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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Burn that flag
    #4326242 - 06/22/05 09:10 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20050622/D8ASREC00.html

Quote:

House Approves Flag-Burning Amendment
Email this Story

Jun 22, 3:08 PM (ET)

By LAURIE KELLMAN

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WASHINGTON (AP) - The House on Wednesday approved a constitutional amendment that would give Congress the power to ban desecration of the American flag, a measure that for the first time stands a chance of passing the Senate as well.

By a 286-130 vote - eight more than needed - House members approved the amendment after a debate over whether such a ban would uphold or run afoul of the Constitution's free-speech protections.

Approval of two-thirds of the lawmakers present was required to send the bill on to the Senate, where activists on both sides say it stands the best chance of passage in years. If the amendment is approved in that chamber by a two-thirds vote, it would then move to the states for ratification.

Supporters said the measure reflected patriotism that deepened after the Sept. 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, and they accused detractors of being out of touch with public sentiment.

"Ask the men and women who stood on top of the (World) Trade Center," said Rep. Randy (Duke) Cunningham, R-Calif. "Ask them and they will tell you: pass this amendment."

But Rep. Jerrold Nadler, D-N.Y., said, "If the flag needs protection at all, it needs protection from members of Congress who value the symbol more than the freedoms that the flag represents."

The measure was designed to overturn a 1989 decision by the Supreme Court, which ruled 5-4 that flag burning was a protected free-speech right. That ruling threw out a 1968 federal statute and flag-protection laws in 48 states. The law was a response to anti-Vietnam war protesters setting fire to the American flag at their demonstrations.

The proposed one-line amendment to the Constitution reads, "The Congress shall have power to prohibit the physical desecration of the flag of the United States." For the language to be added to the Constitution, it must be approved not only by two-thirds of each chamber but also by 38 states within seven years.

Each time the proposed amendment has come to the House floor, it has reached the required two-thirds majority. But the measure has always died in the Senate, falling short of the 67 votes needed. The last time the Senate took up the amendment was in 2000, when it failed 63-37.

But last year's elections gave Republicans a four-seat pickup in the Senate, and now proponents and critics alike say the amendment stands within a vote or two of reaching the two-thirds requirement in that chamber.

By most counts, 65 current senators have voted for or said they intend to support the amendment, two shy of the crucial tally. More than a quarter of current senators were not members of that chamber during the last vote.

The Senate is expected to consider the measure after the July 4th holiday.

_

The amendment is H.J. Res 10.




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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Registered: 10/03/04
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Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4326263 - 06/22/05 09:20 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I respect the flag. but this is wrong and i hope it does not pass.


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We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

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Invisiblebukkake
LEFT WING NUT
Male

Registered: 05/28/05
Posts: 2,746
Loc: Classified
Re: Burn that flag [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4326306 - 06/22/05 09:36 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Our lawmakers must be pretty bored. Wasn't this an issue twenty years ago, too?


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Invisiblemoog
Stranger

Registered: 02/15/05
Posts: 1,296
Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4326342 - 06/22/05 09:51 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Can I still burn the 13-star flag?


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth
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Posts: 13,673
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Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4326744 - 06/22/05 11:46 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Holy shit. Is their a 1st admendment anymore?


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InvisibleRavus
Not an EggshellWalker
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Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 7,991
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Re: Burn that flag [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #4326775 - 06/22/05 11:58 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, that's why it has to be passed in this way, because it goes against the Bill of Rights.


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Offlinefrabuno
tiras gadol

Registered: 05/30/05
Posts: 34
Loc: the hood yo
Last seen: 10 years, 2 days
Re: Burn that flag [Re: Ravus]
    #4339929 - 06/26/05 08:00 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

This ammendment is terrible.

Bush is peeling our rights away.

Next thing you know it will be illegal to hold a pro-medical marijuana demonstration or something like that :eek:


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Offlinecb9fl
Senior ChildMolestationExpert
Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 3,104
Loc: florida
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: Burn that flag [Re: frabuno]
    #4339966 - 06/26/05 08:14 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If you read the article you'll see it was Congress, specifically the House that passed this bill and sent it over to the Senate. I personally despise Bush but this shouldn't yet be attributed to him.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflineLearyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Posts: 29,763
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Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4340262 - 06/26/05 10:05 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If you haven't seen it, watch the Daily Show clip called "Flame Retarded" about this.  Click here

:laugh:






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Mp3 of the month: The Loose Enz - The Black Door



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InvisibleLos_Pepes
Stranger

Registered: 06/26/05
Posts: 731
Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4340277 - 06/26/05 10:10 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Check out these CIA double agents laser-eyeing this flag burner.



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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Burn that flag [Re: cb9fl]
    #4340880 - 06/27/05 01:04 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If this amendment passes and a law is passed banning the burning of American flags then I will go to Washington DC and burn a flag in front of the white house while wearing a shirt that says "True Americans Support Free Speech". I love my country, but if any sort of political speech is banned then I am prepared to go to jail.


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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineViveka
refutation bias
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Registered: 10/21/02
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Re: Burn that flag [Re: Ravus]
    #4341296 - 06/27/05 03:14 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Yes, that's why it has to be passed in this way, because it goes against the Bill of Rights.




No, it would have to be passed this way, with a 2/3 approval in both houses, then ratification by 3/4ths of the states because that is the method provided in article five of the Constitution. This is the only way an amendment has ever been introduced or passed and has nothing to do with the territory of the Bill of Rights.

There is another method afforded by the Constitution, by which the states initiate ammendment by calling a Constitutional Convention, but that method has never been used.

This knowledge is readily avaliable to anyone who chooses to actually read the Constitution. Sadly, most don't care what's actually set forth in the document and are content with base rhetoric entailing their own understanding or misunderstanding of "liberty".


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Offlinephi1618
old hand

Registered: 02/14/04
Posts: 4,102
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: Burn that flag [Re: Viveka]
    #4343126 - 06/27/05 03:07 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

EvilEye? said:
Quote:

Yes, that's why it has to be passed in this way, because it goes against the Bill of Rights.




No, it would have to be passed this way, with a 2/3 approval in both houses, then ratification by 3/4ths of the states because that is the method provided in article five of the Constitution. This is the only way an amendment has ever been introduced or passed and has nothing to do with the territory of the Bill of Rights.

There is another method afforded by the Constitution, by which the states initiate ammendment by calling a Constitutional Convention, but that method has never been used.

This knowledge is readily avaliable to anyone who chooses to actually read the Constitution. Sadly, most don't care what's actually set forth in the document and are content with base rhetoric entailing their own understanding or misunderstanding of "liberty".




He pretty clearly meant that the only way to ban flag burning is to introduce a constitutional amendment because flag burning is protected by the first amendment.


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