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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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Muslims who oppose violence? Who? Where? Right here in the link you refused to read earlier because it doesn't validate your biases: http://www.muhajabah.com/otherscondemn.php What do you consider those people? -------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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You should try studying a cult BEFORE you blindly defend it.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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The same as a Nazi claiming to oppose violence, extremely dishonest.
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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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Listen, I know there are lots of passages in the Koran that condone violence, but just like every single other religion, lots of people who follow it have their own interpretation that is far from literal.
I'm not sure if you think that every single muslim secretly believes in a literal version of the Koran, or if you think that people who don't believe in a literal version of the Koran shouldn't be called Muslims, but either way: If you believe the first thing, well you're just plain wrong. If you believe the second thing, then you're alienating and belittling the faith of a HUGE group of people who AGREE with you, which isn't exactly a good way to further your goals. -------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Genocide committed in the name of Allah: 3,000,000 Bangladeshi Hindus Killed during the Pakistan-Bangladesh war in 1971. From 1894 to 1896 Abdul Hamid, Sultan of the Ottoman Empire, killed 150,000 Armenian Christians. In India, Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur along with his disciples was burned to death by the Moghul ruler Aurangzeb in 1675. Another Sikh, Bhai Mati Das was sawn into right and left halves while he was still alive. In July 1974, 4,000 Christians living in Cyprus were killed by Fahri Koroturk, president of Turkey and his Islamic army. From 1843 to 1846 10,000 Assyrian Christians including women and children were massacred by the Muslims. From 1915 to 1918 750,000 Assyrians were killed in the name of Islamic Jihad. In 1933 thousands of Assyrian villagers were murdered by the Iraqi soldiers in Northern Iraq. Since 1990 more than 10,000 Kashmiri Hindus have been brutally murdered by Islamic fundamentalists. Over 280,000 Ugandans killed during the reign of Idi Amin from 1971 to 1979. Over 30,000 Mauritanians have been killed by the Islamic dictators since 1960. In 1980, 20,000 Syrians were murdered under the rule of Hafez Al-Assad, President of Syria. Since 1992 120,000 Algerians have been murdered by the Islamic fundamentalist army.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Mohammed - "A True Saint"
A fter posting last week's article Mohammed's High Regard For Women, I realized that I did not do justice to the "Great" Mohammed and his personality. So, here,I will extrapolate my previous week's article and bring forth his glamorous life and views once again for you. Lets start with quotes from the "heavenly" Hadiths and the "ocean of knowledge", Koran. (Al-Hadis, Vol. 3, p. 137) Abu Sayeed al-Khodri reported that Mohammed was talking to a group of women when he said, "... I see the majority of you will go to Hell." The women asked why, to which Mohammed responded, "You often curse and are ungrateful to your companions." He then told them they had a basic defect in their nature, to which they responded, "How?" Mohammed answered, "Is not the attestation (knowledge and witness) of a women only worth half of a man's? And that is on account of her short intelligence." This quote really brings out Mohammed's "shining" views on women. He automatically condemns the majority of them to hell. According to him a woman's intellectual capacity is only half that of a man and that is why two women are required as witnesses as compared to one man. He was so scared of women's intelligence that he said, "a man should not walk between two women" (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 586) as that would mean that the man was taking a risk of being on equal turf according to Mohammed. (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 692) Ibn Ma`sud reported from the Messenger of Allah who said, "A woman is like a private part (sex organ). When she goes out (walking) the devil casts a glance at her (in lust)." Well, this clearly gives us an insight into Mohammed's "pure" mind. To him women were nothing but walking vaginas to be used as objects for sexual fulfillment. No wonder he required women to be completely covered from head to toe. He had to have some way to control his lust! (Koran, 4:34) ...Guard in (the husband's)absence what Allah would have them guard... This verse is demanding that the women should guard their private parts for the sake of their husbands. Again, this tells us the low opinion that Mohammed held for women-- objects to be used for sexual fulfillment. Nowhere in the Koran or the Hadiths does it say that a man should guard his private parts or abstain from sex in the absence of their