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InvisibleSwami
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Spiritual types and personalisms
    #4412726 - 07/16/05 07:43 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Rather than debate ideas, way too many of the self-proclaimed "path-walkers" would rather discuss me (or others). This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination.

It is easy to spot when someone starts their thread with, "Swami, you are a ..."

This is a place to exchange thoughts not to discuss personalities.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412735 - 07/16/05 07:47 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

What is a path-walker? I walk the paths in the nature preserve by my house...


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412745 - 07/16/05 07:49 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Let's turn this around..

if you were approached by a guy that tells you he was aboard an alien space ship? Would you not first think about the talker, and not his words? Wouldn't you consider what does it make him say that?
You would probably stand there thinking what it's about, is he a liar, or is he sick or whatever..

You would not be able to separate the talker from his words


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4412753 - 07/16/05 07:54 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

I would know that the talker was human and that humans are notorious for misperceiving. I certainly would not ask him if his mother abandoned him as a child. I would want to know the details of the sighting.

For decades I took everything said at face value when I investigated; only after thousands of such trails turned up cold, did I "become cynical" or realistic about such claims.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412772 - 07/16/05 08:03 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

no misperception, the guy said he was inside, talking to alien creatures, would you not analise him in your head?


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I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine

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InvisibleFucknuckle
Dog Lover

Registered: 04/24/04
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412774 - 07/16/05 08:03 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

So when you start threads and make statements about an entire group of people. Say they are very mislead and mistaken. That your decision is fact and must be accepted bacause you have a percieved logical edge?

Swami when you go out of your way, as you have done in this thread, to invite a debate about how someone questions your ideas and conclustions. What do you think will happen ?

Then you complain whin and bitch about it..........

That's what your doing now right ?

And when you say " That person is not playing fare"

Tehn you make such judgements like "Rather than debate ideas, way too many of the self-proclaimed "path-walkers" would rather discuss me (or others). This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination."


And then you ask why do people always question me ?

Maybe it is you who fears the truth ?

I do not know I am not you

And you are not me

So please stop deciding what I am fearfull off and stop make conclustion aboput me and others based on your own conclustions.


While I may do that from time to time it will be based on facts taht you present not what I conclude

That it a fatal weakness I think you have. I conclude LOL Love


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4412782 - 07/16/05 08:07 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

I've never seen one of these 'Swami is a' threads..


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Kalix]
    #4412786 - 07/16/05 08:09 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

But you will see many " Swami say you are a " threads


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4412821 - 07/16/05 08:19 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

I have seen a cpl.. This being one that almost offended me, I think Swami is jaded and cynical enough to be a cute anachronism though.. Swami is a valuable addition to the Shroomery.. In my mind, he is the archetype of the skeptic..

And a lot of times he does have valid arguments, but sometimes he doesn't, for instance, when commenting on shamans using rattles and smoke to cure illness, how can we be so sure our medicine is so much more effective? We have never even done clinical trials comparing Shamanism to modern Western medicine..

I think it is important to remain skeptical, but I also think it's important not to attack peoples belief systems with generalizations that border on racist.. To a tribal or aboriginal person, the idea that we treat illness with pills, or cancer with toxic radiation is just as absurd as the idea that they treat illness with song, trance, drums, rattles, and smoke


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Kalix]
    #4412844 - 07/16/05 08:25 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

And a lot of times he does have valid arguments, but sometimes he doesn't, for instance, when commenting on shamans using rattles and smoke to cure illness, how can we be so sure our medicine is so much more effective?

One of the major reasons Native American populations were low was due to infant mortality. This problem has largely been addressed by modern medicine.

True or false?

After the arrival of the Europeans in America, the Indian shamans were unable to stop the spread of small pox through shamanic means.

True or false?


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The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Kalix]
    #4412851 - 07/16/05 08:28 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

The name or word "Swami" appears 1000 times in posts over the last five years.

Discussing me is NOT discussing S&P.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412852 - 07/16/05 08:28 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Rather than debate ideas, way too many of the self-proclaimed "path-walkers" would rather discuss me (or others). This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination.

It is easy to spot when someone starts their thread with, "Swami, you are a ..."

This is a place to exchange thoughts not to discuss personalities.




I thought this was funny you said that then said this...

"Funny how many claim to have deep insight into the workings of the universe and the human condition whilst tripping and/or meditating and then state "you're a jerk for not agreeing with me" and "btw, can someone please help me with my failing relationship" and "how do I deal with a tyrant boss" and other ordinary problems.

If your mind-blowing perceptions cannot help you deal with day-to-day stuff, then they are near-worthless with no more substance than any other dream."

