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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Icelander]
    #4411819 -

heh, he wont respond to things he doesnt care to talk about, or that he doesnt agree with. I think hes mentioned this before.

Have yall ever smelled rotten chickens before? It smells quite nasty.

If you dont take what you experience seriously, you wont seriously learn from your experience. Now, if you wanna be a chicken, you can stick feathers up your butt, and call yourself a chicken... lol, just thought id add that. anyway, to the point.

Drugs are like keys, and they open up doors in your mind. Some of the doors lead to no where, some to bad places, some of them might even lead them to yourself. All of them can be used for self reflection, as in any experience an individual has, it can be of personal significance.

If you cant take normal, drugless, experiences in your life, and understand what meaning it can have to other parts of your life, taking drugs probably wont help you into any real spiritual growth.

Dreams can be a good tool, but being stuck in them without any self reflection, can lead one to ignore the finer things that reality has to offer. Psychadelics may help you realize your dreams, and give you insight, but without any application, they become a material, like all the rest of the materials that people horde themselves with in our status quo culture.


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What?

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Zero7a1]
    #4411827 -

heh, he wont respond to things he doesnt care to talk about

Heh, he won't respond to questions he has answered dozens of times, but the posters would rather bitch than take the time and effort to read it.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Icelander]
    #4411872 -

Third request is a charmer. 

So it would appear... :confused:


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Anxiety is what you make it.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Zero7a1]
    #4411887 -

Have yall ever smelled rotten chickens before? It smells quite nasty.


:whoa:


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Anxiety is what you make it.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412004 -

Swami said:
heh, he wont respond to things he doesnt care to talk about

Heh, he won't respond to questions he has answered dozens of times, but the posters would rather bitch than take the time and effort to read it.


I'm not bitching, Just tell me the name of the thread and I'll look it up. :wink:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412123 -

Swami said "Funny how many claim to have deep insight into the workings of the universe and the human condition whilst tripping and/or meditating and then state "you're a jerk for not agreeing with me" and "btw, can someone please help me with my failing relationship" and "how do I deal with a tyrant boss" and other ordinary problems.

If your mind-blowing perceptions cannot help you deal with day-to-day stuff, then they are near-worthless with no more substance than any other dream. "


So let me ask you this............ Is the quality of self reasurrance by letting others know they are in fact worthless. That thier personal experiences are a dream based an illusion.Is this a worthy atribute ? Maybe your experiences are worthless :frown:

What are you saying ? I don't understand ? What makes you an officer over the realm of personal spiritual experiences of others?



I see you have started another thread where you have placed yourself far above all others. What type of simple problem Have you got Sir Swami ? I mean how many people do we meet in our lives with such a  problem ? Who does one truly think he is right 99% of the time ? What is a greater thorn. To state you have found some personal insite thru the use of a drug and may be incorrect? Or to state that one is always right ?

Swami the point this thread is not "Many around you have got it wrong and in fact are totally false "

The point is you are always right.



It seems you got it all wrong.

How can you truly know what is going on inside anothers life, mind and heart ? You can't.  You can only spew what you think you know and demand that others think you know. You know what I know ?

You have not grown much in the past 2 years I have been reading your posts. Prove me wrong. You can't, I can't no one can. So please stop trying.

Edited by Fucknuckle (07/16/05 05:06 PM)

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412341 -

Quote:
Heh, he won't respond to questions he has answered dozens of times, but the posters would rather bitch than take the time and effort to read it.


heh, i guess that doesnt count PM's either, heh....  :smirk:

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4412711 -

The things that I have stated that I am right about have never been refuted in all these years. Is that arrogance to be able to observe patterns and data and to come to a correct conclusion or to be unable to come to a conclusion and remain silent?

When I stated there was no Face on Mars, how was that arrogant? Was it the statement or my confidence in the conclusion that so irks you? Should I be a trembling mouse to make others feel better? Perhaps you should look at why it pisses you off. Perhaps you would rather judge me while telling others how much you hate judgement...


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412743 -

Well the arrogance you display is not in the fact that you present. It is the point that there is a continual point underlining all of your posts............. Swami is right and you are wrong.

You don't piss me off. You do dissapoint me. You very request that we all should just follow the rules of Philosophical dissucsion. When you are in violation most of the time.

Swami I do not want to get into a persoanl debate with you

I jsut don't understand why you start threads like this. It has only one outcome. Your telling a group of people their experiences are near worthless !!!!!!!!!!!!! Based on your own convections. What balls Man.

So what is the point of this thread????


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4412822 -

So what is the point of this thread????

Why do you not question everyone's motive for starting a thread?

With a total Swami-like approach to life there would be no God-loving Muslims and Christians constantly spilling each other's blood - such is the nature of belief.