wives. A man can even engage in sexual intercourse with young boys/men without much rebuke from Allah. This is supported by the verses stated below: (Koran 4:15) If two men among you commit indecency (sodomy) punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, let them be. Allah is forgiving and merciful. (Koran 4:16) If any one of your women is guilty of lewdness ...confine them until death claims them. As you can see, for women any sort of sexual exploration is punishable by death. Whereas for a man, any form of perversion is pardoned by the all merciful Allah. Such fairness can only be found in the "holiest of the holiest books", the Koran. (Koran 4:34) ...As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them, refuse to share their beds and BEAT THEM... Mohammed was an old perverted nutcase. He was so insecure about himself that he thought that showing physical prowess over women would serve as a reminder to him of his manliness. Thus, he encouraged wife beating! In Islam equality between a man and a woman is a far cry. A man needs only to be suspicious to justify the bestial act of beating his wife. (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 215) Omar reported from the Holy Prophet who said, "No man shall be questioned for beating his wife." In the very next Hadith a woman complained to Mohammed that her husband beat her while she prayed. Mohammed told her to change her time of prayer or pray shorter prayers so that her husband could get on with the joy of beating her. (Reported by Abu Sayeed al-Kodri, Attest by Abu Daud) Could Mohammed degrade women any further? If you are asking yourself this question then surprisingly you have not yet grasped the true nature of this "great Prophet" . He allowed the utterly inhuman practice of circumcision for females. In this type of circumcision a girl's clitoris is carved away, so that she may never experience climax during sexual intercourse and her vulva is sewn shut until it is cut open at the time of marriage! Such "great" practices can only be sactioned by Islam-- the religion for all women to embrace! (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 738) Abul Malih reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "Circumcision is Sunnat (required by Islamic law) for males and optional for females." OK, enough of looking at the negative side of Islam. Now lets look at the positive side of this religion. Mohammed said that a man before marrying a woman has to pay her a dowry. Surely, as the many devout muslims would say, you can't criticize that. Ah, but they are mistaken, then again, that's not anything new. Read the quote below from Al Hadis. (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 657) Oqbah-b- A`mer reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "The most equitable of the conditions of marriage is that you should fulfil that (dowry) with which you have made private parts lawful." So, according to Mohammed and his Allah a man has to pay the woman before he can use her private parts. Which means that the man is supposed to treat his wife as a prostitute by paying her before he gets a legal permit for having sex. This implies that the foundation for marriage in Islam is to provide a man with legal sexual gratification and nothing else matters. Now, hold on! Doesn't Islam say that prostitution is not allowed? Of course, it does! It's right there in Sahih Muslim Hadith: (Sahih Muslim Hadith Chapter 619) Selling a cat, selling a dog (unless it is a working dog), and earning of prostitutes(unless they are non-muslims),... are all forbidden. Here we have a contradiction! But, again, that is nothing new for the Koran. It is full of contradictions. But I digress, a separate article will be devoted to this in the coming weeks. Back to the dowry issue. Mohammed was not a man who would have people speculate on what he has said. He had to specify what he meant by dowry and specify he did in Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 659 (57). He said that, "a handful of barley or dates is enough." Not only are the wives supposed to be treated as prostitutes, but as prostitutes who only deserve "a handful of barley or dates". Another quote from the Hadith gives total control of women's lives to men. (Al Hadis, Vol 2, p. 651) Abu Hurairah reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "No woman shall give a woman in marriage, nor shall a woman give herself in marriage. Verily, the fornicatress is she that marries by herself." Here Mohammed takes away the right of a woman to choose her husband. She has no right to decide how to live her life. This basic right is snatched away from her and given to a man. Furthermore, this implies that a widow has no final authority over her daughter in Islam. As if men didn't already have the legal freedom to control and degrade women's lives that they were granted further control to degrade women. During a Jihad expedition (holy war) Mohammed's men came to him very frustrated. As seen in the quote below: (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 686) Ibn Masud reported, "We were fighting with the Messenger of Allah, and our wives were not with us. We asked the Messenger of Allah, 'Should we castrate ourselves?' The Holy Prophet forbade us from that, and then he allowed us Muta (temporary) marriage. So, we all married wives for a fixed time (usually three days) for the dowry of a piece of cloth." Here Mohammed clearly tells the muslims to forget about the prostitutes they had purchased for a handful of dates back home and to have fun with these new victims who come even cheaper. They can be bought and violated for only a piece of cloth. Allah is truly merciful! Praise be to Allah! In other civilized countries this is called rape--plain and simple. The mullahs happily approve this dastardly deed by quoting from the Koran. (Koran, 5:87): "...Make not unlawful the good things Allah hath made lawful for you." Thus this heinous crime is still committed by muslims as attested by the Indo-Pak war, Arab-Israeli war, Iraq- Iran war, Iraq-Kuwait war, etc. Sometimes Mohammed's lust was so great that he conveniently forgot all the Koranic verses invented by him and did not have time to come up with an ammendment. One instance of this is noted when he married Safiya, a Jewish girl, after killing her father and her betrothed husband. He did not want to go through the long laborious procedure of finding a sponsor, paying the dowry, sending out invitations, or preparing a wedding feast. In fact, Mohammed skipped over the usual law of waiting until her next monthly was passed. He consummated his "marriage" to her on a sand dune with the blood and gore of Jihad still covering him, even Safiya's father's blood, no doubt. This is another case of rape, but for Mohammed it was just a beautiful marriage sanctioned by the All Perverted Allah! It is sickening to read the Koran and the Hadiths and the low and inhuman opinion that this so called despicable Mohammed has on women. (Al Hadis, Vol. 2. p. 638) Abdur Rahman- b-Salem reported that the Apostle of Allah said, "You should marry virgins, and verily they are sweeter in tongue, more prolific in wombs, and easily satisfied with little." I don't think I need to explain the quote above. It is quite clear. The list of legalized inhuman acts continues on. For example, a man has a right to divorce his wife by uttering the word, "Talaq" only three times, whereas a woman has no such right, a man can have upto four wives. No such "privilege" exists for a woman in Islam. A man may practise sodomy and in fact, it is even encouraged as it is legal in the muslim Paradise. But any sort of lewdness for women is punishable by death. Some would now think that there is absolutely no hope for women in Islam. How dare you let such a thought enter your filthy mind! May you be roasted in hellfire for thinking this way. Actually, the "all merciful" Allah did tell Mohammed that a woman can enter paradise! How, you may ask? Well, it's quite simple. All she has to do is please her husband--answer to his mating call wherever or whenever he wants and Bingo!, she's got a free one-way ticket to paradise! See how easy it is. She doesn't have to be intelligent, she doesn't have to have a good personality and she need not perform any good deeds. All she has to do is obey and please her husband. That's it! She gets to go to paradise and watch her husband make out with the 72 Houris and 28 young boys-- every woman's dream come true. Is it any wonder that Mohammed's wives fought over him every night? Again, I have listed the quotes below which support my point. (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p. 211 (60)) Omme Salmah reported that the messenger of Allah said, "Any female (wife or concubine) who dies while her husband was pleased with her will enter Paradise." This is clarified in the very next Hadith. (Al Hadis, Vol. 1, p.211 (61)) Tal qe-b-Ali reported that the Messenger of Allah said, "When a man calls his wife to satisfy his desire, let her come to him though she is occupied at the oven." (Al Hadis, Vol. 4, p. 172, No. 34) Ali reported that the Apostle of Allah said, "There is in Paradise a market wherein there will be no buying or selling, but will consist of men and women. When a man desires a beauty, he will have intercourse with them." Notice that all the privileges are granted to men and even though women may enter paradise they do not get 72 male sex bombs and 28 young girls. Shouldn't it be the same for them as well? One can imagine how Muslims must treat women of other faiths if they treat Muslim women in such a degrading manner. One should not accept much from a religion which dictates how one should piss, fart, and shit! (Al Hadis, Vol. 2, p. 682-683, No. 106) Ayesha reported that the Prophet of Allah enquired as he was dying, "Where shall I pass tomorrow, where shall I pass tomorrow?" He was hoping it would be me (Ayesha), so his other wives gave him permission to use their turns so he could be with me (Ayesha) until he died. Picture this, here is a "saintly" old man dying in the arms of his seventeen year old child bride and still fantasizing about which one of his wives to have sex with the next day. How truly divine the Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) was!! http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate/libido.html
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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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Wow, another list of numbers that has nothing to do with my point.