The part I like best is when you said this "This is a place to exchange thoughts not to discuss personalities"


Ok without turning this into a cat fight. Let me ask you a question

Explain the two sided coin you have presented. Put the mojo in your convections Swami. I don't understand the position you have made. I would like to know how a person is to have a discusion with you when you will not discuss you. Oh you demand that many of us will not examine ourselves. Can you examine yourself. Oh wait this is not the place to have a personal discussion. See swami what you have done ?

I mean how am I suppose to follow guidelines that you demand when you yourself go out of your way......





Maybe I should use your tech. I will say all I want about anyone but withhold there name and thereby fall within what is acceptable ?

Isn't that what you do ? Hide behind a mask to say what you feel ?


How do you expect to get any real respect when you do these things? What is the point ? Please explain :smile:


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412907 - 07/16/05 08:44 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
And a lot of times he does have valid arguments, but sometimes he doesn't, for instance, when commenting on shamans using rattles and smoke to cure illness, how can we be so sure our medicine is so much more effective?

One of the major reasons Native American populations were low was due to infant mortality. This problem has largely been addressed by modern medicine.

True or false?

After the arrival of the Europeans in America, the Indian shamans were unable to stop the spread of small pox through shamanic means.

True or false?




First off, I have to admit that Iknow next to nothing about infant mortality rates in pre-european invlovement Native American cultures, do you have a source for this?

Second I would like to ask, if a culture that was technologically advanced to ours, was spreading, say, anthrax by giving us some gift, would that immediatly discount our medicines?

Why is it that so many people that have ready access to Western medicine use homeopathy, shamanism, yoga, etc.. in conjunction with Western medicine? Wny not integrate what works into a cohesive method for treating illness??


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4412995 - 07/16/05 09:10 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

After the arrival of the Europeans in America, the Indian shamans were unable to stop the spread of small pox through shamanic means.
__________________________________________________________

Cancer still kills and has not been conquered. Over 100,000 deaths a year are attributed to reactions to pharm medications and medical procedures. Heart disease, still a major killer. The list goes on. But that doesn't invalidate modern medicine.

Shamanic healing did work for some things. Things of a spiritual or psychological nature. The fact that they couldn't treat everything doesn't invalidate it. Also many modern medicines were first derived from plants used by shamans, with some good effect.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Icelander]
    #4413018 - 07/16/05 09:15 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Building from Icelander's point.. Let's not forget that the Shaman serves MANY roles in the tribe. Healer was just another one. And lest we forget that approximately 25% of western pharmaceuticals come from rainforest products. keeping in mind that less than 1% of these tropical trees and plants have been tested by scientists. Shamanic healing did, and does work for a great number of things. They hold more knowledge in their heads about natural medicine than all of our books on it combined.


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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413062 - 07/16/05 09:27 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

And the fact the modern medicine has only been around for 150 years or so. The Shaman have had 25,000 years to get it right


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4413105 - 07/16/05 09:40 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

"This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination."

Good point. A spiritual path should constantly lead one to adopt new paradigms. Old ideas should be discarded as they become outmoded so that new ideas can be implemented. This is sometimes a painful process, but it is a healthy one that assures stasis will not occur. When one finds stasis growth stops. To use a path of the spirit to "harden one's shell", so to speak, is to embrace falsehood at it's very root.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4413120 - 07/16/05 09:45 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

"One of the major reasons Native American populations were low was due to infant mortality. This problem has largely been addressed by modern medicine."

I have to call you on this one though. Have you ever heard of population control. It ensures a population of animals stays healthy so that overpopulation does not occur. This was NOT a problem to the Native Americans, but a natural means of population control. Man is after all merely an animal.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4413147 - 07/16/05 09:51 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

This was NOT a problem to the Native Americans

Depends on the perspective. To the squaw who lost her child it certainly was. To a small tribe that needed more warriors, it was definitely a problem.

From the perspective of natural balance it wasn't.

Either way, the shamans were unable to address the issue with their methods.


--------------------



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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4413162 - 07/16/05 09:55 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

What does that have to do with their effectiveness?

Obesity/heart disease is currently the leading cause of death in the US, by far. All the miracles of 'modern medicine' haven't done a thing for it. It's only gotten worse. By that same rationale, I guess modern medicine is completely worthless.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4413174 - 07/16/05 09:58 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

The shaman treats ills of the mind and spirit...a healer treats ills of the body. Sometimes a shaman was all of these things. Native societies have a holistic view of medicine. They see illness as mental, spiritual, and physical. They attempted to address all of these aspects. The herbalist of ancient times was limited by his technology. While a shaman was sometimes an herbalist and healer often he was not. The shaman heals only the spirit. A modern shaman would advise an ill person to seek the advice of a doctor for the physical aspect of the healing. There are many misconceptions of the shaman and I have addressed one.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413193 - 07/16/05 10:05 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomism said:
What does that have to do with their effectiveness?

