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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,088
The Spiritual Method
    #4499407 - 08/05/05 12:30 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The Scientific Method:
1. Observe some aspect of the universe.
2. Invent a tentative description, called a hypothesis, that is consistent with what you have observed.
3. Use the hypothesis to make predictions.
4. Test those predictions by experiments or further observations and modify the hypothesis in the light of your results.
5. Repeat steps 3 and 4 until there are no discrepancies between theory and experiment and/or observation.

When consistency is obtained the hypothesis becomes a theory and provides a coherent set of propositions which explain a class of phenomena. A theory is then a framework within which observations are explained and predictions are made.




The Spiritual Method:
1. Subjectively experience some subjective aspect of the Universe.
2. Invent a tentative description, called a belief, that is consistent with what you have experienced.
3. Use the belief to make predictions about the inner aspects of the Universe and yourself.
4. Test those predictions by applying them to your life and modify your beliefs in the light of your results.
5. Repeat steps 3 and 4 until there are no discrepancies between belief and application and/or experience.

When consistency is obtained the belief becomes a framework for living and understanding.

:thumbup:


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4499413 - 08/05/05 12:32 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I never would have thought of that:)

good post


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4499466 - 08/05/05 12:48 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

This is a fucking awesome post. Seriously. I've never seen such a simple outline of how spirituality can be used IN COOPERATION with science and logic.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4499494 - 08/05/05 12:58 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

You the bomb. :thumbup: :heart:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4499496 - 08/05/05 12:59 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Sounds good on paper, er CRT glass or plasma screen, but would not apply to most topics presented here such as past lives, prayer, life-after-death, ESP, the beginning of the Universe, God, etc.

Essentially you are outlining a limited version of the scientific method as applied towards self-improvement.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Swami]
    #4499534 - 08/05/05 01:08 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Self-improvement? Where did you get that?

I intended this to be applied to subjective spiritual experiences, not intellectual concepts. If one has a direct experience with past lives, prayer, life-after-death, ESP or God, then it would be testable. If, however, they are just mental concepts derived from the New Age shelf at Barnes & Noble, there is no data to test.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4500204 - 08/05/05 03:40 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Nice and simple to follow Veritas!

Info from a book is data. The data of the book also qualifies as a subject to subjectively experience and test.

You were testing some data from a Deepak book found on a New Age Barnes and Noble shelf that require beliefs.

Data and books qualify as subjective subjects.

Reading the book is a subjective experience. Look at how different school book reports turn out when all of the class reads the same book. Each has their own subject experience of it.

Often when reading esoteric material, the subjectivity is so high for me that what I get from it is not what is written but what comes to me from between the lines or inspired take off thoughts.

Some I put to the test and adopt into my framework.

How are intellectual concepts not a part of the spiritual experience? The feelings derived from spirit mean nothing until a thought interprets them for us. That thought is usually an intellectual concept.

Your intention holds.

Perhaps swami just got an application for self improvement from it because that's how he fit it into his existing framework.

Someone else with a framework for the spiritual life can apply it to their non physical experiences just as well.

That's what is so beautiful about your post. It can apply to any ones framework and be used.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4500242 - 08/05/05 03:48 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
Info from a book is data. The data of the book also qualifies as a subject to subjectively experience and test.

You were testing some data from a Deepak book found on a New Age Barnes and Noble shelf that require beliefs.




Actually, I was applying the data to my behavior and thought patterns in order to generate a subjective experience. I believe that testable spiritual data may only be obtained in this manner. If I kept Chopra's concepts on a purely intellectual level, and did not move them into the realm of personal experience, I would not be experimenting, just accumulating information.


Quote:

How are intellectual concepts not a part of the spiritual experience? The feelings derived from spirit mean nothing until a thought interprets them for us. That thought is usually an intellectual concept.




Yes, but the thought process occurs after the experience. Just as digestion is not food, mental processing of direct experience is not experience.


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4500295 - 08/05/05 03:57 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
........................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4500455 - 08/05/05 04:38 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Actually, I was applying the data to my behavior and thought patterns in order to generate a subjective experience. I believe that testable spiritual data may only be obtained in this manner. If I kept Chopra's concepts on a purely intellectual level, and did not move them into the realm of personal experience, I would not be experimenting, just accumulating information.

Right! And swami related your framework to self improvement. To improve the self with information, you have to use it not just intellectualize it.

I don't think swami was dissing your post. I think he just found a more limited application for it then your full intention, but he still found self improvement application for it.

I think, that's how I read his reply anyway. I dunno. swami can speak for himself. ohhhhhhhhh swamiiiiiiiiiiiii

I liked it's simplicity and broad range of application! :heart: :thumbup:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4500575 - 08/05/05 05:19 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks, jiggy! I'm sure Swami will speak for himself, eventually.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4500850 - 08/05/05 06:54 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

good synthesis


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4507245 - 08/07/05 04:36 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

They both synthesize into:
Learn from the past, live in the now and look into the future...


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
........................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: Veritas]
    #4507274 - 08/07/05 04:43 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
Quote:

The Scientific Method:
1. Observe some aspect of the universe.
2. Invent a tentative description, called a hypothesis, that is consistent with what you have observed.
3. Use the hypothesis to make predictions.
4. Test those predictions by experiments or further observations and modify the hypothesis in the light of your results.
5. Repeat steps 3 and 4 until there are no discrepancies between theory and experiment and/or observation.

When consistency is obtained the hypothesis becomes a theory and provides a coherent set of propositions which explain a class of phenomena. A theory is then a framework within which observations are explained and predictions are made.




The Spiritual Method:
1. Subjectively experience some subjective aspect of the Universe.
2. Invent a tentative description, called a belief, that is consistent with what you have experienced.
3. Use the belief to make predictions about the inner aspects of the Universe and yourself.
4. Test those predictions by applying them to your life and modify your beliefs in the light of your results.
5. Repeat steps 3 and 4 until there are no discrepancies between belief and application and/or experience.

When consistency is obtained the belief becomes a framework for living and understanding.

:thumbup:





spiritual method:

1. use scientific method
2. find a way to apply it to the life of you and your community for a life full of joy


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4507366 - 08/07/05 05:08 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

spiritual method:

1. use scientific method
2. find a way to apply it to the life of you and your community for a life full of joy



(and no pain for others)
:thumbup: :thumbup:


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #4507402 - 08/07/05 05:17 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

I said you and your community (everyone you come in contact) to experience joy.
If you coordinate it that way, nobody gets harmed


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4507430 - 08/07/05 05:29 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Hmm.. hopefully, we get some spiritual method, fitting for every spiritual entity somedays, before we will have extinguished ourselves :wink:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
........................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: BlueCoyote]
    #4509774 - 08/08/05 08:39 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

not anytime soon, too much loose ends that refuse to be tied


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineLittleBen
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Re: The Spiritual Method [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4510179 - 08/08/05 01:12 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Definitely a great way to learn but I wouldnt call it a spiritual method. I use it (roughly) and people call me a skeptic but I wouldnt say that either. I think its just a rational adaptation of scientific considering all Ive experienced while on drugs.


--------------------
Gaia, as you awaken, I heal myself. As I awaken, you are healed.


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