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InvisibleRavus
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A Possibility
    #4309392 - 06/18/05 12:14 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

While most people here tend to have a libertarian viewpoint on drugs, many are no more effective at arguing their support for legalization or refutation of false evidence than most anti-drug people.

If only for the sake of practice and to have an area where people can look to find possible anti-drug points and "pro-drug" counterpoints, it seems it would benefit the Shroomery to have debate threads. While most people here wouldn't actually defend the DEA or the criminalization of marijuana, those who were skilled enough could defend it and hone the skills of those who would counterargue their real viewpoint.

Or is this a stupid idea?


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4309480 - 06/18/05 12:33 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think it's a great idea. The debate thread could go beyond just drug issues into other popular and controversial issues as well.

I think a sub-forum odd another forum would be great.


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4309559 - 06/18/05 12:56 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think it's a great idea too. And I love playing Devil's Advocate. The devil being the DEA in this case; very apropos, eh?  :thumbup:


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Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Diploid]
    #4309590 - 06/18/05 01:03 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

No, the DEA plays a beneficial role in our society by helping keep violent crime associated with drug use at a minimum.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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InvisibleKrishna
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Re: A Possibility [Re: cb9fl]
    #4311138 - 06/18/05 05:08 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

cb9fl said:
No, the DEA plays a beneficial role in our society by helping keep violent crime associated with drug use at a minimum.




:wtf: ? the dea causes the majority of this violent crime by making drug-use a criminal affair, thus associated with big money/big guns...


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4311692 - 06/18/05 08:52 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think this is a good idea  :thumbup:


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Thor]
    #4311789 - 06/18/05 09:28 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

:thumbup:

Good to hear Thor. I think the art of rhetoric truely could help the movement, for if anybody ever became entangled in a debate with an anti-drug person, they would have at least some knowledge of where their opponent could go and how to respond.

And as others have pointed out, debate could be used simply as a way to hone rhetoric over other issues than drugs and cognitive freedoms.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Offlinestefan
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4313131 - 06/19/05 06:29 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

very good idea. for example I see people all the time raving about how MJ only has benefits etc. Good idea to discuss and make people aware of the less well known negative points of drug use. Especially the kinds of drugs people think are completely safe ('safe' doesn't mean you can abuse it etc :smirk: )


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4313207 - 06/19/05 08:18 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I'm all for it! :thumbup:

My personal stance is that of controlled decriminalisation of all recreational drugs. (note the "controlled" bit)

However I'm perfectly willing to take on the role of the anti-drug party and can offer fierce resistance.

I agree with Ravus that there should be a designated area for such debattle and I propose a sticky post that lays the foundation (such as: no BS that isnt supported by a significant portion of the pro/con people) The ANTI's could gather their ammo on such righteous websites as freevibe to get the feel of accurately portraying people that suck :evil:

I feel the ANTI-impersonators should be allowed a registered puppet account for not having their name tarnished by spewing Anslinger propaganda.

"The Drug War Arena" ?

It might become a great place to harden ourselves and reinforce our stances so that we in RL are better prepared to deal with the prohibitionist menace.

It may also take us back to an OTD-ish type of Thunderdome where controlled flaming (with a purpose) can perhaps be allowed in the light of realistic confrontation. I'm for regulated mayhem and anarchy in that forum, as long as people contain it to that forum.

A staged riot like this should allow for ruthless modding.
If it is contained to the forum but crosses the line (like playing it on the man) a shortterm forum-specific timeout ban ought to fly without discussion.
If it goes beyond the confines of the specific forum however site standards should be upheld from both moderators and users.

Heated debate beyond the usual standards ought to be possible (its a simulation after all) but the emphasis should lie on realistic and respectful debate so that shroomerites can hone their skill to properly and civilly disarm prohibitionists.

An interesting spinoff could be that true anti-druggers might participate in debate, so perhaps it should be visible only after x posts and y days like ODD is.

Fun, educational and site-enriching.. I'm all for it if its properly regulated. It will be unlike any forum we have.
And hey, we can put it up as a pilot, if the experiment fails we can just take it down.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Asante]
    #4313640 - 06/19/05 02:07 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

While there is the possibility that OTD-like flaming could erupt, in a debate it'd seem best to try to control it by laying out some rules beforehand, (I.E.: no ad hominem attacks,) and then try to encourage people to rip the other person's argument apart rather than simply the other person.

It seems the three alternatives for the placement of this threads would be to simply put them in existing forums like PA&L, whether stickied or unstickied, to put them in subforums, or to put them in their own forums. The main problem with the first option is that such a debate possibly could put unexpected pressure on the mods and have the threads quickly closed, while the difference between whether to put it in a forum or subforum really depends on how much publicity we'd want to give the debates.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Offlinecb9fl
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4313650 - 06/19/05 02:14 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think a subforum of PA&L would be fitting.


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It is better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you are not. -Andre Gide

"Generosity is nothing else than a craze to possess. All which I abandon, all which I give, I enjoy in a higher manner through the fact that I give it away. To give is to enjoy possessively the object which one gives."


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: A Possibility [Re: cb9fl]
    #4313697 - 06/19/05 02:44 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah, I would have to agree.


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Asante]
    #4314018 - 06/19/05 04:42 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think we should still expect civility and follow the rules of any other forum.

But I do think a sub-forum of PA&L would be appropriate, we could set it up to see the direction of the forum on its own and then maybe create some structure to it.

I was thinking once we have some bank of debates we could create a sticky thread that summarizes various debates strong points as a quick reference guide.


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Ravus]
    #4314812 - 06/19/05 08:56 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

This idea rules...


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Asante]
    #4315398 - 06/20/05 12:12 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Enjoy  :thumbup:

Drug War Arena


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Invisiblegdman
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Thor]
    #4315476 - 06/20/05 12:37 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

cool :cool:!


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Got a question about a substance?  Erowid might already have your answer! Have questions about the  mushroom experience? The  Tripper's FAQ may have your answer or someone else might have had your question before.
         
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  - Theodor Seuss Geisel Dr. Suess

"I didn't come here to be easily understood" - Steve


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Thor]
    #4315490 - 06/20/05 12:40 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

:thumbup:

This is going to be an interesting experiment.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: A Possibility [Re: Thor]
    #4315573 - 06/20/05 01:11 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I am very impressed, Thor. That was a rapid response. :smile:


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