Obesity/heart disease is currently the leading cause of death in the US, by far. All the miracles of 'modern medicine' haven't done a thing for it. It's only gotten worse. By that same rationale, I guess modern medicine is completely worthless.




Aye.. Not to mention SIDS.. We may as well take up our rattles and drums huh Swami?


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413235 - 07/16/05 10:17 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Obesity/heart disease is currently the leading cause of death in the US, by far.
*scratches head* There will ALWAYS be a number one cause of death. What is the relevence? Heart disease usually affects people long after their time for breeding and does not affect the population the way infant mortality does.

All the miracles of 'modern medicine' haven't done a thing for it. It's only gotten worse. By that same rationale, I guess modern medicine is completely worthless.
Once again, I strongly suspect here we have someone who is just ranting and does not really believe what he espouses. I will recant if you state for the record that you have NEVER taken advantage of modern medicine in any form. How many fillings do you have? Innoculations? Medicine in your cabinet? Ever had a cast? Stitches? Treatment for VD? Born in a hospital?


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4413285 - 07/16/05 10:35 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Once again, I strongly suspect here we have someone who is just ranting and does not really believe what he espouses.

Your powers of seeing through my sarcasm are unsurpassed :smirk: :smile:

Actually I was just making a point, using your logic. Just directed at modern medicine instead of shamans.

Have I NEVER taken advantage of modern medicine? Yeah right, I was born in America.  Hell, my mom is the head nurse of an ER. Born in a hospital? Yes, but not much say in that.. Had a cast? Yep, got hit by a car when I was 6. Stitches? Yep. Done some myself. Innoculations? Of course. Treatment for VD? Thank god no. I have 4 fillings last I checked, and one crown, that I got when I was 10. Medicine in what cabinet? No I don't have any medicine, unless you consider valerian root, or golden seal, or tea tree oil modern medicine.

That said, I haven't been to a hospital or doctor or dentist in over 8 years. I don't take vitamins, don't take pharmies. Granted it's probably because I'm too poor to afford the hospital :smirk: .. but I've done just fine without it. I can barely remember the last time I got sick.

But that's beside the point. I do believe in modern medicine.. however many faults it does have. It has a lot of potential. What I would like to see is a merging of modern medicine and natural/herbal healing.. and a moving away from the flood of unnecessary pharmaceuticals. which if what I hear from my mom is true.. the industry is very slowly, but steadily starting to shift towards looking at alternative and natural remedies to integrate into the practice. Fact is, many doctors firmly believe in, and use natural herbs and healing methods instead of harsher pharms or surgery, where it is not immediately life-threatening.

So with all of our wonders of modern medicine, they are just now starting to pick up medical practices that work, that have existed for thousands of years.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413293 - 07/16/05 10:38 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

"What I would like to see is a merging of modern medicine and natural/herbal healing.. and a moving away from the flood of unnecessary pharmaceuticals."

My view as well. There is a place for powerful drugs, but often they are not needed.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4413301 - 07/16/05 10:42 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4413318 - 07/16/05 10:50 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Indeed. The amount of pharmaceutical deaths due to misdiagnosis, drug interaction, etc.. is completely unnecessary. You can't pop a pill for anything. We'll figure it out sooner or later.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413380 - 07/16/05 11:11 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Herbalism and shamanism are different fields which only occasionally overlap. Nice commingling though as way to obsfucate the points made.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4413453 - 07/16/05 11:36 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

:laugh:

WOO! I can obfuscate!

But in my view of shamanism.. herbs play an important role.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413482 - 07/16/05 11:44 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Herbs are biological plant chemicals and have nothing to do with accessing any spirit world.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4413515 - 07/16/05 11:52 PM (18 years, 8 months ago)

That's a matter of opinion, don't you think. :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroomgrow: :scaryshroom:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineDoctorJ
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Shroomism]
    #4413564 - 07/17/05 12:03 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

one shouldn't confuse the scientific practice of modern medicine with the capitalist practice of modern medicine. they are, unfortunately, two different things.

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Icelander]
    #4413568 - 07/17/05 12:04 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

No, not a matter of opinion.

The affect of dandelion root (or whatever) does not require the herbalist to have done any sort of spiritual practice or have any sort of understanding at all. All that is required is the the herb is relatively fresh and potent.

This is what I rail against here; the fuzzy world where everything is a mere matter of personal outlook. All advancements come from understanding of the nature of reality not from pretending.


--------------------



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4413586 - 07/17/05 12:08 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Herbs are biological plant chemicals and have nothing to do with accessing any spirit world.




