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InvisibleFreedomFight
Strange

Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 427
Purposeless Survival
    #4509260 - 08/08/05 02:43 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I find it funny that all animals fear death for their survival, yet who ever said survival was so cool :tongue:  Maybe we're all just like the little kid who is afraid to poop.


--------------------
I do not grow anything illegal.
I do not sell anything.
I am, however, a very curious individual.
I also try to be helpful.


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Invisibledorkus
don't look back
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Registered: 04/12/04
Posts: 1,511
Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4509732 - 08/08/05 07:59 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

"Amazes me, the will of instinct." Polly


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Offlinealsey
meet me in thedreamtimewater...

Registered: 02/17/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4509763 - 08/08/05 08:32 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

the fact that we have these instincts is the reason we exist. its not that survival is 'cool'. creatures that can survive, do survive.


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"Gently return to the simple physical sensation of the breath. Then do it again, and again, and again. Somewhere in this process, you will come face-to-face with the sudden and shocking realization that you are completely crazy. Your mind is a shrieking, gibbering madhouse on wheels." - ven. henepola gunaratana


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4509771 - 08/08/05 08:37 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

While the instinct for survival is in all animals.Some humans choose not to survive. The survival instinct can be overcome.  I have a co-worker who has a little saying which goes. "Survival is overrated" . We often use this to lighten up when things appear grim, or we are taking things too seriously. Interesting question. :thumbup:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4509806 - 08/08/05 09:04 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FreedomFight said:
I find it funny that all animals fear death for their survival, yet who ever said survival was so cool :tongue:  Maybe we're all just like the little kid who is afraid to poop.




Humans do it a bit differently, they get frustrated or greedy, and want to harm someone, then they say that their existence is in danger, and they have a moral green light for violence because "its all about survival"

*of to go and insert a smiley*

....damn where is a Bush icon when you need one


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4509892 - 08/08/05 10:20 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Or it is all about survival so they are obligated to harm someone.


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: looner2]
    #4509924 - 08/08/05 10:32 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

For survival we are obligated to kill, even if it's a vegetable. Killing can be minimized among humans by fostering love and co-operation. That's how warfare is minimized in tribes and families. It's a choice that each human makes everyday.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: looner2]
    #4510039 - 08/08/05 11:41 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Or it is all about survival so they are obligated to harm someone.




obligated? from perspective of me, you are not obligated to live, you could die as well, from your perspective I am not obligated to live, I could die.

this obligation is only in th emind of the one who is endangered because he fears death, so his mind invents a right to live.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4510128 - 08/08/05 12:50 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
Quote:

looner2 said:
Or it is all about survival so they are obligated to harm someone.



this obligation is only in th emind of the one who is endangered because he fears death, so his mind invents a right to live.




Roll over and die when threatened? No thanks!


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4510453 - 08/08/05 02:43 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

http://www.context.org/ICLIB/IC26/Nearing.htm

Scott Nearing's choice to die is an excellent example of survival being an empty thing if you can no longer live according to your values. This article was written by his wife, Helen.


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: looner2]
    #4510760 - 08/08/05 04:50 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
Quote:

looner2 said:
Or it is all about survival so they are obligated to harm someone.



this obligation is only in th emind of the one who is endangered because he fears death, so his mind invents a right to live.




Roll over and die when threatened? No thanks!




I don't expect you to just roll over and die because I understand your fear, I guess you have to play it out, but you must understand that your life does not have an objective value. You are a mosquito like the rest of us. You have no birth rights, you deserve whatever happens.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Offlineshpongled1
Shroomer
Registered: 08/04/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4510929 - 08/08/05 05:48 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

The purpose of life is to survive, so survival isn't purposeless, it is its own purpose. We didn't choose it, it is integral to life, that is what separated organic molecules from inorganic ones, and eventually created life... the ability to perpetuate their existance.


--------------------
"Why not?"
-Last words of Tim Leary


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
Male

Registered: 02/01/05
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: shpongled1]
    #4511004 - 08/08/05 06:10 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Still nobody has to guarantee to nobody that they shal live.

The eternal struggle of life to survive, does not mean that everyone deserves to live, nobody has rights other than those others give them.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4511060 - 08/08/05 06:30 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
Quote:

looner2 said:
Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
Quote:

looner2 said:
Or it is all about survival so they are obligated to harm someone.



this obligation is only in th emind of the one who is endangered because he fears death, so his mind invents a right to live.




Roll over and die when threatened? No thanks!




I don't expect you to just roll over and die because I understand your fear, I guess you have to play it out, but you must understand that your life does not have an objective value. You are a mosquito like the rest of us. You have no birth rights, you deserve whatever happens.




I am built to survive, just as the mosquito, just as the cheetah, just as the bacteria. You can embrace the reality of existence or just stand back and try to explain our will to live through one silly emotion. Not deep, nor interesting. Ho hum.

You can argue that we have no objective value to our lives just as you can argue that we are nothing but brains in a vat of water, or that nothing "really" exists. Adding this nihilistic dogma to any subject does nothing to a discussion because its based on nothing and just an endpoint in further analysis.

I don't know if that is what you are getting at with your "objective value" statement, but if its not, you have a lot to explaining to do with the last statement

You have no birth rights, you deserve whatever happens.

Does a 4 year old child deserve to be raped, mutilated, and tortured before being killed because there are no objective values?


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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OfflineGomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
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Registered: 09/11/04
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: FreedomFight]
    #4511071 - 08/08/05 06:35 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

FreedomFight said:
I find it funny that all animals fear death for their survival, yet who ever said survival was so cool :tongue:  Maybe we're all just like the little kid who is afraid to poop.




Holy fuck..

I just joked around that my mom used to put soap in my ass, when I refused to poop..

maybe its true..  :imslow: :thumbup:

:crazy2:



--------------------


--------------------
Disclaimer!?


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: Gomp]
    #4511077 - 08/08/05 06:36 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

:rofl2:

:inlove:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineGomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4511085 - 08/08/05 06:39 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

OldWoodSpecter said:
Still nobody has to guarantee to nobody that they shal live.

The eternal struggle of life to survive, does not mean that everyone deserves to live, nobody has rights other than those others give them.




haha and the nick i was joking or not so joking, under was "ingen" which is "nobody" directly translated..


Donnu.. just found this whole thread either triggering my imagination beyond recollection, or some long lost child memories.. ha ha

Now i really wonder.. does it sound common? anyone? h?h?

:heart:


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: looner2]
    #4511107 - 08/08/05 06:45 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Urge to survive works through panic attacks in moments when life is theatened.

As for children of 4 years, they have rights only if someone gives them.
If nobody thinks they have rights, then they have none. who would otherwise give them rights? god? an old man with a beard?
If the community thinks 4 year old children don't have a right to be protected from rape, then those children have no rights to be protected from rape. It is up to others to give you rights accoarding to their beliefs. It is up to you to judge or not judge the rapist accoarding to your beliefs, moral teachings and natural urges.

this is not nihilism, unless you can come up with some evidence of god or whoever there is to giver rights, you have no logical arguments for objective rights.


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4511169 - 08/08/05 07:08 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

If the community thinks 4 year old children don't have a right to be protected from rape, then those children have no rights to be protected from rape. It is up to others to give you rights accoarding to their beliefs. It is up to you to judge or not judge the rapist accoarding to your beliefs, moral teachings and natural urges.
uh, veto. Crazy minds should not make rights or morals upon young children (and all others)...


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
........................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Purposeless Survival [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #4511202 - 08/08/05 07:17 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

should, should not, must , must not, deserve, deserve not..

...sigh...people  :rolleyes:


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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