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Offlinelonestar2004
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Oh Canada
    #4371735 - 07/05/05 11:32 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Canadian American ambassadorship by stealth
By Judi McLeod and David Hawkins
Monday, July 4, 2005

Toronto-- Long harboured Canadian resentment of Canada being annexed by the United States took a 90-degree angle on July 1 with Frank McKenna, Canada?s Ambassador to the United States, turning the tables. McKenna says he will organize the more than 1 million Canadians in the United States to lecture Americans.

McKenna, who?s already sent messages to 6,000 expatriates, intends to get in touch with 100,000 of them by week?s end. The rookie ambassador is pressing the "Canadian diaspora" to arm themselves with facts, to debate Americans and to get out and lobby when Washington makes decisions that can hurt Canadians, says the Toronto Star.

Fighting the U.S. on its own soil, albeit by stealth, McKenna is calling to action Florida snowbirds, northern exiles in Arizona, Hollywood comedians and actors, investment bankers in New York and professors and students at universities across the U.S.

The ambitious ambassador?s first salvo was launched on Canada Day within days of America?s 2005 Independence Day.

The Prime Minister Paul Martin-appointed McKenna blames Fox News for his battle cry.

Referring to what he calls the "Fox Factor", McKenna told the Toronto Star?s Washington bureau chief, Tom Harper that Fox "often spreads disinformation and feeds a negative perception of its neighbours to the north."

The ambassador, an investor banker who shares membership in the Carlyle group with former President George Bush, fails to point out that the same government that sent him to Washington is the one that spawned anti-American MP Carolyn Parrish of "Damn Americans, I hate those bastards" fame, and Francoise Ducros, director of communications for former Prime Minister Jean Chr?tien, who called President George W. Bush an "idiot".

On the Washington job for just four months, McKenna, a former Premier of New Brunswick, is a member of Canada's all-powerful Privy

Council--an allegedly "Librano-controlled" bypass to Parliament where billions of off-book dollars move unaudited through non-government bank accounts overseen by McKennas' fellow privy councillors, including Belinda Stronach, Alfonso Gagliano and Maurice Strong.

McKenna wants expatriate troops to lecture the U.S that "Canada is the largest source of imported crude oil in the U.S.?bigger than Saudi Arabia or the yet untested reserves of Iraq."

"The country has rotated 13,500 troops in the war on terror, has committed $300-million to rebuilding Iraq and is about to deploy a reconstruction team to Afghanistan.

"None of the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorists entered the U.S. from Canada.

"Canada-U.S. trade supports more than five million American jobs."

Over time, McKenna is hoping his network will grow to number in the millions. According to the Star, McKenna's scheme has applause from former diplomats and those who deal in bilateral affairs, though the diplomats and stakeholders were not identified. That's a pity given that McKenna is a secret and financially-conflicted member of the Canadian American Investor (CAI) Private Equity Group with Mohammed al-Zaibak, General Alexander Haig, Raymond Garneau (supervising Judge Gomery as he prepares his report on the Adscam scandal) and Lynton Wilson (chairing Nortel as it destroyed $200 billion of shareholder wealth by fraudulent accounting).

Canada, he said, was "a bit of prey for Fox News types of shows."

In his scathing criticism, McKenna also broadsided the American media in general--somewhat hypocritical given that McKenna was a recent chairman of CanWest Global Communications with 11 major publications parroting liberalisms such as Paul Martin knows nothing about kickbacks or Paul Martin knows everything about Kyoto.

"I see potential scandals that surface here every single day which flash across the television screen and disappear into the ether," McKenna said. "In Canada (they) would have been enough to bring down the government."

He cited a newspaper account of Homeland Security spending waste, which barely lasted a single news cycle.

"In Canada, that would have been the subject of a multi-year commission of inquiry and would have brought the government to its knees."

As a Liberal, McKenna is privy to a spate of opinion polls, all indicating that Canada?s ruling Liberal Party--caught up in the multi-million dollar Adscam scandal-- would be returned to Ottawa in the next general election.