Sorry maybe you misunderstand me. I was thinking of magic mushrooms as an herb with the ability to access the spirit world. Also other plants/herbs such as salvia ect.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Icelander]
    #4413650 - 07/17/05 12:23 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Sorry that I use the standard definitions when writing. A fungus is not an herb nor is salvia used in any tradition of physical healing.

Please look up herb and shaman.

Not necessarily to Ice Man

I guess we just keep going further and further afield as weak points are deconstructed. I call this dishonesty and is what politicans do rather than directly address issues.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4413707 - 07/17/05 12:38 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Sorry that I use the standard definitions when writing. A fungus is not an herb nor is salvia used in any tradition of physical healing.

Please look up herb and shaman.

Not necessarily to Ice Man

I guess we just keep going further and further afield as weak points are deconstructed. I call this dishonesty and is what politicans do rather than directly address issues.




Many mushrooms have scientifically proved health benefits. I sell them. Also it is my understanding that the Shamans who use salvia often give it to their sick patients as part of the treatment. If the physical problem is caused by emotional issues then salvia could be effective as a treatment, which I believe it is. Shamans, as has been stated believe that there is often a emotional/psychological component to physical illness. This is now the basis of much research into health issues in our present time. Take the idea of stomach ulcers and emotional stress for instance. Many, including myself, do not always agree with the standard definitions of things. That does not necessarily mean we are wrong. Knowledge is being expanded all the time. What was once snake oil may have merit. Much may not.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (07/17/05 12:39 AM)

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Icelander]
    #4413770 - 07/17/05 12:51 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Many mushrooms have scientifically proved health benefits. I sell them.
You sell them and are unaware that mushrooms are not herbs? That sort of ignorance in your field of study is just plain sad.

Many, including myself, do not always agree with the standard definitions of things.
This is total bullshit. Botanical terms have every specific meanings and reclassifying on the fly precludes any form of communication.

I will buy some of your product and send you whatever I want to as payment because I will make up my own definition of a dollar. How would that work?


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4413865 - 07/17/05 01:23 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Many mushrooms have scientifically proved health benefits. I sell them.
You sell them and are unaware that mushrooms are not herbs? That sort of ignorance in your field of study is just plain sad.

Many, including myself, do not always agree with the standard definitions of things.
This is total bullshit. Botanical terms have every specific meanings and reclassifying on the fly precludes any form of communication.

I will buy some of your product and send you whatever I want to as payment because I will make up my own definition of a dollar. How would that work?




You make me laugh swami. I know that by defination they are not herbs, and I do know the difference, but I don't really care. The point is that they are used by shamans for healing and entering the spirit world.

Sorry but you can call bullshit all you want. I do not agree with all the terms in the dictionary. I still manage to communicate with "most" people quite well.

Your tactic seems to be to win the point on technical terms while choosing to ignore the spirit of what people are saying. Based on this, I am not any more impressed with your abilities as a logical person as you are mine as a herbalist. Which I am not by the way. I think it benefits people more to try to work as partners on ideas for growth. I am learning here fast that debating people just to prove them wrong on some point is not conductive to growth of the spirit. I don't know why you come here but it is a main reason, I do. You can choose to call me sad and call what I believe bullshit. That's your way of living. To each his own.

I'm sure you can find medicinal mushrooms where you live. You might need them someday.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Icelander]
    #4414056 - 07/17/05 03:49 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

You make me laugh swami.
That is my purpose.

I know that by defination they are not herbs, and I do know the difference, but I don't really care.
So you make an incorrect statement, then respond that we all create our own definitions; then finish with apathy. You can be hard to follow.

Sorry but you can call bullshit all you want.
You admitted you were in error so why take offense?

I do not agree with all the terms in the dictionary.
Here is the standard conflation from one specific term to "all words in the dictionary". Why the need to do that?

I still manage to communicate with "most" people quite well.
Not by making up your own on-the-spot definitions you don't. Commonality is necessary for communication. The internet and telephones and language and business transactions and so on are impossible without agreed upon protocols.

Your tactic seems to be to win the point on technical terms while choosing to ignore the spirit of what people are saying.
Thank you for the personal synopsis. I only come here for the free and spot-on psychoanalysis.

Based on this, I am not any more impressed with your abilities as a logical person as you are mine as a herbalist.
Well I certainly feel duly chastised. I make my living using logic which passes the real-world test.

I am learning here fast that debating people just to prove them wrong on some point is not conductive to growth of the spirit.
I have discovered that a logical debate is nigh impossible because of emotionalism and the inability to not conflate or shift topics and pretend that is what was being discussed all long.

I don't know why you come here...
That is not necessary for discussion yet people would rather focus on that in lieu of real debate.

You can choose to call me sad and call what I believe bullshit.
Of course that is not what I said at all.

That's your way of living.
What is?