The point of this thread (as is most of my threads) is that real insight and true experience engenders REAL change in behavior.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412846 -

I quit eating meat after tripping for 32 hours on 65mg of 2CI, and I haven't looked back.. I think bringing the hard lessons the psychedelic experience beats into your head with you when you emerge from them is one of the hardest tests a human being endures... And usually fails...

BTW, I also am curious as to wether Swami thinks there is any spiritual or emotional growth that happens as a result of the psychedelic experience, or any other experience for that matter..

  If there is indeed a thread that covers this I would like the name of it also :smile:


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Kalix]
    #4412863 -

I quit eating meat after tripping for 32 hours on 65mg of 2CI...

If I quit eating strawberries after tripping, would that be indicative of spiritual advancement?


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412883 -

Swami said:
I quit eating meat after tripping for 32 hours on 65mg of 2CI...

If I quit eating strawberries after tripping, would that be indicative of spiritual advancement?


Would it? I imagine it could be..

My point with that statement was that for my consciousness, that trip was life-changing, and trans-formative, and has since altered my behavior.. I am wondering what you feel is valuable, if anything, about the psychedelic experience?

And either way, does your opinion on the subject discount other people from having different experiences?

Say you did trip your balls off, and find so much empathy for strawberries that you never ate another one in your life, and on top of that, you felt that this change in your life had facilitated spiritual growth, naturally, you would expect people to be skeptical, but would that make your truth any less relevant??


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412884 -

If your mind-blowing perceptions cannot help you deal with day-to-day stuff, then they are near-worthless with no more substance than any other dream.
_________________________________________________________

I have told you that these perceptions have indeed helped me with my day-to-day living. So then they would be very worthy, right? Or do you think I am deluded? If so I would appreciate you honestly telling me so.

It would be hard to judge how people were befor the psychedelic experience unless you knew them personally. Maybe they are improved but still have work to do.

I don't think it is necessarily a sign of weakness or lack of awareness to ask for help from others in making decisions or with personal problems. You must remember also that many people here are young and need to make mistakes to learn. You also might remember that many have no cultural support for psychedelic use and my not know much of what they are doing.

I know that when I used power plants when younger I didn't get as much out of it as I do now. Yet i think I got what I needed at the time.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4412903 -

Swami said:
So what is the point of this thread????

The point of this thread (as is most of my threads) is that real insight and true experience engenders REAL change in behavior.


Ok lets look at your first post in this thread.......""Funny how many claim to have deep insight into the workings of the universe and the human condition whilst tripping and/or meditating and then state "you're a jerk for not agreeing with me" and "btw, can someone please help me with my failing relationship" and "how do I deal with a tyrant boss" and other ordinary problems.

If your mind-blowing perceptions cannot help you deal with day-to-day stuff, then they are near-worthless with no more substance than any other dream. "


So your point is that real spirtual growth is presented in a real change of one's behavior.

When do you get the right to decided when there has been real change ?

Who are you to be in constant need to inform people there change is false ?

At what point does a person qualife as changed ?

And when does a outsider become qualified to make a judgement about anothers path ?

What is the motive behind such behavior ?

Is the need to inform people that they are failures in their quest of Spirtual paths a result of one's own failure to understand God ?

Help me understand this type of mind set.

You are not the only person I have been puzzled by this type of actions.


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Fucknuckle]
    #4412928 -

"If your mind-blowing perceptions cannot help you deal with day-to-day stuff, then they are near-worthless with no more substance than any other dream. "

I just illustrated a drastic way in which my mind-blowed perceptions altered my actions afterwards, and you discounted it with a strawberry metaphor.. What is a decent indication of transformation due to "mind-blowing perceptions"??


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Icelander]
    #4412932 -

I have told you that these perceptions have indeed helped me with my day-to-day living. So then they would be very worthy, right? Or do you think I am deluded? If so I would appreciate you honestly telling me so.



Me too..


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My Unitarian Jihad Name is: The Shotgun of Sweet Reason

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Kalix]
    #4413027 -

I just illustrated a drastic way in which my mind-blowed perceptions altered my actions afterwards, and you discounted it with a strawberry metaphor..

1. It wasn't a metaphor.

2. I did not discount it.

Real spiritual awakening leads to clarity in thought and action.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4413050 -




Real spiritual awakening leads to clarity in thought and action.


When is one aware of such a state ?

When does an outsider become aware of this state?

Where is the evidence that a person who claims to have had such an experience or profound change ?

Is it the changed person or the observer that knows the truth ?

Can real change still fail at times to old patterens ?

If not then do any of us really change ?


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What it is, is what it is my Brother.
It is as it is, so suffer thru it.

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Re: Spiritual Insight and the Real World [Re: Swami]
    #4413058 -

Real spiritual awakening leads to clarity in thought and action.
____________________________________________________

True, and the word "awakening" implys a becomming. A process that is never fully accomplished IMO.
No one has perfect thought and action IMO.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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