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 DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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 Koran proves relativity 
#4285152 - 06/12/05 12:11 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
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Im no expert in relativity, but I still find this highly amusing.
click
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Pinback
Stranger
Registered: 07/20/02
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4285674 - 06/12/05 03:18 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
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If you by amusing mean sad, I would agree. 
The first text is just some wishful thinking. For example, the quote "He rules (all) affairs from the heavens to the earth: in the end will (all affairs) go up to Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be (as) a thousand years of your reckoning" (a different translation than what is on the page) is interpreted to mean "one light-day equals the distance the moon travels in 1000 years"!!! Very amazing. The calculation part shows that with some number fiddling, and there is really a lot of it, you can fit any number to any statement.
The time dilation text is equally odd, and the conclusion shows that either basic concepts of mathematics are not understood, or that the author deliberately tries to deceive.
It is a good thing though that the author links to another translation than the one used. For an example, check the "Ice in Comets" quote. A totally different meaning is given.
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 Seuss
Error: divide byzero
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4290223 - 06/13/05 05:04 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
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 I think pinback pretty much nailed it...
Quote:
The calculation part shows that with some number fiddling, and there is really a lot of it, you can fit any number to any statement.
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Just another spore in the wind.
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TheCow
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: Seuss]
#4300432 - 06/15/05 04:47 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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I liken religion trying to show that science supports it, to the famous 'proof' that 1=2.
a = b
a^2 = ab
a^2- b^2 = ab-b^2
(a-b)(a+b) = b(a-b)
a+b = b
b+b = b
2b = b
2 = 1
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: TheCow]
#4300912 - 06/15/05 06:53 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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If a religion is true then science will 100% support it.
Which proves no relgions thus far is 100% true (as far as I know).
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DF2K
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4301223 - 06/15/05 08:28 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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religon is a farce
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DF2K]
#4301389 - 06/15/05 09:11 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Isnt that what i said? 
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delta9
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4301393 - 06/15/05 09:12 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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He was probably replying to the topic poster or topic in general.
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delta9
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Diploid
Cuban
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Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: TheCow]
#4302480 - 06/16/05 01:59 AM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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2 = 1
BZZZ! Division by zero! 
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Republican Values:
1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.
4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: TheCow]
#4303514 - 06/16/05 12:13 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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> BZZZ! Division by zero!
> a=b
> ...
> (a-b)(a+b) = b(a-b)
> a+b = b
> ...
As usual, Diploid is correct.
Let a=b=5, then
(5-5)(5+5)=5(5-5)
(5-5)(5+5)/(5-5)=5
0(10)/0=5 BZZZ! Division by zero! 
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Just another spore in the wind.
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Rudra
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4303645 - 06/16/05 12:53 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Muslim are magic. With all those bombs etc.
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TheCow
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: Rudra]
#4306620 - 06/17/05 02:34 AM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Guys...obviously the proof doesnt work...sigh
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Seuss
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: TheCow]
#4306730 - 06/17/05 04:28 AM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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> Guys...obviously the proof doesnt work...
But it is cute, on the surface. 
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Just another spore in the wind.
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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 Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: Seuss]
#4308428 - 06/17/05 05:47 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Here's another cute 'proof'.
Given X is a real:
X^2 - X^2 = X^2 - X^2
Now factor each side differently.
(X - X) * (X + x) = X * (X - X)
And reduce.
X + X = X
Plug in X = 1.
1 + 1 = 1
Simplify.
2 = 1 
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Republican Values:
1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.
4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: Diploid]
#4309371 - 06/17/05 10:08 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Basically 1(0) = 2(0) ?
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vampirism
Stranger
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Posts: 8,120
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4310844 - 06/18/05 12:47 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
DieCommie said:
If a religion is true then science will 100% support it.
Which proves no relgions thus far is 100% true (as far as I know).
wrong.
that suggests that abstraction does not exist.
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: vampirism]
#4311032 - 06/18/05 02:20 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Morrowind said:
Quote:
DieCommie said:
If a religion is true then science will 100% support it.