I'm sure you can find medicinal mushrooms where you live. You might need them someday.
Relevance?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4414065 - 07/17/05 04:15 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Kathleen Harris is an ethnobotanist that was cured of a heart disease by a Shamanic Salvia Ritual.. Read Breaking Open the Head by Pinchbeck.. . And I was comingling herbalism with Shamanism because they are bot forms of medicine that tribal people co-mingle, and when asked how they learned the benefits of certain plants the standard reply is "the plants told us"

Hence without Shamanism they wouldn't have their forms of herbalism.. So the two are definetely co-dependant..


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4414067 - 07/17/05 04:19 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Herbs are biological plant chemicals and have nothing to do with accessing any spirit world.




Come on man.. Cannabis.. Salvia.. Sinchuichi.. Tobacco.. There's more too..


--------------------


My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Kalix]
    #4414074 - 07/17/05 04:29 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Kathleen Harris is an ethnobotanist that was cured of a heart disease by a Shamanic Salvia Ritual..
Perhaps; perhaps not. Any budding scientist knows that anecdote tell us very little.

Read Breaking Open the Head by Pinchbeck.. .
Why assume I haven't read it? I have read over 2000 books and that among them. Do a shroomery search.

and when asked how they learned the benefits of certain plants the standard reply is "the plants told us"
So they first ate any old plant which then told them which other plants to eat. That doesn't make sense now does it?

So the two are definetely co-dependant..
Not at all. Would you care to wager that there are shamans who do not use herbs and herbalists who do not use any shamanic methods? Do some research before responding.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Spiritual types and personalizationisms of other cultures [Re: Kalix]
    #4414075 - 07/17/05 04:30 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

shamanistic lineage, and shamanistic emulation are not the same thing.

"the plants told us directly", is not a literal statement, it is what the shaman told the gringo investigator, who is truly an uninitiated alien. (less than an uninitiated tribe member - politics is going on in that picture - imagine telling the investigator that they never smoke salvia divinorum or ska maria pastora - an outright obfuscation to gringos!).

From this quote many foolish things have followed.

Western style superiority does not prevail over the inner spiritual domain of real shamans operating in tribal groups, they already have a rigorous world view that does not need gringos; these leaders would treat their own people as goofy students, and they treat outsiders with far more reserve and private humor.

I could say that all shamans in modern culture made it up themselves.
good for them!


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Kalix]
    #4414076 - 07/17/05 04:33 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Come on man.. Cannabis.. Salvia.. Sinchuichi.. Tobacco.. There's more too..

Taken completely out of context. Nice job! Go back and read the thread. Herbs do NOT require shamanic practices to have effect. This is 100% demonstrable and was all that was said.

One day I will teach a course in reading comprehension. S&P sorely needs it.


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OfflineKalix
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4414093 - 07/17/05 05:13 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Kathleen Harris is an ethnobotanist that was cured of a heart disease by a Shamanic Salvia Ritual..
Perhaps; perhaps not. Any budding scientist knows that anecdote tell us very little.

Read Breaking Open the Head by Pinchbeck.. .
Why assume I haven't read it? I have read over 2000 books and that among them. Do a shroomery search.

Well, then how come you didn't know about the medicinal use of Salvia?

and when asked how they learned the benefits of certain plants the standard reply is "the plants told us"
So they first ate any old plant which then told them which other plants to eat. That doesn't make sense now does it?

Not to you.

So the two are definetely co-dependant..
Not at all. Would you care to wager that there are shamans who do not use herbs and herbalists who do not use any shamanic methods? Do some research before responding.




The exception not the rule..


--------------------


My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Kalix]
    #4414108 - 07/17/05 05:50 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

So they first ate any old plant which then told them which other plants to eat. That doesn't make sense now does it?

Not to you.

Yes, I am mentally challenged. Perhaps you would care to explain it in greater depth then?

So the two are definetely co-dependant..

The exception not the rule..

Uh-huh. First look up the word co-dependent. Then show your source(s) that shows them to unilaterally interlinked.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Spiritual types and personalizationisms of other cultures [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4414210 - 07/17/05 08:27 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Good point Red. I would say that what I call my shamanic practice is made up. I have not tradition in my culture to pass this knowledge to me. I have had to make do with my one lifetimes worth of investigation.

This may be how the original human shaman started out, although we may never know.

The point for me is, does what I do make me happy and healthy or unhappy and unhealthy.  I don't care too much if I don't pass the technical definition of shamanic practice. My life is mine to make up and play with.  Like a baby, I want to allow myself some foolishness and mistakes as I learn to walk into my life. I have respect for anyone trying to find a path into the spirit within a culture that does not support many spiritual paths. A good example is the fact that psychedelics are illegal. :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Swami]
    #4414211 - 07/17/05 08:27 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

"Herbs do NOT require shamanic practices to have effect. This is 100% demonstrable and was all that was said."