-------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Notice that all the privileges are granted to men and even though women may enter paradise they do not get 72 male sex bombs and 28 young girls. Shouldn't it be the same for them as well?
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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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I'm out of here, this thread is ridiculous.
I like getting engaged in debates if people actually respond to my points and come back with good ones of their own, instead of just flooding the thread with articles they didn't write, and occasionally popping in to repeat the same things over and over without trying to address anything I say. -------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Where did Mohammed come up with these numbers, and why would he promise 28 young boys in paradise if he was not a homosexual or bisexual?
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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(Koran, 4:34) ...Guard in (the husband's)absence what Allah would have them guard...
This verse is demanding that the women should guard their private parts for the sake of their husbands. Again, this tells us the low opinion that Mohammed held for women-- objects to be used for sexual fulfillment. Nowhere in the Koran or the Hadiths does it say that a man should guard his private parts or abstain from sex in the absence of their wives. A man can even engage in sexual intercourse with young boys/men without much rebuke from Allah. This is supported by the verses stated below: (Koran 4:15) If two men among you commit indecency (sodomy) punish them both. If they repent and mend their ways, let them be. Allah is forgiving and merciful. (Koran 4:16) If any one of your women is guilty of lewdness ...confine them until death claims them.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Quote: What points, that not all muslims are violent? I did actually respond. Not all Nazis are violent, but they support a violent system of oppression. Is Hitler a prophet of god, what about Pol Pot?
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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I wish you were willing to read the articles, rather than brushing them off as to long or irrelevant.
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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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Not all Muslims support Muslim governments. If they did, then they would all support a violent system of oppression, but they don't. Many believe in the spiritual aspects of Islam, yet do not believe in the extreme political viewpoints that some other Muslims believe in.
Why, might I ask, were you posting all these violent quotes from the Koran? It almost seems as though you're under the impression that you're arguing with someone who believes that the Koran is entirely non-violent. I obviously don't believe that, so I'm not sure what that's going to prove to me. Is Hitler a prophet of god, what about Pol Pot? Obviously not, and that's partly my point. Those people are political leaders, to be a follower of them, you're following political ideas. You can be a Muslim without adopting extreme politics, because unlike Nazism, it's a religion, and not a political belief. Anyways, I'm going to bed. -------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Islam is an Arabian Nationalist political movement, disguised as a religion, this is not new to Islam. Are you seriously trying to say that Mohammed was not a political leader, and a bad one at that? We don't know if Nazism will have a cult following in 1400 years but its possible, considering there are people who defend equally hateful, hypocritical, and flawed cults, such as Islam. Mohammed was worse than Hitler, Stalin, and even Pol Pot, because at least these mass murdering politicians did not claim to be prophets. Mohammed ranks with the false Christians of the dark ages, who had people burned alive, claiming of course they were doing this in god's name. At least Stalin and Hitler did not claim there were torturing people in gods name, or because god commanded it. Islam therefore, has continued to do damage, centuries after the Arabian Nationalist political leader known as Mohammed, died. Other religions are not as bad as Islam because even though crimes have been committed in the past by people claiming they were doing these crimes for their religion, the Koran itself and the "profit" who founded it, was a sadistic, hypocrite. Muslims continue to commit crimes against humanity, not because they misinterpreted the Koran, but because they are doing what their unholy book tells them to do, kill the "kafirs", rape their women, beat your women if you suspect them! Because Muhammed was a sexist, rapist, pedophile, and sadist, muslims in general are such. They are not like the false Christians, they are true Muslims, doing what Islam commands of them.
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Carpal Tunnel Registered: 04/10/99 Posts: 11,394 Loc: Canada Last seen: 3 months, 5 days |
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A) Do you have any numbers on percentages of Muslims who engage in, or condone rape, murder, pedophilia, etc...? You said: "Because Muhammed was a sexist, rapist, pedophile, and sadist, muslims in general are such." But that is not a logical assumption to make. You haven't provided any evidence that most Muslims actually think this way. You have made assumptions based on the contents of the Koran. I have known several Muslims in my life, and they have all behaved pretty much like all other humans. I have no reason to believe that any of them engaged in rape, murder, or pedophilia.
