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OfflineAntleredOne
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Registered: 06/22/05
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Panaeolus subbalteatus?
    #4324867 - 06/22/05 03:18 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Greetings all,
I am a neophyte to this but have been doing research. I don't intend on eating these but am curious and would like to identify them. I found these in Pennsylvania. I discovered the manure to be from a donkey, and it is fairly old. The ground is basically compost from some layers building up and decompossing over time with the soil, if you catch my drift.  I'm not surprised to see them as we just went through a humid spell and had a decent rain event a little while ago.
The gills are light brownish maybe even greyish in the younger ones and in the older ones it's almost black, or dark purplish. The stems are kind of grooved towards the top and a tad fuzzy on the bottom. Bruising does occur noticeably upon handling and appears to be more on the purplish side. You can see a few that are pretty bruised from grass or perhaps flies which I noticed.  In youth the caps are bell or almost conical in shape. When older there still appears to be a slight incurve on the bottom of the cap, but not so much. Colors are varying between light brown when younger, to brown (with a little iridesence, or shinyness) when a little older, to a more evened out light-brown color when a little older. Some of the caps have what almost look like a little road map of lighter colored lines, slightly textured, I notice this in small and bigger ones. Of course being new to this I may be misidentifying age in some instances; but that's what I've been able to put together so far. These pics were the best I could do:


Here you can see the bruised ones in the center as well as the dung!

Perhaps younger?

Maybe a little more middle-aged?


In these two the younger and smaller ones are on the right. Their gills are light gray-brown colored

Working on a spore print to aid in identification..

The outdoor pictures were all taken within a vicinity of a few feet from each other, all in the same area. There is some grass growing around them, and a dog-house-sized box right next to the area they're popping up in. Hope I have provided enough information. I did consult a field guide in which I found some good matches between what I've observed and what's described for Panaeolus subbalteatus, but their are so many different species I imagine the only way to know for sure is with a microscope or something I have no comprehension of.
Thank you for your expertise.  :thumbup:


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Registered: 05/13/04
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: AntleredOne]
    #4324954 - 06/22/05 03:39 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

pic 2, your "younger" version of panaeolus papailionaceus does look like subbalteatus, the rest are inactive panaeolus species (pic 3 is panaeolus papailionaceus - not sure of the exact spelling). Collect some specimens of picture 2 and take some pictures and a spore print, the prints should be black.

Im sure pic 2 are subbs, 30-40 large specimens for a good experience. I'de suggest watching that patch close and harvesting them when they are the biggest, and hope they dont get eaten by fungus gnatz.


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InvisiblePinback
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: AntleredOne]
    #4324958 - 06/22/05 03:40 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Likely Panaeolus sphinctrinus, the cogwheel at the bottom of the cap on 3.jpg, the size, and the cap shape is how one can tell.


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: CptnGarden]
    #4324967 - 06/22/05 03:41 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

what im worried about though, is in pic two you had what looks like 2 mushrooms of a different species in there on the left side of the image. Be sure to get only subbalteatus.

use

www.google.com

to search for some pictures of panaeolus subbalteatus, and make sure you pick only those.

stay safe.


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: AntleredOne]
    #4325956 - 06/22/05 07:37 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

See the ones with the fringe around the edge of the cap, and more bell shaped cap? They are not pan subbs.

ALTHOUGH, in the first picture, it apears you DO have some pan subbs, but mixed there are other mushrooms...
A situation like this is hard to give advice on..
Just PRINT THEM ALL! Make sure the prints are dark black


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: AntleredOne]
    #4325959 - 06/22/05 07:38 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

That first and second picture, There ARE subbs there... Nice finds!
Just make sure to only pick the subbs. It is WAY easy to mistake them.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: flowstone]
    #4325976 - 06/22/05 07:42 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

the first picture is of an inactive species.


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: CptnGarden]
    #4326116 - 06/22/05 08:26 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Most of them.. See the bottom center shroom in the first pic? That looks like a subb to me... ringed cap, brown stem, near other subbs. I would HAVE to see it in person, to tell though.
The second picture looks more promising.
by the way, I hit up a known horse field today after the short 30 minute rain we got in Atlanta yesterday and there was nothing up.
HOWEVER!! I went to the Park today and the chanterelles decided to show in small force. Fresh baby chanterlles, smelling peachy shroomy. Can't wait till late summer.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: CptnGarden]
    #4326121 - 06/22/05 08:27 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Maybe your right, now that I take a second look at it.
I would say almost certain that the SECOND picture is subbs, and a damn nice cluster or three of them.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: flowstone]
    #4326124 - 06/22/05 08:28 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

PS- the good news it that there is no posionous look alike for pan subb that grows on dung.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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OfflinePSiFr33k
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: flowstone]
    #4326277 - 06/22/05 09:25 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

heh flow you do know that there arent any deadly species that grow on dung at all =P


--------------------

While i was in the grass, i picked them..


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OfflineAntleredOne
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: PSiFr33k]
    #4327971 - 06/23/05 12:02 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for the response guys! I thought I'd update you: all the spore prints I did as seen in the picture above came out black like charcoal. I might also do spore prints of the ones around the one with the flatter cap; that one looks like a diff species then the rest, their color is a little more rich and tinted, and they shine a little more reflective and different than the other ones.


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Panaeolus subbalteatus? [Re: PSiFr33k]
    #4328593 - 06/23/05 02:51 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

PSiFr33k said:
heh flow you do know that there arent any deadly species that grow on dung at all =P




Is that what I said..... no!
I said there are no pan look a-likes that grow on dung... Straight from the mouth of MJ


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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