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Invisiblepsilotatsic
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: moosehead]
    #4295238 - 06/14/05 03:11 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

moosehead said:
make a bunch of RCs?

phhh, i poop on RCs




He is the father of MDMA and many other very fine chemicals not just rc's


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"Those whoe truely get high never come back"

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Offlinemoosehead
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: psilotatsic]
    #4295252 - 06/14/05 03:16 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

he didnt invent mdma.

i think shulgins great, he made alot of drugs. but hunter is way cooler, and contributed more to society imo.

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Invisiblepsilotatsic
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: moosehead]
    #4295263 - 06/14/05 03:21 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Im pretty sure he did invent MDMA..

Thompson just wrote a few books..

Either way there both very important!


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"Those whoe truely get high never come back"

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Offlinemoosehead
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: psilotatsic]
    #4295284 - 06/14/05 03:25 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

I know, im just being a dick. He synthesized mdma. Drugs get the job done for some people, books get it done for others. Im all about the HTS lifestyle, so thats why I feel hes greater. Shulgin is one of the biggest proponents for the sharing of information on drugs. Which, is pretty neato, but not as much my thing.

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InvisibleHELLA_TIGHT
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: moosehead]
    #4295290 - 06/14/05 03:27 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

No, actually he wasn't the first to synthesize MDMA.


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Invisiblephalloidin

Registered: 07/03/04
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: psilotatsic]
    #4295292 - 06/14/05 03:27 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

he didn't invent MDMA, he just revived it. I wouldn't compare him to HST though, they were completely different. but I would say

Hofmann > Shulgin

Mckenna > Leary

and I can't think of anyone to compare to HST

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InvisibleHELLA_TIGHT
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: phalloidin]
    #4295296 - 06/14/05 03:28 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

In 1967, he was introduced to the possibilities of MDMA by an undergrad at San Francisco State University at a time when very few people had tried MDMA. Though Shulgin didn't invent the chemical, he did create a new synthesis process in 1976




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Offlinemoosehead
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: HELLA_TIGHT]
    #4295305 - 06/14/05 03:30 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

whatever. he made the form popular today. is taht cool>?

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OfflineTwirling
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: moosehead]
    #4295373 - 06/14/05 03:47 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

"Counter-culture heros" is a bit of an oxymoron, isn't it?


My personal feeling is that there are so many factors involved with the counter-culture that it's very hard to pinpoint an exact problem with lead to it's downfall. Perhaps if meth hadn't gotten so big, perhaps if propaganda didn't get out of control, perhaps if Nixon hadn't targeted activists, perhaps if Leary hadn't proselytized, perhaps, perhaps....

What I can say is that our current culture, at least pop-mainstream culture, is really spinning out of control while many people remain rather in the dark about politics. I dunno where I'm going with this.

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Offlinemoosehead
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: Twirling]
    #4295387 - 06/14/05 03:51 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

The counter culture was doomed from the start because hippies tend to be stupid.

I feel that our culture today is in many ways better. On the surface we have the fake plastic MTV and FOX news and blah blah.

But thats just the surface. Every day I meet cool people. I think its getting better and better.

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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: Twirling]
    #4295420 - 06/14/05 03:57 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

The counter culture had a downfall?

'Counter culture' was really just what youths who had pretentions of revolution called it. It was really just the current strain of youth culture. Like the flappers, or the beatniks, or whoever. Just another gang of kids dancing to music their parents hated, and taking drugs their parents feared.

Some of the most naive and illinformed people politically I've met have been the ones who were convinced they were counterculture rabblerousers.

They're all just a bunch of kids who get off on dissing what's popular.

No, you're not cool because you don't listen to Britney Spears. No, you're not smarter because you don't watch The OC, and no, you're definitely not more informed because you dislike Bush.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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OfflineTheDudeAbides
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: Phluck]
    #4295444 - 06/14/05 04:02 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

All I am saying is Hunter Thompson WROTE BOOKS...Shulgin made drugs. Very fucking stupid arguing who is more important and what not.
They are both very cool/important in their own fields.
As for Thompson, he just hated the fact that Tim Leary was a pom-pus arrogant asshole who thought that he was some kind of Guru..As a result frying hundreds of his followers brains. Thompson rambled about everyone being a rogue CIA/FBI narc or members of the Third Reich. It's just how he got the point of evil across, it doesn't really mean ANYTHING in my oppinon.

Anyone understand what I'm saying?


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outputrotation said:
x-com and unsolved mysteries are the only things that have ever made me truly scared

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OfflineTwirling
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: moosehead]
    #4295456 - 06/14/05 04:04 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Hippies is a wide-ranging category with a variety of meanings. Speaking to some ex-hippies, it seems as if you had the "drop-outs" and those just looking to cruise along in life, but then you also had some genuinely intelligent people. Same as any other label.

I think like any ?revolution?, once something starts to pick up, it snowballs and becomes something that it wasn?t originally. Today, whenever there is a ?revolution?, it becomes this ?thing? which people try to adhere to. Ultimately it?s bound to fail because it becomes rather unnatural.

Modern culture is certainly far more vast than the ?hippie? label, so obviously there?s both the good and the bad. I?ve met plenty of really awesome people, as you?re saying, but I also see plenty of really self-centered, short-sighted people. I think things are so accelerated and diverse that the best & worst in humanity have all been accelerated as well. More depends on the individual than anything else, really.

