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Offlinelonestar2004
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Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison.
    #4333204 - 06/24/05 06:24 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Posted June 17 2005, 2:45 PM EDT


WASHINGTON -- A subsidiary of Houston-based Halliburton has been awarded a $30 million contract to build an improved 220-bed prison for terrorism suspects at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, the Pentagon announced.

Kellogg Brown and Root Services Inc. of Arlington, Va., is to build a two-story prison that includes day rooms, exercise areas, medical bays, air conditioning and a security control room, according to the Pentagon. It is to be completed by July 2006.











Congress previously approved the funding for the construction job. Some members, along with human rights groups, are now calling for Guantanamo to close because of reports of prisoner abuses there and because the foreign detainees are being held indefinitely with no charges filed.

KBR beat out two other bids for the job, the Pentagon said.

"The future detention facility will be based on prison models in the U.S. and is designed to be safer for the long-term detention of detainees and the guards," according to a statement provided by a Pentagon spokesman. "It is also expected to require less manpower to operate."

The new prison building, called Detention Camp #6, will replace some of the older facilities at the Navy base, which officials say are not adequate for holding prisoners for the long term.

The total contract could be worth up to $500 million through 2010, the Pentagon said. The Naval Facilities Engineering Command, Atlantic, in Norfolk, Va., is the contracting agency.

About 520 prisoners from the Bush administration's war on terrorism are held at Guantanamo. Already, $110 million has been spent on construction there, and the prison costs about $95 million a year to operate.

White House officials have said there are no plans to close the facility because the detainees being held there are too dangerous to release while the war on terror continues.
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/ny-guan0618,0,2894210.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4333213 - 06/24/05 06:25 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

I can't wait to see the libby backlash on this one.


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Redstorm]
    #4333227 - 06/24/05 06:30 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)



the libs want gitmo closed.

and instead we make it bigger and award halliburton the contract.

too ironic.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4333236 - 06/24/05 06:32 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

:lol:

It sounds like something out of The Onion.


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OfflineVex
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4333979 - 06/24/05 11:01 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

30 million dollars for a 220 bed prison? give me a fucking break! are the toilets made of solid gold or something?


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Vex]
    #4334090 - 06/24/05 11:29 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Let's not forget this is Gitmo we're talking about. The prisoners there must be kept in utmost comfort or some Muslim in Sri Lanka will start seething and decide to behead a few Buddhists. Comfort doesn't come cheap. Neither do the special ionized and microfiltered vaults in each cell in which the prisoners' Korans may reside.



Phred


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4334134 - 06/24/05 11:47 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Private contracts to favored companies gouging the public (read: theft) has nothing to do with Muslim relations and you know it. Are you going to state that this type of fiduciary rape is something new? Defend your political views rationally if possible.

Also do a search in the archives as I predicted many years ago that Halliburton would make hundreds of millions if not billions off this conflict. The Iraqi war has nothing to do with our concern for the Iraqi people. And, oh yeah, the Cheney connection is merely coincidental like the oil-stock owning Congressmen approving billions of public funds for private drilling

The exact same thing happened in Viet Nam. That war was never meant to be won, only to keep the military-industio complex's wheels greased.


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Swami]
    #4334314 - 06/25/05 12:37 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Swami writes:

Quote:

Private contracts to favored companies gouging the public (read: theft) has nothing to do with Muslim relations and you know it.




To which company would you have preferred seeing the contract go? To one of the two losing companies who placed higher bids?

Quote:

Are you going to state that this type of fiduciary rape is something new? Defend your political views rationally if possible.




Well, Swami, I'm not a construction contractor by trade, but I do know a bit about the reality of constructing things in third world tropical countries, so I'll give it my best shot.

I presume (just presuming, mind you) that the construction specifications for a high security prison might differ a tad from say a Club Med or a private seaside villa. I'm also presuming (just presuming, mind you) that Castro isn't particularly interested in providing either workers or materials, so every gram of concrete and every centimeter of rebar, every bulldozer and backhoe and crane and excavator (with the attendant spare parts and mechanics competent enough to install those parts) will have to make it to the construction site by boat, as will every milliliter of diesel required to fuel those machines. Similarly, all the construction crews will have to be shipped in, fed, and housed, in addition of course to being paid their wages.

I don't know... I could be wrong about this... but it seems to me that because of these and other factors I'm just too gosh darned dumb to think of right now, the cost of building this particular 220 bed installation in Guantanamo might be substantially higher than building a 220 bed retirement tower in Jacksonville Florida. Might be the reason no one bid lower than 30 mil is because no one thought they could get it done properly for less than that.

Tell you what... I'll give you a couple of weeks to check around with your acquaintances in the construction business who have past experience building prisons outside the US using materials and workers from the US. Tell them to get ahold of the plans and specifications of this new Gitmo project and cost it out for you, then get back to us with what they claim they could get done it for.

It will be interesting to see what their bid would have been. And they'll probably thank you for turning them on to a new potential client (the US military) they had previously never thought of approaching. You might even want to buy some shares in their company and watch your investment double or triple when they get the contract for the next prison.

Of course if it were up to me, I wouldn't bother building a new prison in the first place, I'd just shoot 220 of the captured jihadists who have no new information to disclose and use the 30 million to pay down some of the national debt.