Which proves no relgions thus far is 100% true (as far as I know).
wrong.
that suggests that abstraction does not exist.
No it dosent. If science and religion are true, then they will agree. Just because you believe "abstraction" absolutely exists is irrelevant.
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zee_werp
a fractalcreature
Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 1,026
Loc: Aotearoa
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: DieCommie]
#4316317 - 06/20/05 07:52 AM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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DieCommie-
Firstly, what is your 'in the beginning was the symmetry' avatar about? That is a great little statement I'd like to know more about it. Not trying to send this post off topic, you can PM me if you want, I'm just curious as to if it is 'from something' and if it is I'd like to know more.
As for this topic...I disagree that if religion was true then science would 100% support it.
Ever heard of paradigms?
Think of it this way. For thousands of years, humans have been striving to find out the true nature of reality, to "know god" so to speak, via the use of their own nervous systems and certain religious frameworks to meditate themselves into a state of extremely heightened awareness.
But the crucial problem with these experiences is, is that they aren't something that can be easily communicated. It's not like one person can realise the meaning or rules of the universe and then just tell all their friends about it so that they know too. Because it is something that you are living in yourself and you have to get yourself to that state by your own determination and efforts, its not something that can be described to you, you have to live it to realise it.
But of course people still try to communicate it, and this is the content of religious texts like the bible, koran, tao, etc. People talking about both the nature of their religious experiences, and the techniques in which they used to attain those. In other words they are trying to help other people along the way so that not every single person has to start from scratch in their own personal spiritual journey.
But even with these writings, you could study them inside and out for years but you still would not have achieved much of anything until you reached these places yourself. And when a person does 'break through' and be living 100% within the essence of that moment, the thing that they experience is something that can never be properly described to another human unless that human attains the state too.
Anyway, I personally view science as a formalisation and a standardisation of the quest to find out the true nature of reality. It had to start again from the most fundamental properties and build its theories from there over hundreds of years. By using standard notation and strict scientific methods, science is attempting to be able to reveal the 'secrets' of the universe to anyone prepared to learn the language of science. Always striving for that elusive 'grand unifying theory' that will be the formal, logically worked out version of a pure spiritual expereince in a human being. Science tries to expose that moment, and make it avaliable to anyone willing to spend the hours learning the formulas and the concepts behind them.
Now many would argue that understanding science is an uplifting and motivating experience in itself, and I agree that it is. But personally I do not beleive that science has yet explained (communicated) the ideas and concepts that some people may know in their hearts but not be able to communicate. Though they can sometimes come pretty damn close, such as the case of E=MC2.
Basically the point I am trying to make here, is that religion started out waaaay ahead of science, there have been people understanding concepts of leading edge physics and whatnot for thousands of years. There have been people that understood the nature of energy and chaos, long before anyone even knew that water was H2O. I do not beleive that science has yet caught up to explain the things that people can experience first hand whilst undergoing an intense spiritual experience.
The issue here is about communication. Science is simply a process of communicating what spiritually aware people have known all along, but been unable to communicate in a way sufficient to 'prove' it. Just take one look at the history of science and you will see that it changes all the time and that even the theories about time, space, matter, etc are always being thrown into question and often theoretically disproven. Even though E=MC2 seems reasonably robust, it has only been a round for a relatively short amount of time and I don't think that it is the end of the story. It is definitley missing something.
The funny thing is that in the nature of science, nothing can be proven, all we can do is either disprove or support our hypotheses about things. Whereas with religious experience, there is no need to prove it to anyone else what you know in your own heart to be true.
Anyway I have rambled on waaaaay too much here so I will shut the fuck up.
PS I'm not trying to say that the koran does prove relativity, as it doesn't prove anything...and I don't know enough about koran to delve further...I'm more interested in taoism.
Edited by zee_werp (06/20/05 08:05 AM)
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: Koran proves relativity [Re: zee_werp]
#4318664 - 06/20/05 08:59 PM (18 years, 9 months ago) |
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.
Edited by DieCommie (11/13/16 10:15 AM)
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