Meanwhile, McKenna's Librano Party of Canada seems to be an empire with no clothes walking on its knees.
http://www.canadafreepress.com/2005/cover070405.htm


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4371845 - 07/05/05 12:16 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

" Canada?s Ambassador McKenna says he will organize the more than 1 million Canadians in the United States to lecture Americans."


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4372095 - 07/05/05 01:58 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Do you have a problem with people dispelling myths about Canada or something?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phluck]
    #4373983 - 07/06/05 12:20 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Is this a myth????

A letter from the Moncton Hospital to a New Brunswick heart patient in need of an electrocardiogram said the appointment would be in three months. It added: "If the person named on this computer-generated letter is deceased, please accept our sincere apologies."

The patient wasn't dead, according to the doctor who showed the letter to The Associated Press on condition of anonymity. But there are many Canadians who claim the long wait for the test and the frigid formality of the letter are indicative of a health system badly in need of emergency care.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineBCBudJohn
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4374386 - 07/06/05 02:37 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, definately. I think they should jack taxes and infuse it with money.


--------------------
Peace
John


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4374487 - 07/06/05 03:07 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Is this a myth????

Probably... do you have a source for it?

Electrocardiogram machines are not that expensive. I was in the ER once, and they hooked me up to one as soon as I got there.

What, are you just making things up now or something?


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phluck]
    #4374863 - 07/06/05 08:10 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah I find that very hard to believe about the ECG machine...

I had to get an ECG done a few years ago, and I only had to wait a couple days to get that AND an ultrasound done.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phluck]
    #4375085 - 07/06/05 10:36 AM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Sadly, it's not a myth. I'm guessing the source was this Associated Press article from March of this year http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/3/21/101350.shtml but that's just a guess -- such stories are so common it could have been from any of several hundred articles. Or taken from the reports of any of a half dozen "Special Commissions" or "Task Forces" or whatever they choose to call them now.


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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4375708 - 07/06/05 02:42 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Are you SURE its not a myth?

The AP article claims an anonymous doctor sent in the letter, and that is the only validation for this claim.

We're to believe that these letters are being sent out automatically to all kinds of heart patients, yet the only source is an anonymous doctor?

The AP is a reputable organization, but this doesn't mean that they are infalliable. Every time I've had a personal connection with, or done further research on a news story, I've found at least a few errors.

The story doesn't seem to match the conditions that I or anyone I know have encountered in the Canadian medical system.

It's really odd how I keep seeing all of these articles from americans meant to illustrate how terrible the conditions are up here, stories of endless emergency room waits, people with terminal illnesses being on long waiting lists to be treated, that kind of thing, yet everyone I know who has serious problems seems to be getting plenty of treatment.

I've had to go to the ER three times in my life, and every single time I've waited less than an hour... and these aren't even for serious injuries.

My uncle was diagnosed with thyroid cancer last year, and has received many treatments and followup treatments. He is now doing fairly well, and waiting times don't seem to be an issue at all.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phluck]
    #4375745 - 07/06/05 02:52 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

It's really odd how I keep seeing all of these articles from americans meant to illustrate how terrible the conditions are up here, stories of endless emergency room waits, people with terminal illnesses being on long waiting lists to be treated, that kind of thing, yet everyone I know who has serious problems seems to be getting plenty of treatment.

I've tried to make this point several times now.

Where are all these people who are waiting months or years for medical treatment in Canada?

I don't know a single person who has had to wait longer than a few hours for necessary medical treatment. I only know one person who has had to wait some time for an elective knee surgery...and she only waited one month.

I, personally, have been to the emergency room on a number of occaisions. None of my visits were for life-threatening conditions, and yet the longest I have ever had to wait in the ER is about two hours.

Now, lets talk a little about the ERs, here. Every time I have been in a hospital ER department here in Canada...I see doctors, nurses, and staff standing around chatting. Not chatting about work, or the patients...chatting about the weather, sporting games, ect. This does not look like a system which is stretched to its limits for patient capacity.