This is true. All that is required is the knowledge to use them while observing the indications and contraindications of the substance.

redgreenvines:
Good point. One notion that confuses many white people is the Native American notion that plants have a spirit and that they communicate with you. In the context of most primitive cultures this is an accurate statement. One must, however, realize that most native cultures see the spirit and the physical as different ends of the same spectrum...not separate. The spirit is just a continuation of the physical and the reverse. So when Maria Sabina told Albert Hofmann that the psilocybin pills he provided her were the "spirit" of the mushroom she was not expressing quaint, native ignorance. She saw the active principle AS the spirit of the mushroom. That did not negate the metaphysical properties of the substance to her...it is merely one of the active principles properties. To say a plant talks to them is just a simplification of their understanding of how the plant works. Noted survival expert, Tom Brown, has demonstrated that he can handle a plant blindfolded....by only touching it and smelling of it, and identify it and many of it's food and medicinal properties. Witness' to this process say it is easily repeatable, reliable, and can be taught to others. Often, if Mr. Brown is brought a plant he has had no previous contact with he will identify only the food and medicinal properties, but not know the name. A native herbalist will tell you the plant spoke to him....Mr. Brown will tell you that this is an inborn instinct that allows animals to know what foods they can eat. All animals possess it...even man, as he too is an animal. One has only to reawaken the instinct by increasing one's awareness. This is a process that is based in human instinct, but that instinct was a gift of spirit...so, therefore the process would be seen as inherantly spiritual. To see a hallucinogen as communicating with the user, is an analogy that may not be accurate, but it seems to fit.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4414215 - 07/17/05 08:34 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Thats very cool Hue.  That makes the connection between spirit and material very understandable, and fits my belief that everything is spirit. Thanks for putting this out. :thumbup: :mushroom2:

The skills of Tom Brown were once available to most in so called primitive societies. This is the tradition that we lack and so fumble often in our understanding of the natural world and how we might interact with it. At least that's my guess.

Edited by Icelander (07/17/05 08:39 AM)

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4414226 - 07/17/05 08:55 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Fucknuckle said:
So Swami when you go out of your way, as you have done in this thread, to invite a debate about how someone questions your ideas and conclustions. What do you think will happen ?




Then the proposed topic will be discussed, obviously. That is not the problem that said topic is proposing to be discussed. The problem, as it appears he feels, is that, when he makes a point or a statement in some thread, involving some topic that does not concern his own person, someone will reply with a statement that is directed to him and regards his personality, as opposed to an on-topic response that actually involves the topic itself and his addition to that topic.

Quote:


Then you complain whin and bitch about it....That's what your doing now right ?




"Complain, whine, and bitch" are all adjectives that more reflect your own personality and how you perceive reality, as opposed to what Swami has actually done. The entirety of his first post appears as a simple observation, and then a reminder that he feels this is not the point of this forum. Examining the nature of his actual words in this first post demonstrates this, an understanding of literature proves it. No whining or bitching has been demonstrated, and it is simply impossible to infer whether he is complaining or just making an observation. Either way, it is moot, as it is not pertinent to the proposed discussion. :grin:

Quote:


And when you say " That person is not playing fare"




This is an incomplete sentence.. is there more that completes this? Also, I had trouble locating the source wherein Swami said "That person is not playing fare (fair?)"... You made it seem as if they were indeed his words, as you referred to him as having said it, and then put it in direct quotes.. is it in another thread? :confused:

Quote:


Tehn you make such judgements like "Rather than debate ideas, way too many of the self-proclaimed "path-walkers" would rather discuss me (or others). This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination."




I personally would have put to use the word conclusion. Regardless of whether or not his conclusion is an accurate one, the best way to address his conclusion is probably to demonstrate how it is inaccurate. I see it as a general conclusion that isn't directly linked to any examples (thereby making it difficult to validate or invalidate), so I decide to note that Swami has come to this conclusion, see it as a possibillity, and note it for future reference, when I do find evidence to consider it agansit. :hypnotoad:

Quote:


And then you ask why do people always question me ?... Maybe it is you who fears the truth ?... I do not know I am not you




I don't believe he asked why people always question him. Maybe he fears the truth, maybe not. As you said, we are not him, and we do not have enough demonstrateable evidence to base any such thing on, eh? I find it a little strange to make such a statement if one did not feel as if they actually knew, but I dunno. :smirk:

Quote:


And you are not me
So please stop deciding what I am fearfull off and stop make conclustion aboput me and others based on your own conclustions.