Your tactics are completely irrational. Why would you want to promote hatred towards all Muslims, when many people who consider themselves Muslim do not condone violence? You can't entirely wipe out a religion, that is a completely unreasonable goal. You can, however, slowly adapt a group of people to peaceful thinking. You can do this by encouraging the members of the group who already promote peace to work within their community to spread their message. Obviously no Muslim is going to listen to some guy who thinks that they're all evil. That guy is just going to make them angry, and help to foster the idea that they're being persecuted, further promoting violent thinking. Is that your goal? Obviously you're opposed to violent Muslims... so what's the point in attacking all of them, making them all angry? Even a peaceful Muslim is going to think you're a dick, and will have absolutely no repect for your opinions. Your attitude is exactly the kind of thing that the violent Muslims look for to justify their actions. B) Do you realize that in the past, pedophilia was far more common in many different cultures? Even a few hundred years ago, it was not uncommon for middle aged European men to marry twelve year old girls. It's only natural that people from ancient times are going to come up looking pretty evil if you judge them by the standards of today. C) A quote from Mein Kampf: Quote: D) From the Bible: http://bible.gospelcom.net/passage/?search=Numbers%2031:7-18&version=31; Quote: So murdering nonvirgins, and kidnapping women to take for yourself is condoned in the bible, therefore doing this kind of thing does not make you a "false christian". You can go here: http://www.evilbible.com/ for all kinds of examples of weirdness in the bible. The bible advocates stoning women to death if they are unfaithful, yet you seem to consider Christians who practice such things "false Christians", while Muslims who practice the violent parts of their scripture are following things accurately. However, many Christians interpret the bible much differently from its literal translation. Just like many Muslims interpret the Koran much differently from its literal translation. You seem to believe that the contents of the Koran are evidence that most Muslims follow it literally, but this is not the case. Many, many Muslims do not take it literally, and unless you can provide the results of a widespread survey or census on the number of Muslims who hold the literal beliefs outlined in the quotes you keep pasting, the details of what the quotes say are meaningless. Look, here are a few things from the bible, advocating murdering all kinds of people: Quote: So why aren't the Christians who do not advocate the murder of adulterers, homosexuals, nonbelievers, and followers of other religions considered "false Christians", instead of the ones who do? It seems you've got a double standard for Islam and Christianity. -------------------- "I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson http://phluck.is-after.us
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Seeker Registered: 06/15/05 Posts: 376 Loc: Inside my head Last seen: 18 years, 4 months |
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Quote: A double standard??? In america??? I am shocked! /gasp! -------------------- Think for yourself. Question authority. Forgiveness is the ultimate sacrifice. You can fool some people sometimes, but you can't fool all the people all the time.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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I hate Islam, not Muslims. Can you see a difference? A person claiming to be a prophet should set a good example. Cutting off various body parts, rape, torture, kidnapping, pedophilia and murder are all actions that a prophet can not condone. Attacking other religions is simply not going to have any effect on my opinion. You have not told me why I should consider this greedy, selfish, Arabian Nationalist politician to be a good person or a prophet of god, even Hitler did not go so far as to claim that he had word from god to kill the Jews, he admits this is his assumption.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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Muslims, and those who live in muslim nations are the main victim of Islam. While the rest of the world has moved on, muslims are still living in the dark ages. I want to help muslims see that Mohhamed was an evil tyrant, and his cult is holding them back. I am not trying to convert them to any other religion, and I am not trying to force them to leave Islam. I am trying to convince them to leave Islam, because Islam is hurting Muslims most of all. Muslim women are not the only people that are harmed by Mohhamed's teachings. Muslim men, as well as religius minorities living in the areas where Islam is the main "religion" live in constant fear of torture and death.
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LibertarianEnfor Registered: 04/23/05 Posts: 581 Last seen: 18 years, 1 month |
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You get jerks in any country and in any religion. Rape, for instance, is universally condemned in Western or Christian nations. But Islam teaches its sons that raping an infidel women in a Dar al Harb country is acceptable. It's really just taking war brides, so that's all right.
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