Of course, first-hand eye-witness accounts such as Phluck's and mine don't mean anything....because the "news" can't ever be wrong :rolleyes:


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: trendal]
    #4375758 - 07/06/05 02:56 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Of course, first-hand eye-witness accounts such as Phluck's and mine don't mean anything....because the "news" can't ever be wrong

Yeah, especially when the "news" consists of opinion pieces by americans trying to argue against adopting a Canadian style medical system.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phluck]
    #4375920 - 07/06/05 03:54 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Phluck writes:

Quote:

Are you SURE its not a myth?




Are you sure anything you see in the news is not a myth? How do you know men walked on the moon?

Phluck, Canada's fucked health "care" system is a particular pet peeve of mine. I've posted many links to similar articles and studies in many previous posts here on the subject. If you don't like my links, you can request all the many many government-commissioned studies done over the last couple of decades and read them yourself. Or read some of the Canadian medical journals or talk to nurses and doctors or GPs.

Or try to schedule an MRI for yourself.

Look, I'm not pulling these numbers out of my ass. It is a fact that people routinely wait well over a year for joint replacement surgery. It is a fact that people with treatable conditions die while on a waiting list for -- not even treatment in many cases -- diagnostic tests. It is a fact there are more MRI machines in the city of Philadelphia than there are in all of Canada. It is a fact that people routinely wait months or in some cases years waiting for a GP to have enough room on his schedule to accept them as a new patient.

If it were just a single AP news article, I too would be skeptical. But all of these facts and more have been so thoroughly documented by so many unimpeachable sources for so many years that to pretend they aren't facts is just plain pigheadedness.

Quote:

The story doesn't seem to match the conditions that I or anyone I know have encountered in the Canadian medical system.




Then you have to date been lucky. But you're young yet. I waited months for a CAT scan. I would have had to wait around a year for an MRI, but I just gave up. I would have had to wait a year or more to have a benign cyst removed had I stayed in Canada. I organized it in an afternoon here in the Dominican Republic -- yes, in my poor and primitive third-world country!

My mother waited seven months to have her varicose veins stripped. I have already given the waiting times her friend waited for her two knee replacement operations. The article I linked to gave several more examples, such as...

Quote:

But tell that to hospital administrators constantly having to cut staff for lack of funds, or to the mother whose teenager was advised she would have to wait up to three years for surgery to repair a torn knee ligament.
"It's like somebody's telling you that you can buy this car, and you've paid for the car, but you can't have it right now," said Jane Pelton. Rather than leave daughter Emily in pain and a knee brace, the Ottawa family opted to pay $3,300 for arthroscopic surgery at a private clinic in Vancouver, with no help from the government.

"Every day we're paying for health care, yet when we go to access it, it's just not there," said Pelton.




... and I could link you to literally hundreds more.

Quote:

I've had to go to the ER three times in my life, and every single time I've waited less than an hour...




Then you've been lucky. Every time I've gone to the ER in Ottawa there have been people waiting there for some doctor to have the time to look at their decidedly non-emergency problems. These people can't go to their GP because they don't have one, because no doctors in Ottawa are accepting new patients. That's the truth, and I know it's the truth because I had to get my medical records from my GP a couple years back when he retired. Here's the hitch -- under Canadian law, he can't release them directly to the patient. He can only transfer them to another government-approved practicing doctor. So I naturally asked if my doc (the most popular GP in Ottawa: there were newspaper columns written about his retirement, I kid you not. EVERYONE knew this guy) could recommend a new doc for me. He gave me two names -- two, that's all he could dig up -- but said he doubted I'd have any luck. One of the names was of a GP who'd been out of medical school less than a year.

He was right. By the time I called it was too late. "Doctor Johnson is no longer accepting new patients, sir. I'm sorry." Well, does Doc Johnson know of any freshly-graduated classmates who might be accepting patients? Nope. I spent two days going through the phone book. Phoned over a hundred docs. No luck.

Finally, I persuaded my neurologist to just hang onto the records till I get find a GP I could leave them with.

And this isn't some little town in the northern Manitoba wilderness we're talking about, this is the freaking capital of the freaking country.

For what it's worth, every time I have gone to an emergency room in Canada I was eventually treated. I don't think I ever waited much longer than two hours, and once I was seen in a matter of minutes. But every time I left, I saw people waiting to be seen who had been there when I got there. How long did they end up waiting? I have no idea. The sad truth is that emergency rooms aren't capable of handling everyone's routine medical needs.