I didn't catch where Swami specifically referenced you, unless perhaps you recognize that you are one of the people who discuss him instead of addressing actual points of on-topic discussion. :grin:

I do not understand what it means to not make conclusions based on one's conclusions; however, I think it is an impossible thing to ask one to not come to conclusions. :wink: Perhaps one could request that one does not come to baseless conclusions, but I believe that everyone that comes to a conclusion feels that it is based upon something, so that would be something that would be impossible for someone to discern.

Quote:


That it a fatal weakness I think you have. I conclude LOL Love




Demonstrate your evidence that supports your conclusion that this is a fatal weakness of his. Unless we have something to consider your conclusion with, it is impossible for us to decide whether or not it is an accurate conclusion, which effectively makes your expression mostly pointless. :tongue:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Icelander]
    #4414231 - 07/17/05 08:59 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

In my opinion when you separate the spirt from the physical, as most mainstream religions do, spiritual practice loses all practical application. I am not really curious as to whether there is an afterlife, I am only interested in solving problems in the here and now. As Castaneda wrote, I feel that any moment could be my last battle on Earth so why do I want to waste it worrying about that which is unknown and has no sway over my person at this time? I want help with the battle itself....one thing at a time. This primitive spiritual construct has helped me define a model of a working universe that I have found it handy in solving many personal problems. It cuts through the bullshit and allows me to directly access my spiritual nature to solve problems on that level.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4414237 - 07/17/05 09:02 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

:thumbup:

We only exist within one tense.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4414239 - 07/17/05 09:04 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

That is true, but that is an very interesting way of phrasing it.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4414242 - 07/17/05 09:07 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Good stuff.  :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4414372 - 07/17/05 10:33 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

"Complain, whine, and bitch" are all adjectives

This is not correct.  They are verbs.  :tongue:


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #4414375 - 07/17/05 10:35 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

LunarEclipse said:
This is not correct.  They are verbs.  :tongue:




This is not correct. They are all verbs, but one of them can also be a noun.

:lol:

Thanks for catching my typo! :thumbup:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4414411 - 07/17/05 10:46 AM (18 years, 8 months ago)

They are all verbs, but one of them can also be a noun.


OK Bitch!  :smirk:

Thanks for catching my typo!


Anytime, sir.

The grammar police even work Sundays!  We are here to protect and serve.  :grin:


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.

Edited by LunarEclipse (07/17/05 10:47 AM)

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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: DoctorJ]
    #4422779 - 07/19/05 09:30 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

DoctorJ said:
one shouldn't confuse the scientific practice of modern medicine with the capitalist practice of modern medicine. they are, unfortunately, two different things.



Good point.


--------------------
Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.

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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4422911 - 07/19/05 10:15 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
In my opinion when you separate the spirt from the physical, as most mainstream religions do, spiritual practice loses all practical application. I am not really curious as to whether there is an afterlife, I am only interested in solving problems in the here and now. As Castaneda wrote, I feel that any moment could be my last battle on Earth so why do I want to waste it worrying about that which is unknown and has no sway over my person at this time? I want help with the battle itself....one thing at a time. This primitive spiritual construct has helped me define a model of a working universe that I have found it handy in solving many personal problems. It cuts through the bullshit and allows me to directly access my spiritual nature to solve problems on that level.




So the idea here is not to look past your own nose. To deal with things one block at a time, one step, one wrung of the ladder. To not worry about what you can not see. But yet at the same time you feel as though you have some type of spiritual side to your being ? I am confused about what your saying.

The idea is not to seperate Physical from spiritual. In fact they are intertwined and are dependent on one another. In all my study of " Religion " I have never heard it desciribe as being seperate. I think I have heard many people who refuse to believe there is an after life say that though

All of mankinds accoplishments were done with looking past the next step. TO make plans and develope ideas are dependent on looking to the unseen. All the great discoveries were discovered because someone took the time to care about what they don't understand. People are in a constant need to prove or disprove this or that. How can a person claim to be in contact with a spiritual side and yet claim there is not a desire if there is a afterlife ? I mean isn't that crazy ? What exactly is a spiritual side ? Does your spiritualness depend on death ? does it die ? If so then you have no spiritual needs.

You said it yourself " This primitive spiritual construct has helped me define a model of a working universe that I have found it handy in solving many personal problems. " Why would you hold on to a primitive aspect of humanity ? If it workd for you then cool. But what if you do have an afterlife ? Then what. Humanity owes it's entire success to discovery and planning for the unseen. And you just are going to throw it all out the window. Because your only desire is to the here and now. Today and what you can see ?. Iv'e said it a few times in a few threads. But if mankind had lived all through time like that. Then we would still be rubbing sticks toghter. I can understand the many negitive outlooks on " Religion " But to denie the possiablities of an after life because you can't see it. I think is foolish :heart:

Please help me to understand. It sounds to me like this Castaneda person was unable to look past his nose.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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OfflineGrav
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4423092 - 07/19/05 10:52 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

fireworks_god said:
Quote:

LunarEclipse said:
This is not correct.  They are verbs.  :tongue:




This is not correct. They are all verbs, but one of them can also be a noun.