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OfflineTwirling
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: Twirling]
    #4295473 - 06/14/05 04:07 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Here's an analogy; today's ecology situation has more of both extremes. On the negative side, we use much more oil, consumption is up, and so are landfills. Yet on the other hand, our emissions from factories are drastically improved, we understand more about the ecosystem, we recycle much, much more, and have more alternative energy sources in the works.

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Invisibleblink
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... *DELETED* [Re: moosehead]
    #4295684 - 06/14/05 04:44 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Post deleted by blinkidiot

Reason for deletion: Im sorry



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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: blink]
    #4296674 - 06/14/05 08:28 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

"All I am saying is Hunter Thompson WROTE BOOKS...Shulgin made drugs. Very fucking stupid arguing who is more important and what not."

Dude, have you ever heard of or read TiKHAL/PiKHAL? They are tremendously inspiring books.

Shuglin never claimed to be a rebel or hippy. All he wanted to do was legally research the human mind through psychedelic chemicals. He was a scientist who promoted free science, true drug education, and a reasonable approach to how psychedelics can make our world a better place. He didn't philosophize, he didn't bullshit. He was factual and straight forward, and always writes from experiance.

Although, he did have this one chapter where he went on this rant about how the big bang theory is full of shit. He basically said that scientists try to manipulate and change facts to fit this certain model when they should be changing the model to the facts instead. Honestly I don't think he has a whole lot of clout in the big bang matter since he isn't an astro-physicist, but I think the important thing is that he is urging people to question widely accepted scientific models. I suppose this whole thing can be thought of as a parallel to how scientists will manipulate their data from drug experiments to fit the Gov't model of drugs as being harmful.

But anyways, yeah, Leary was a fucking quack who probably did more harm than good. I have always avoided leary's bullshit for the same reason I don't like TOOL. People often think that psychedelics just automatically enlighten them and make them better and more aware than most people when the plain fact of the matter is that they are just as ignorant as everyone else and usually have drug problems on top of it.

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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: blink]
    #4296686 - 06/14/05 08:32 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

"All I am saying is Hunter Thompson WROTE BOOKS...Shulgin made drugs. Very fucking stupid arguing who is more important and what not."

Dude, have you ever heard of or read TiKHAL/PiKHAL? They are tremendously inspiring books.

Shuglin never claimed to be a rebel or hippy. All he wanted to do was legally research the human mind through psychedelic chemicals. He was a scientist who promoted free science, true drug education, and a reasonable approach to how psychedelics can make our world a better place. He really blew up the whole idea of using MDMA and other chemicals in psychotherapy. He didn't philosophize, he didn't bullshit. He was factual and straight forward, and always writes from experiance.

Although, he did have this one chapter where he went on this rant about how the big bang theory is full of shit. He basically said that scientists try to manipulate and change facts to fit this certain model when they should be changing the model to the facts instead. Honestly I don't think he has a whole lot of clout in the big bang matter since he isn't an astro-physicist, but I think the important thing is that he is urging people to question widely accepted scientific models. I suppose this whole thing can be thought of as a parallel to how scientists will manipulate their data from drug experiments to fit the Gov't model of drugs as being harmful.

But anyways, yeah, Leary was a fucking quack who probably did more harm than good. I have always avoided leary's bullshit for the same reason I don't like TOOL. People often think that psychedelics just automatically enlighten them and make them better and more aware than most people when the plain fact of the matter is that they are just as ignorant as everyone else and usually have drug problems on top of it.

As for Thompson vs. Shulgin? Thompson wrote books that were clever and well written, but based on half truths by the very definition of Gonzo journalism. A very important cultural voice, yes. But I think Shulgin has had a greater impact on the scientific community and modern psychedelic culture.

Edited by dr0mni (06/14/05 08:34 PM)

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InvisibleHELLA_TIGHT
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: dr0mni]
    #4296702 - 06/14/05 08:35 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

2 of the same posts, except you added a paragraph?


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OfflineTheDudeAbides
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: dr0mni]
    #4296708 - 06/14/05 08:38 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

I wasn't puttin him down in any way, I had no idea the guy wrote books.

I WAS saying that it's stupid to argue who's cooler, wich alot of people were doing at that moment...It's the complete opposite of what HST was about.

{edit}
Ravus just said what I was trying to get across in his last paragraph in the post below this one. I just happened to put it a little more bluntly.


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outputrotation said:
x-com and unsolved mysteries are the only things that have ever made me truly scared

Edited by The_Dude_420 (06/14/05 08:41 PM)

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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Hunter Thompson, avowed enemy of Timothy Leary... [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #4296710 - 06/14/05 08:38 PM (18 years, 9 months ago)

Hunter was much wiser and realistic than Leary ever could've been. Whether or not Leary was a true informant or just gave a few useless facts about the Black Panthers to the CIA, no one on this forum knows. But his entire way of treating drugs, his outlook on the psychedelic experience, were, in my opinion, ridiculous. It's like he thought of himself as Jesus and taking LSD was eating his skin.

Thompson > Leary

Yet I don't think Thompson can be compared to Shulgin in any way. Shulgin was a chemist who researched many psychedelic drugs; Thompson was a journalist who developed a unique writing style and a way to tell things like they are. Their contributions are so remotely distant, to compare them would be like comparing Aldous Huxley and Albert Hofmann.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.

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