Quote:

My uncle was diagnosed with thyroid cancer last year, and has received many treatments and followup treatments. He is now doing fairly well, and waiting times don't seem to be an issue at all.




Glad to hear that about your uncle. My father wasn't as lucky. He had non-Hodgkin's lymphoma and died of it almost two years ago. He was admitted for his first chemotherapy treatment weeks after he was diagnosed. He had taken the tests weeks prior to that. And that was in Ottawa, not in Moose Nuts Saskatchewan. He died the morning after his first chemo treatment.

To be fair, he would probably have died anyway. He wasn't a particularly fit man, nor was he young, and the success rate for treating that type of cancer is under fifty per cent over five years. But a fitter younger man who had been admitted earlier in the game would probably have lasted a few more years, or maybe even beaten it altogether. So I guess it's a good thing it was just my old beat up dad who got screwed rather than someone who actually stood a chance.


Phred


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4375972 - 07/06/05 04:09 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Or try to schedule an MRI for yourself.

Actually the last time I had an MRI, it only took one week between booking the test and getting the test.

Also, this was not a necessary test, but was part of a mental-health study I participated in for UWO and LHC. The psychiatrist overseeing the study didn't seem to have any trouble booking multiple hour-long MRI sessions a bare week in advance...so I don't see how people who need MRIs are having such a hard time getting them.


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: trendal]
    #4376006 - 07/06/05 04:19 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Trendal are you in prison?

http://www.edmontonsun.com/News/Columnists/Jacobs_Mindelle/2005/06/11/1081809.html



Canada has four-tiered




The supporters of our supposed single-tier health-care system are aghast that Thursday's Supreme Court ruling could threaten Canadians' equal access to treatment.

It is a long-held myth, of course, that there is no queue-jumping in this country. Most Canadians have no special privileges when it comes to receiving care, but some do. Military personnel, the RCMP, prisoners and workers' compensation claimants don't fall under the medicare umbrella.

So while the typical Canadian waits and waits for a diagnostic test or surgery, the members of these groups are entitled to speedy access. All of them are exempt from the Canada Health Act.

I'm not suggesting that certain groups shouldn't be entitled to faster treatment. If our soldiers and cops had to wait as long as ordinary folks for care, Canada would fall short in both the peacekeeping and policing arenas.

It irks me that a prisoner can get quicker specialist consultations or surgery than law-abiding Canadians, but that's the law. Go bark to your MP about it.

Just last week, you may recall, a New Brunswick man who told police in Toronto he was planning a shooting rampage was jailed for three years. He wasn't actually going to kill anyone. The 44-year-old man, who had no prior criminal record, just wanted heart surgery. And he got it quickly while in custody.

Yes, he resorted to drastic measures to jump the queue, but people desperate for treatment will do extraordinary things. Some spend $50,000 to get surgery abroad.

Injured workers don't have to wait, though. Last year, a Workers' Compensation Board claimant in Alberta wrote us about his experience. "The average person waits, what, months or years for an MRI? I waited two days," he wrote in a letter to the editor.

He only waited 12 days for back surgery, he added. "Only a fool would believe we all get the same treatment."

The myth lives on, however. "We're not going to have a two-tier health-care system in this country," Prime Minister Paul Martin declared Thursday.

We've probably got a four-tier system, quips Nadeem Esmail, senior health policy analyst with the Fraser Institute. The first tier comprises those who are wealthy enough to go abroad for timely care, he says.

The second is made up of the aforementioned special population groups - military, RCMP, prisoners and WCB claimants. I suppose you could include professional athletes in that tier. They have private insurance and don't have to wait in line.

People in the third tier have pull or influence - they know a doctor or have a friend on the hospital board, says Esmail.

In the fourth tier are average Canadians who need care but have no way of expediting the process.

Esmail argues that instead of suspending the privileges that have been bestowed on certain groups, all Canadians should have the option of buying private insurance.

Dr. Joel Lexchin, an emergency physician and York University health policy professor, says there will always be some manipulation of the system.

But he doesn't think people should be given special consideration and permitted to jump the queue.

