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InvisibleEgo Death
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Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates!
    #4538426 - 08/15/05 04:44 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Because current science has no plausible explanation for claims of telepathic phenomena, there can be no "theory of telepathy," as all of the various explanations have certain unbridgeable gaps to current science.

Proponents on the other hand argue that the difficulty in rationalizing or "proving" the concept does not diminish the fact that most people have some belief in metaphysical concepts. And given the benefit of the doubt, people maintain their beliefs not because they are ignorant of science, but because science (by definition) ignores unexplainable personal experience.

Proponents point to concepts such as psychology and quantum mechanics, as areas of research that are considered to be deeply based in the scientific method, but have equally problematic and unexplainable links to the exclusively physical description of reality.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telepathy


We are right, even the encyclopedia says so!!!

ALL IS NOT AS IT SEEMS!

SUPPRESS US WITH YOUR LOGIC NO MORE! :shocked:


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538441 - 08/15/05 04:48 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

To paraphrase Eleanor Roosevelt, "No one can suppress you without your consent."


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538507 - 08/15/05 05:04 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Because current science has no plausible explanation for claims of telepathic phenomena, there can be no "theory of telepathy,"

There can be no theory for telepathy because telepathy has never been demonstrated.

Likewise, there can be no theory to explain how the Tooth Fairy exchanges teeth for money because the exchange has never been demonstrated.

How many times do I have to say this before the mystic types will get it? :confused:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Diploid]
    #4538598 - 08/15/05 05:27 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

there is a difference. Nobody claimed to have really seen a toothfairy


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4538611 - 08/15/05 05:31 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

No one has consistently demonstrated telepathy, either.

At least not beyond random chance.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: trendal]
    #4538618 - 08/15/05 05:33 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

It wasn't demonstrated, I know, I'm just saying it didn't came from the place where fairytales come from, it came from word of mouth, and was claimed to be actual truth. And anything that is claimed by anyone to be the truth deserves investigation.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4538628 - 08/15/05 05:37 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

And anything that is claimed by anyone to be the truth deserves investigation.

Scientists continue to investigate claims of paranormal events, despite the lack of any finds in previous investigations.

It's not like the science world is ignoring the paranormal...it's just that most of the claims have already been investigated and found out to be false/mistaken.

I'm just saying it didn't came from the place where fairytales come from, it came from word of mouth, and was claimed to be actual truth.

It was once claimed, by word of mouth, to be a true fact that the Moon was made out of cheese. This was investigated and successfuly disproved with the Apollo 11 landing. If some people continue, to this day, to say that the Moon is in fact made out of cheese...why should any scientist continue to prove otherwise when it has already been proven otherwise?


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: trendal]
    #4538651 - 08/15/05 05:43 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

It was not "claimed" it was speculated. Nobody has been up there. They just have seen holes and thought it was made of chese.

there is a difference when someone comes and tells you: I've seen a guy levitating, and when someone says: I think people can levitate.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4538660 - 08/15/05 05:45 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Nobody claimed to have really seen a toothfairy

Wait a second.

Scientists have been (trying) to study telepathy for over 100 years. They always get as far as setting things up, then the telepaths fail to produce 100% of the time.

My 8 year old nephew swears that the Tooth Fairy exists and recently showed me some cash evidence.

Serious question: why do you not give my nephew's statements equal weight to a telepathy proponent's statements? Let me remind you that both claims are backed by the same quantity and quality of evidence.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4538667 - 08/15/05 05:46 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Ok, but the same reasoning applies:

If a thousand guys came up to scientists at different times and said "I've seen a guy levitating" but then failed to show the scientists the guy levitating....how many more times do you think the scientists will fall for the same gag?

How many times does the boy have to call wolf before no one believes him anymore?


--------------------
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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Diploid]
    #4538682 - 08/15/05 05:49 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
Because current science has no plausible explanation for claims of telepathic phenomena, there can be no "theory of telepathy,"

There can be no theory for telepathy because telepathy has never been demonstrated.

Likewise, there can be no theory to explain how the Tooth Fairy exchanges teeth for money because the exchange has never been demonstrated.

How many times do I have to say this before the mystic types will get it? :confused:




And given the benefit of the doubt, people maintain their beliefs not because they are ignorant of science, but because science (by definition) ignores unexplainable personal experience.


How long before you will get it?  It has been demonstrated but obviously not to you  :grin:


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: trendal]
    #4538684 - 08/15/05 05:50 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

There is no limit to how many times. If someone is really openminded it carries into eternity, because maybe eternity+1'st time it will be truth.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Veritas]
    #4538691 - 08/15/05 05:51 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
To paraphrase Eleanor Roosevelt, "No one can suppress you without your consent."




Do I need your consent to take you out with a sniper rifle? :sniper:

Anything can be suppressed without consent.


--------------------


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538694 - 08/15/05 05:52 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

It has been demonstrated but obviously not to you

Telepathy has never been demonstrated in controlled conditions where the participants could not be kidding themselves.

If you say otherwise, please provide a reference.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: trendal]
    #4538698 - 08/15/05 05:53 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Its about science ignoring it. The weight of evidence is there.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Diploid]
    #4538700 - 08/15/05 05:53 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

stage fright?  :tongue2:


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleEgo Death
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Diploid]
    #4538703 - 08/15/05 05:54 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

I don't need controlled conditions to know what I have experienced. You do.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538705 - 08/15/05 05:56 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

The weight of evidence is there.

Prove it. Where is all this "evidence" you speak of?

Because I can show you evidence for, say, the wave-particle duality of light. The reason science doesn't ignore that theory is because the evidence is present and reproducible.


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538719 - 08/15/05 05:59 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

I don't need controlled conditions to know what I have experienced. You do.

You see, this is the problem right here:

You said: It has been demonstrated

Am I to take you at your word? Science (and philosophical discussion, by the way) doesn't work that way, Church does.

If it has been demonstrated, why do you refuse to back up your claim and show me where and when it has been demonstrated?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Heres the best answer to all these paranormal debates! [Re: Ego Death]
    #4538722 - 08/15/05 06:00 PM (12 years, 9 days ago)

Yes, you could kill me without my consent. You could also "disappear" me if you did not like my ideas (and had some paid goons willing to risk kidnapping charges). You could even click "IGNORE USER" and skip this and all my future posts.

However, suppression is a much more subtle act. Are you suppressed here if other posters, whose posts are given equal space on the board, disagree strongly with your expressed views? If they demand proof of things which cannot be proven nor disproven? Even if they openly ridicule your ideas...who is suppressing you? The only person in this situation who has the power to suppress your ideas...is YOU.

If you give in to the "logical majority" and alter your posts, or simply cease posting here in favor of more "tolerant" forums, you have been suppressed by yourself.


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