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InvisibleVeritas
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Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,088
Dying
    #4332149 - 06/24/05 01:25 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Death...the final frontier, the mystery of mysteries, a friend to those in suffering, a messenger to some who are forgetting to live, the ultimate punctuation mark in the run-on sentence that is embodiment.

I've been thinking a lot about what dying means, or what it could mean. Stephen Levine has written some amazing books about his spiritual growth through his work in hospice care. I read "A Year to Live" at a time in my life when I was only getting out of bed because I had a young child and a baby who needed me. I was inspired to reclaim my life, not just for a year, but for whatever remained to me.

I had been living a dead life, going through the motions. I was so afraid of change, or the consequences of admitting how dead I felt, that I became a spiritual zombie. Levine's book helped me wake myself up, and many other teachers since have participated in that process.

We are all dying from the moment we are born...maturing to adulthood, then declining into old age, every minute bringing us closer to the end.

Is the great fear of death truly about dying, or is it about facing the moment when our life "flashes before our eyes," and we see how dead we have been already?


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Dying [Re: Veritas]
    #4332245 - 06/24/05 01:45 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Is the great fear of death truly about dying, or is it about facing the moment when our life "flashes before our eyes," and we see how dead we have been already?


Good question.

I believe it is a variable. Some are genuinely afraid of the unknown... while others have gotten past this fear mentally, but now find themselves in a place where they are torn between what they KNOW to be the right way to live, and the way they find themselves actually living.

Self-forgiveness is so much more a challenge when you've already seen the reasons to live a certain way, yet still live on in an alternate way for lack of willpower.

I believe that if I was to die before fully conquering my own issues with willpower and commitment, I would find myself in my own hell.

Hell, I'm already there... I'm in a living hell dictated by the inconsistency between my beliefs and my actions. Or more importantly, it is dictated by my own refusal to forgive myself for living in a way that I believe I should have enough strength to have overcome by now.

Where does one find himself when he realizes that he can't trust himself to uphold promises to himself any longer? This is hell manifest, as far as I am concerned...


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Dying [Re: Veritas]
    #4332246 - 06/24/05 01:46 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
Is the great fear of death truly about dying, or is it about facing the moment when our life "flashes before our eyes," and we see how dead we have been already?




The great fear of death is the result of grapsing at one's experience and one's very existance. It simply is something that one cannot cling onto, just as no experience is. The mind grasps and obstructs itself from "obtaining" that which it reaches for.

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Dying [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4332258 - 06/24/05 01:48 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Hey, btw, we missed you at the gathering... ya bastid.  :wink:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Dying [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #4332298 - 06/24/05 01:58 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

JacquesCousteau said:
Hey, btw, we missed you at the gathering... ya bastid.  :wink:




They would've missed me at work, as well, which is, ironically enough, both what supplies me with the necessary means by which to travel to the gathering, and what has also kept me from traveling to the gathering.  :eek:

Actually, it wouldn't have kept me from going to the gathering if it would have supplied me with the means necessary for both traveling to the gathering and paying my bills and other regular expenses.... :grin:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleuriahchase
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Re: Dying [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4332303 - 06/24/05 02:01 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

death is just the begging of life.


--------------------
Wanting to be someone else is a waste of the person you are -Kurt Cobain
       



     
Hotter than the left sink handle.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Dying [Re: Veritas]
    #4332477 - 06/24/05 02:55 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

We are all born with a terminal condition. It is so funny that we look at extremely ill people and feel sorry for them. "That poor person" you think or say....but you also have a terminal disease that will snuff out your existance...life. The illusion that we are so far from death is what keeps many of us from experiencing life. We put off things because there is so much time....well wake the fuck up because because your time is up! You must act now or be lost!

"A warrior-hunter knows that his death is waiting, and the very act he is performing now may well be his last battle on earth." - Castaneda


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
Loc: underbelly
Re: Dying [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #4332568 - 06/24/05 03:24 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Hell, I'm already there... I'm in a living hell dictated by the inconsistency between my beliefs and my actions. Or more importantly, it is dictated by my own refusal to forgive myself for living in a way that I believe I should have enough strength to have overcome by now.
_________________________________________________________________

What a powerfull statement. :heart: I deal with this issue in my life also. Jacques maybe the real test of strength is, as you say in the forgiveness, and unconditional acceptance of ourselves as we are; human, with human weakness and frailties.  This life may be just a step in an evolving universe that has no goal and no end and no real death. It is the human experience that ends with death. The force that created us seems to go on creating. All we can do is to keep attempting to live the life our heart desires. But attachment to results brings suffering. We cannot know when change will happen or what will be the trigger for it. And I think it would be wise to look at the successes you do have. I'm guessing you have come a long way on  your path. Often we only look at what is missing an take for granted what has been gained at great struggle. :heart:  :heart: :mushroom2: :smile:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinerowleyxx9
Stranger
Registered: 06/20/05
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Re: Dying [Re: Icelander]
    #4332582 - 06/24/05 03:28 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I've got a rather profound view on death, but it's kinda abstract.

Ok, so we're organisms right? Like with cells and stuff. So when we die, all of this biological stuff that makes us alive stops and then can be consumed by other organisms like fungus and worms.

But since we in the us sense are just like this character we imagine, that disappears as soon as we die because the brain will rot too. So then there is like nothing.

But consciousness might be like the thing that experiences thoughts and self but not them itself. So what happens with that will be a mystery.

Maybe heaven, maybe reincarnation....

I know it's really deep and probably doesnt make much sense, but its my view...


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Registered: 06/14/04
Posts: 10,344
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Re: Dying [Re: rowleyxx9]
    #4332602 - 06/24/05 03:31 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

What happens after death is unimportant. What is important is NOW.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
Loc: underbelly
Re: Dying [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4332633 - 06/24/05 03:38 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

OH! yeah that's right! I keep forgetting that. :thumbup: :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Dying [Re: uriahchase]
    #4332737 - 06/24/05 04:14 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

uriahchase said:
death is just the begging of life.


or:
We will get back, from where we came.
:mushroom2:


--------------------
Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
........................................................
"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Dying [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4332771 - 06/24/05 04:27 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
What happens after death is unimportant. What is important is NOW.




Most important statement in this thread.  :thumbup:


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Offlinecrunchytoast
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Re: Dying [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #4334638 - 06/25/05 02:15 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

JacquesCousteau said:
Where does one find himself when he realizes that he can't trust himself to uphold promises to himself any longer? This is hell manifest, as far as I am concerned...




feelings of powerlessness can help me feel connected to what's bigger than me if i let them be, like i'm accepting my role in a divine plan.  "all you gotta be is you"  :heart:


--------------------
"consensus on the nature of equilibrium is usually established by periodic conflict." -henry kissinger


Edited by crunchytoast (06/25/05 02:19 AM)


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