A stay-at-home mom with small children who breaks her leg needs to get back to her duties as urgently as an employee who's injured on the job, he says.

"I don't think there should be any distinction," he adds.

Predictably, the difference is about money, says Esmail. If you're injured at work, the WCB has an incentive to patch you up quickly because you're getting income support while you wait for care.

It's in their interest to get you into a private clinic fast. The rest of us? Take a number.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: trendal]
    #4376015 - 07/06/05 04:26 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Who owns the MRI machine that gave you your scan?


Phred


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InvisibleIrradiated_Feces
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4376040 - 07/06/05 04:35 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

My girlfriend was recently left high and dry by her family doctor. She needed to see one recently and was booked a couple days after searching.
http://www.cpso.on.ca/

A quick search of physicians in Ottawa accepting new patients reveals...

Doctor Search Results

There were 64 matches for your search. Click on physician's name for details.
Results are displayed by status, in random order.

- from the College of Physicians and Surgeons of Ontario which I believe is updated annually.


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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4376046 - 07/06/05 04:37 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Waiting for Diagnostic and Therapeutic Technology

The growing waits to see a specialist and to receive treatment were not the only delays facing patients in 2003. Patients also experienced significant waiting times for computed tomography (CT), magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), and ultrasound scans.

The median wait across Canada for a CT scan was 5.5 weeks. The shortest wait for computed tomography was in New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, and Newfoundland (4 weeks), while the longest wait occurred in Prince Edward Island (8 weeks).

The median wait for an MRI across Canada was 12.7 weeks. Patients in New Brunswick experienced the shortest wait for an MRI (8 weeks), while Newfoundland and Nova Scotia residents waited longest (24 weeks).

The median wait for ultrasound was 3.6 weeks across Canada. Both Saskatchewan and Ontario had the shortest wait for ultrasound (2 weeks), while Manitoba exhibited the longest ultrasound waiting time (8 weeks).

************************************************


That's a cut and paste from this site: http://www.fraserinstitute.ca/shared/readmore.asp?sNav=nr&id=550

Here are a few more tidbits:

Quote:

Release Date: October 21, 2003

Vancouver, BC - Canadians are waiting longer than ever for medical treatment. Waiting times for surgical and therapeutic services in Canada have increased 7.3 percent over last year, according to The Fraser Institute?s 13th annual survey, Waiting Your Turn: Hospital Waiting Lists in Canada, released today.

The total waiting time for patients between referral from a general practitioner and treatment, averaged across all 12 specialties and 10 provinces surveyed, increased this year; rising to 17.7 weeks in 2003 (from 16.5 weeks in 2001-02).


*******************

Other conclusions from Waiting Your Turn:

Wait times rose for access to both GPs and specialists

Over 90 per cent of waiting times are considered beyond clinically ?reasonable? times

Waits for magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), computed tomography (CT), and ultrasound scans also increased.

******************************

The First Wait: Between General Practitioner and Specialist Consultation

The waiting time between referral by a GP and consultation with a specialist rose to 8.3 weeks, an increase of 14 percent over last year (7.3 weeks).

The shortest waits for specialist consultations were found in British Columbia (6.7 weeks), Manitoba (6.9 weeks), and Saskatchewan (7 weeks). The longest waits for specialist consultations occurred in Newfoundland (12.6 weeks), New Brunswick (11.8 weeks), and Alberta (10 weeks).




Lots more info at the link.




Phred


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4376048 - 07/06/05 04:37 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

lonestar2004: no, I'm not in prison (nor was I, when I got the MRI).

Phred: the MRI machine in question is the one at University Hospital.


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Edited by trendal (06/23/06 07:12 PM)


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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #4376053 - 07/06/05 04:39 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Oh, goody. There are a whopping 64 GPs in Canada's most populous province who are accepting new patients.


Phred


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InvisibleIrradiated_Feces
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Re: Oh Canada [Re: Phred]
    #4376061 - 07/06/05 04:40 PM (11 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
Oh, goody. There are a whopping 64 GPs in Canada's most populous province who are accepting new patients.


Phred




Thats OTTAWA not Ontario.


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