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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues?
    #4520456 - 08/11/05 01:24 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I realize that there are many different viewpoints floating around in this world. Not everybody is a stereotypical Lefty or Righty. But, there does seem to be a tendency of people occupying certain wings of the ideological spectrum to be inclined to support a certain position on a certain issue.

For example, why are a lot of Lefties so fearful and condescending when it comes to gun ownership? Why are Lefties often disdainful of patriotism and nationalism? Why are Lefties so supportive of income redistribution?

Why is the Right so imbued with religion? Why is the Right typically supportive of the death penalty? Why does the Right tend to support fiscal conservatism (nowadays...they say they support it but they don't practise what they preach).

What are the connecting threads in the individual ideologies that make people take these positions? What are the basic philosophies that spawn all of these positions?


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OfflineTao
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4520820 - 08/11/05 02:49 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Why do people so often come down on the same side (left v. right) as their parents?

Because it's about culture and environment more than actually questioning your own beliefs and assumptions. It's actually quite depressing the more you think about, in terms of the hopelessness for any real political change.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4520846 - 08/11/05 02:56 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

But, what makes a Lefty who is versed in economic issues seem to immediately be anti-gun when examining gun issues? How are income redistribution and anti-gun feelings related?

That is what I am trying to get at. What basic ideas seem to be guiding people with certain ideologies to take certain predictable stances on certain issues?


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OfflineTao
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4520938 - 08/11/05 03:22 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

That's what I'm saying, its about culture and environment. For most people, most political discussion they surround themselves with is stuff they already agree with, so then its like any subtle brainwashing, they slowly start to agree more and more with other parts of the party line.

Here's one that I really don't understand--why are Christians tending to be against welfare?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4521328 - 08/11/05 09:11 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

You are no alone with this question. I have sought an answer to this for years and have not come up with anything better than, "human nature." I seem to be one of the few that don't line up with one side or the other. If you draw a line connecting the dots of my position on various issues you would end up with a line that zigs and zags all over the place.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4521489 - 08/11/05 11:57 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Tao said:
Here's one that I really don't understand--why are Christians tending to be against welfare?



Because they believe that the church should take care of the poor, rather than the state.


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Invisiblelooner2
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4521491 - 08/11/05 11:58 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Tao said:
That's what I'm saying, its about culture and environment. For most people, most political discussion they surround themselves with is stuff they already agree with, so then its like any subtle brainwashing, they slowly start to agree more and more with other parts of the party line.

Here's one that I really don't understand--why are Christians tending to be against welfare?




Christians give a lot of money to the poor through their church, and hence as a community they feel like they are doing gods work through their own choice, as opposed to a standard government hand out system.


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Invisiblebukkake
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Silversoul]
    #4522046 - 08/11/05 02:54 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
Quote:

Tao said:
Here's one that I really don't understand--why are Christians tending to be against welfare?



Because they believe that the church should take care of the poor, rather than the state.



Also gives the church a stronger influence amongst the poor. The percentage of Roman Catholics in most third world countries is staggering.

One thing about the majority of leftists I have trouble grasping is being against guns, but for more civil liberties.


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OfflineSycronica
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: bukkake]
    #4522097 - 08/11/05 03:06 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I am prolly considered a "lefty" though I don't claim it. And I don't like welfare cuz it's more of a very small band aid for a very large problem.

Yet I am totally for gun owners rights. It isn't the registered gun owners that are causing the gun related problems. I actually wanted bush to win the 2000 election cuz I didn't want more gun regulations which is taking away our rights. How little did I know what was truely on the bushco agenda.


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Think for yourself. Question authority.

Forgiveness is the ultimate sacrifice.

You can fool some people sometimes, but you can't fool all the people all the time.


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OfflineTao
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Silversoul]
    #4538107 - 08/15/05 03:28 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

No, that's the libertarian answer, not the answer typically given by christian conservatives. You seem to forget that about 1% of people are libertarian.


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Magash's Grain Tek  + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs :thumbup:


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4538135 - 08/15/05 03:32 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Chances are it began with a group who was both for gun control and income redistribution, and then people began supporting that group in mostly all their opinions. The parents passed this group's beliefs down to their children, and their children's children, and it just stuck together because humans fear change.

It is the same with many groups, and humans don't like to fix things unless they absolutely need to be fixed.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Ravus]
    #4538183 - 08/15/05 03:44 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
Chances are it began with a group who was both for gun control and income redistribution, and then people began supporting that group in mostly all their opinions. The parents passed this group's beliefs down to their children, and their children's children, and it just stuck together because humans fear change.




It's much more complicated than that. When I was a liberal I adopted all of the classic liberal opinions (anti-gun, income redistribution, fawning over minorities, hateful towards patriotism, etc..). I was not raised in that environment.

When I had mainly liberal beliefs I found that I naturally gravitated towards other liberal beliefs. I think that many ideologies have an underlying attitude that strings all of this stuff together.


Edited by RandalFlagg (08/15/05 03:45 PM)


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OfflineUnagipie
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4538217 - 08/15/05 03:52 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Tao said:
That's what I'm saying, its about culture and environment. For most people, most political discussion they surround themselves with is stuff they already agree with, so then its like any subtle brainwashing, they slowly start to agree more and more with other parts of the party line.

Here's one that I really don't understand--why are Christians tending to be against welfare?




I don't think Christians realize how Left Jesus was. He was sharing with everybody, everyone was equal and whole 9 yards.


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Don't fight it. Just let the illuminados take over your mind. You be at bliss soon.


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Invisiblemoog
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4538299 - 08/15/05 04:16 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

There are a lot of ass-backwards things going on in the liberal/conservative ideologies. Like, non-intervention. If someone were truly conservative, as in trying to preserve the ideas of the past American history, then they would adopt the early American stance of non-intervention in foreign affairs. Liberals, taking this to the logical conclusion, should support foreign intervention and war.


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OfflineTao
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: moog]
    #4539491 - 08/15/05 09:06 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Yep, good example.

If they believed that government wasn't the place to support moral issues like welfare, they wouldn't be making laws in people's bedrooms.


--------------------
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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4540000 - 08/15/05 10:54 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I think the reason is that people tend to group themselves toether with other whining, irrational, reactive and rash or conversely insensitive, stubborn, selfish, and narrow-minded people. I think it just breaks down into personality types. Some people are non-logical, emotional and hypersensitive and some people are rigid, infexible and utilitarian.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Tao]
    #4541980 - 08/16/05 01:03 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Tao said:
No, that's the libertarian answer, not the answer typically given by christian conservatives. You seem to forget that about 1% of people are libertarian.



No, the Christian conservatives really do want churches to be in charge of welfare. Some of them believe that money we currently spend on welfare should be channelled through churches. One of many "faith-based" initiatives.


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InvisibleArp
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Sycronica]
    #4542021 - 08/16/05 01:20 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Yet I am totally for gun owners rights.




What do you need the gun for?
If you need it to protect yourself in order to survive then the society your in is fucked up!


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Arp]
    #4542047 - 08/16/05 01:27 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Need isn't necessary.

Simply to want a gun is enough. As long as you are a non-violent citizen, there is no reason why you should be unable to own a gun.


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InvisibleArp
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Re: Why do certain ideologies seem to attract certain stances on issues? [Re: Redstorm]
    #4542091 - 08/16/05 01:37 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah same can be said to alot of things. Missles, handgranades.

Where to draw the line? One dead is one too many. Even if it's just a gun.


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