Killing 220 birds with one stone, so to speak.



Phred


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4334537 - 06/25/05 01:45 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

To which company would you have preferred seeing the contract go? To one of the two losing companies who placed higher bids?

Halliburton has a long history of underbidding then overcharging the Amercian people. How about giving the contract to an honest company, or at least one who has not been caught (and forgiven by Washington DC) a dozen times for fraud?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Swami]
    #4334551 - 06/25/05 01:48 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

So your saying one of the other companies who bid higher than Halliburton should have been awarded the contract? You're not disputing it would cost at least 30 million to build the prison?


Phred


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4334555 - 06/25/05 01:50 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

What happened to your five-star Muslim hotel rant? Did you finally realize that sort of emotional hyperbole has little value in a serious discussion?

You want to save $200,000,000, but it was a well-spent $200,000,000,000 to invade Iraq which posed little threat?

Swami can no follow...


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Swami]
    #4335580 - 06/25/05 12:43 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Gee, Swami, let me try to understand your position about how best to post in PA&L:

If you are Swami, it is perfectly acceptable to post flippant tongue-in-cheek comments -- particularly when caught making some unsupported claim. If you are Phred, it is unacceptable to post flippant tongue-in-cheek comments at any time. If you are Swami, you can miscategorize said comments as "emotional hyperbole" and decide randomly when a discussion is to be serious and when it is not -- with the "not" option typically being chosen whenever Swami gets caught making unsupportable statements.

Does that about sum it up?

Why don't you recognize the phrase "fiduciary rape" as emotionally hyperbolic? Or is it that since Swami used it rather than Phred, it just can't be emotionally hyperbolic?

Before I answer your somewhat bizarre and disconnected question about saving 200 million (where did that number come from and to what expenditure does it refer?) how about you answer the question I have asked you twice already and now ask for the third time --

So your saying one of the other companies who bid higher than Halliburton should have been awarded the contract? You're not disputing it would cost at least 30 million to build the prison?

Clearly if you charge there is "fiduciary rape" occurring with the awarding of this contract, you must be of the opinion that either:

a) The new prison can be built for less than the amount the winning bidder submitted, therefore none of the three companies bidding for the contract should have been awarded the contract, or

b) The US government should not award the contract to the lowest bidder but instead should use some other (as yet unspecified by you) criterium for deciding which bidder wins the deal, or

c) The US government should not have ever put the bid to tender in the first place.

I freely admit I may have missed some options. Feel free to choose one I may have missed when you eventually get around to answering.


Phred


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OfflineVex
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4335619 - 06/25/05 12:58 PM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Of course if it were up to me, I wouldn't bother building a new prison in the first place, I'd just shoot 220 of the captured jihadists who have no new information to disclose and use the 30 million to pay down some of the national debt.

Killing 220 birds with one stone, so to speak.




Oh come on man....you have to be a little more creative! I know the US government must have the ability to install tracking beacons inside a terrorists body without it being detected. So why don't we "tag" these 220 guys and send them back into "the wild" They'll lead us right to the other terrorists. Then the CIA can set up shop and monitor them, leaching all the intel they want, and then swoop in and take em all down. Who knows, maybe one of them will lead us to Osama...

Would that go against the geneva convention though? I'm not sure if it is a very humanatarian thing to do to implant tracking devices on people. At any rate, it would help seperate the terrorists from the poor innocent bastards that got scooped up along the way. We know as soon as Ali Bak Bar went back to his boring life of farming dates or whatever.

What do you think of this idea?


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4338145 - 06/26/05 02:33 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Of course if it were up to me, I wouldn't bother building a new prison in the first place, I'd just shoot 220 of the captured jihadists who have no new information to disclose and use the 30 million to pay down some of the national debt.

Killing 220 birds with one stone, so to speak.




You can't be serious.

Do you believe the American government should treat it's own citizens that way too, or does it only apply to fornigers?


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #4338214 - 06/26/05 03:01 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

From time immemorial, non-uniformed enemy combatants have been considered spies. Spies get shot. That's why they aren't particularly easy to recruit. Spies aren't protected by the Geneva Conventions, or any convention of which I am aware.

But no, I personally wouldn't really shoot 'em. I figure you either shoot 'em right away (in which case they are useless for interrogation purposes) or toss them in with the rest of the prisoner population and resign yourself to feeding them and providing medical treatment and all the rest of that stuff that civilized people do.

The temptation to do a few decapitations would just have to be resisted, I guess.



Phred


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4338482 - 06/26/05 05:56 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

About 520 prisoners from the Bush administration's war on terrorism are held at Guantanamo. Already, $110 million has been spent on construction there, and the prison costs about $95 million a year to operate.

At an incredibly efficient $186,000 per prisoner, wouldn't it be cheaper to put them up in a five star hotel?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Halliburton unit wins contract for new Gitmo prison. [Re: Phred]
    #4338486 - 06/26/05 06:02 AM (12 years, 1 month ago)

From time immemorial, non-uniformed enemy combatants have been considered spies.

Are unarmed people ripped from their homes automatically spies?

We all know of the FBI's impeccable intelligence in getting some 70% of the 9/11 terrorists wrong, so if the intelligence in Iraq is at least that good...

"Accusation = guilt" is a scary precedent to start implementing.


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