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redgreenvines said:
no-separation is fundamental, since rupa, body or form, is the basis of all except the formless.Mind derives from form, but aspires to emptiness or formlessness.

welcome back

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redgreenvines said:
well yes it's funny, but you seem to be suggesting that you have a "description" of something called consciousness, or you wish to point it out, or allude to something about it, and I am attempting to get on the same page with you.

so can we both point towards a thing called consciousness and agree that it is the same thing - however elusive?

if so would you suggest what direction that is?

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redgreenvines said:
so you think of it as a thing that is reborn
and which exists as a result of ignorance etc. and other actions.

Read more carefully. "The consciousness that is reborn can no more be isolated as a "thing" than can a fire spreading from tree to tree."

and you suggest that there is another mode of consciousness that is not reborn.

Where did i suggest such a thing!?

then you say we enter a life thusly, probably by being reborn.

Yes. We get reborn. But not thusly

strongly suggesting that we should not have done so if we were less ignorant, basically adding wisdom as a likely property of consciousness as well as the optional and opposite property of re-birthability.

If we knew the true nature of reality, then we would not be reborn. Wisdom is the opposite of ignorance, it is recognizing the true nature of reality, as it is. Ignorance keeps us reinvesting in the karmic bank of samsara. But this is not to say that we would not purposely manifest a physical body within samsara in order to teach other beings the way out of the cycle of suffering. Once you have realized fully, the nature of reality, you have the power to manifest like that.

did you want this thing (namely 'we' which somehow re-birthed here) with properties to be considered not a thing, i.e. do you want to make a game out of it?

What? Can you explain this more clearly?

or did you want to point something out which is not a game of "look but do not see", or maybe "use words but don't".

You've really lost me now. What are you talking about???

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Sinbad said:
So lets discuss. What is your view on this matter? Do you still belive that a human beings concioussness is purely dependant upon physical matter? Or does your understanding of conciousness go a little deeper than that?

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