychic contact with aliens from Zeta Reticuli. She says that according to the Galactic Council's constitution, if you are being abducted all you have to do is ask them to stop and they will. It's a Human Rights violation otherwise.


--------------------
Ille dolet vere, qui sine teste dolet.
* * *
I'm as calm as a fruit stand in New york and maybe as strange.
* * *
Simple Grain Recipe


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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: SweetJimmyBrown]
    #4547179 - 08/17/05 05:07 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

LOL!
Aliens and Human rights!

Sleep paralysis is a trip.  It used to really scare me until I heard about it (on Art Bell :wink:).  Then I knew what was happening and was able to get into it!


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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OfflinexZipVi3tBoii
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: mikeyboy]
    #7874631 - 01/13/08 08:04 PM (8 years, 10 months ago)

My thought personally...

i want to try some of that shit! that would be some crazy shit.


--------------------
Smoke Grass.


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InvisibleOneMoreRobot3021
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: mikeyboy]
    #7874640 - 01/13/08 08:05 PM (8 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

mikeyboy said:
We know it is released at birth at the stages before death




No, we don't.

People really need to stop thinking that Dr. Strassman's theories are anything more than theories. Because until they're proven in scientific experimentation, they are nothing more than theory.


--------------------
Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake.

-Erik Davis


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InvisibleRobo Shaman
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #7874834 - 01/13/08 08:44 PM (8 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

OneLessForeskin said:
People really need to stop thinking that Dr. Strassman's theories are anything more than theories. Because until they're proven in scientific experimentation, they are nothing more than theory.



:thumbup:


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OfflineVibrate
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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: Robo Shaman]
    #7875216 - 01/13/08 09:47 PM (8 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Omni said:
Quote:

OneLessForeskin said:
People really need to stop thinking that Dr. Strassman's theories are anything more than theories. Because until they're proven in scientific experimentation, they are nothing more than theory.



:thumbup:



Sometimes when we read it is easy to forget that everything isn't fact. This theory in perticular has just taken off. Stay informed.


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Re: DMT - Reason behind "Alien abduction" [Re: mikeyboy]
    #7875795 - 01/13/08 11:12 PM (8 years, 10 months ago)

lol, I always thought a random psychedelic experience would be neat as fucking hell, like your body secreting DMT.

And I don't mean you start tripping at a party and find out that you took LSD. I mean, what if you were an ancient Mayan, ate a decent lunch of some mushrooms your friends gave you and then you're sitting on your lawn and suddenly wooooooooooooooooooooooooooomp.

That'd be fucking incredible.


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