:lol:

Thanks for catching my typo! :thumbup:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:




Incorrect.  Two of them can be nouns.
End communication.
C:\>_

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4423119 - 07/19/05 10:55 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Engaging in religious practices that serve no practical purpose in the here now is foolish. Pray to some big man in the sky all you want...I will spend my time more wisely. It is also worth noting that my spiritual model was designed for me...I could care less if others don't approve.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4423166 - 07/19/05 11:06 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Ok so your saying that you way is the way ? for you of course :thumbup:

Sounds like all the religions practices you have dismissed. In fact you sound just like many " churches" I have attened.

And you made no attempt to answer my inquires. That's ok I was asking for a lot of info anyway.

I pass to you much love and I hope you find what you seek :heart:


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4423195 - 07/19/05 11:13 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Everybody has their own way. If the Catholic Church suits a person then they go the Catholic way. If the Muslim Church suits a person then they go the Muslim way. My way is for myself alone, though I occasionally meet people who walk a similar path. I try to be one of the first to stand up in defense of a valid spiritual path even if I do not choose to walk it.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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InvisibleFucknuckle
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Re: Spiritual types and personalismsq [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4423360 - 07/19/05 11:49 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

You know what one of the biggest mistakes mankind has made ? TO have this continual and ignorant set of ideals that one religion is right and another is wrong. When is the human race going to see that we are all on the same voyage. I never believed that one religion is better than another( some are pretty screwed up, yes sir). But the end results the bottom line is uassly the same.

Only I do believe that Jesus was the son of God as are we all. And his teachings are the path that must be taken, which is simply perfect love. To love one another as we love ourselves and love your God with all your heart. Yes there are other men who have taught many things that parallel what Jesus taught.

Someone is going to say " You just said we are all on the same page but then you say "Jesus is the only way" "

Well let me rephrase that. Almost all religions have there foundations set in values of Love. And Jesus taught perfect love.


--------------------
What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #4426527 - 07/20/05 01:06 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Rather than debate ideas, way too many of the self-proclaimed "path-walkers" would rather discuss me (or others). This is all fear-based because they tremble when their beliefs are questioned and so must lash out rather than do any deep self-examination.

It is easy to spot when someone starts their thread with, "Swami, you are a ..."

This is a place to exchange thoughts not to discuss personalities.




Dont you end up inevitably talking about other peoples personalities? Just a thought. :wink:

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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #5246079 - 01/31/06 10:01 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

BUMP!

:smirk:

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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Veritas]
    #5246317 - 01/31/06 10:49 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
BUMP!

:smirk:




The dates on these posts should demonstrate exactly what one of the main problems in this forum has been and continues to be.

Personally, I am quite glad to finally see these issues being addressed. :thumbup: Character assasination has no place in this forum, nor does discussing one's personality/behavior in such a manner.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: fireworks_god]
    #5246358 - 01/31/06 10:57 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Indeed. :thumbup:

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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Zero7a1]
    #5246466 - 01/31/06 11:30 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Dont you end up inevitably talking about other peoples personalities?

EXAMPLE, please. I am sure you can find one out of 15,000 posts.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #5248910 - 01/31/06 09:40 PM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

How can a person claim to be in contact with a spiritual side and yet claim there is not a desire if there is a afterlife ? I mean isn't that crazy ? What exactly is a spiritual side ? Does your spiritualness depend on death ? does it die ? If so then you have no spiritual needs.




I'd also say that whether or not there is an afterlife isn't my biggest spiritual concern right now. But that doesn't mean that I don't care. It holds much significance for me, but I know that pure speculation about the unknown will not get me anywhere. I'd rather wait until I'm in a better position to see what really is going to happen (that'd be death if you couldn't get that).

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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Swami]
    #5248911 - 01/31/06 09:41 PM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Dont you end up inevitably talking about other peoples personalities?

EXAMPLE, please. I am sure you can find one out of 15,000 posts.




*15,413 posts

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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: dr0mni]
    #5249491 - 01/31/06 11:55 PM (18 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

dr0mni said:
Quote:

Swami said:
Dont you end up inevitably talking about other peoples personalities?

EXAMPLE, please. I am sure you can find one out of 15,000 posts.




*15,413 posts



From what I hear, that might also be the final tally.

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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Spiritual types and personalisms [Re: Sclorch]
    #5250575 - 02/01/06 10:27 AM (18 years, 1 month ago)

ah damned...I wished that warnings and bannings were finally made public !

Others could learn a lot...


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
......................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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