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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Registered: 06/15/02
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If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq?
    #4289608 - 06/13/05 02:06 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

What would your course of action be?

I think there are three possible options:

1. American troops leave. If this happened the country would fall into civil war probably. There would be even more chaos and instability than there is now. A new Saddam-like dictator would probably arise. God knows what would happen to the people of Iraq or the stability of the region in general. It would be a terrible disaster.

2. America half-asses the Iraq project. Nothing will ever get done and things will remain somewhat chaotic. A decent amount of money will be wasted, a decent amount of American troops will die, and nothing will be accomplished.

3. America does the Iraq project correctly. This will result in a stable and prosperous democracy for the Iraqi people. If this path is followed a ton of money will be spent and a lot of American soldiers will die.

None of those choices sound good and all of them have grave costs. I think #3 is the best possible option.

But, I would do a lot of things to ensure that #3 succeeded. Here's what I would do (I apologize if I am repeating any sentiments that I expressed in other posts. I don't want to be redundant):

a. Admit the past maneuverings and meddlings of the U.S. when it comes to the Middle East. Apologize to the Muslims about this.

b. Remove every single troop from every Arab country.

c. Stop all aid to Israel.

d. Stop all aid to oppressive Arab regimes.

e. Make the Iraqi people happier so that they are more likely to help and support the U.S. occupation in fighting the insurgency. This would include making a better infrastructure (more electricity, more water, etc...) for them.

f. Apologize to the Iraqi people for pursuing a war against their nation that was based on premises that have turned out to be false.

g. Increase the amount of troops in Iraq. Half-assing stuff gets you nowhere. I think we need more boots on the ground.

h. Make it known that the only reason we want to be in Iraq is to help build it up again. I feel guilty that their country is devastated and we owe them our efforts to help their country get back on its feet. Make it clear that we have no interest in using their country as a military base, stealing their oil, propping up a compliant regime, or engaging in geo-political maneuverings at their expense. Also make it clear that once the job is done we will leave.

i. We need to be much more hawkish towards Islamic militant terrorists. We should humiliate, torture, kill, and defile them. We need to make them fear us more than they do. The Muslims need to know that they should not fuck with us.

That's what I would do. What would you do?


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4293963 - 06/14/05 02:53 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Oh come on.... With all of the opinions on Iraq that have been expressed in this forum nobody has anything to say when it comes to what they would do if they were in charge?


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OfflineKada
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4294041 - 06/14/05 03:22 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I find that hard to answer, because no matter what i did, everyone would hate me for it.
So most likley i would tell the UN that america has better things to do than babysit, and that we were pulling out on a certain date and they better come up with something because if they screw with us again, i would really blow the hell out of them.
Is the UN every ganna actually be helpfull at one point? Do they ever really get involved? I am not a politician, nor do i claim to be educated in this area, but im pretty certain, we should have gotten UN support before trying to do everything ourselfs. ( yes i do know that there are some helping us, just not all or majority. )


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Kada]
    #4294066 - 06/14/05 03:29 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

LordOfChaos said:
I find that hard to answer, because no matter what i did, everyone would hate me for it.




I agree. Every possible choice pretty much sucks.


Quote:

LordOfChaos said:
So most likley i would tell the UN that america has better things to do than babysit, and that we were pulling out on a certain date and they better come up with something because if they screw with us again, i would really blow the hell out of them.

Is the UN every ganna actually be helpfull at one point?





I am of the opinion that the UN is a worthless institution that would do an even worse job in Iraq than we have if they were put in charge.


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OfflineAaronEvil
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4294100 - 06/14/05 03:39 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I dont believe in foreign policy, not to the extent we have it today anyway. I would probably just get up and leave. Let them get their own government system. We obviously dont care if genocide goes on in the world, so why do we need to stay?


--------------------


There is not a lot of difference between a fox hole and a grave; but knowing that you dug your ditch and climbed in anyway.


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OfflineKada
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4294111 - 06/14/05 03:45 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

But wouldnt it make a great way to show how utterly stupid the UN is? Pawning it off on them just to show them they are really worthless?
I know, where are the Iraq people in all this? Would we be screwing them? Pretty much, but then we tryed to set them up with ideas and a government, civil war is ugly, if they went down that path. but what we are doing over there isn't exactly handing out candy canes.
There is no right answer, but back the the origional question, i pretty much answered you with a riddle, and that is confusing. So is Iraq.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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OfflineKada
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Kada]
    #4294119 - 06/14/05 03:54 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

It just makes me sick seeing people (by people i mean anyone, but mostly poeple there from other countries trying to help) die over there for what it seems is a worthless effort, they seem pretty much screwed. if they cant handle it from where we set them up as of even today, nothing will help. Well nothing humaine. Sound bad doesnt it? It is.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Kada]
    #4294126 - 06/14/05 03:58 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

LordOfChaos said:
It just makes me sick seeing people (by people i mean anyone, but mostly poeple there from other countries trying to help) die over there for what it seems is a worthless effort, they seem pretty much screwed. if they cant handle it from where we set them up as of even today, nothing will help. Well nothing humaine. Sound bad doesnt it? It is.




I really wish our troops were not there.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4294138 - 06/14/05 04:05 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

1. Quickly train a large Iraqi army to take over the fighting once we get out of there.

2. Divide Iraq into confederacy of three states: Sunni, Shi'ite, and Kurd, none of them more powerful than any other.

3. Land reform, in the form of a land value tax. Every country should be doing this, but it might be particularly helpful in a third-world country like Iraq, especially one in which there are tribal land disputes. This could also make it easier for the Iraqis to rebuild their own infrastructure.

4. Pull our troops and money out of the rest of the Middle East(and most of the rest of the world, for that matter).

5. Pull out of Iraq ASAP.

6. Apologize to the world for our former imperialist tendencies.

7. Ruthlessly pursue any terrorist who tries to fuck with us after that.


--------------------


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Silversoul]
    #4294148 - 06/14/05 04:14 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

It appears as if we agree on a lot of the basics.


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InvisibleGijith
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Silversoul]
    #4294320 - 06/14/05 06:18 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
1. Quickly train a large Iraqi army to take over the fighting once we get out of there.

2. Divide Iraq into confederacy of three states: Sunni, Shi'ite, and Kurd, none of them more powerful than any other.

3. Land reform, in the form of a land value tax. Every country should be doing this, but it might be particularly helpful in a third-world country like Iraq, especially one in which there are tribal land disputes. This could also make it easier for the Iraqis to rebuild their own infrastructure.

4. Pull our troops and money out of the rest of the Middle East(and most of the rest of the world, for that matter).

5. Pull out of Iraq ASAP.

6. Apologize to the world for our former imperialist tendencies.

7. Ruthlessly pursue any terrorist who tries to fuck with us after that.




8. Reparations

Sounds good to me.


--------------------
what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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Offlinedaimyo
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4294494 - 06/14/05 10:19 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If I were President I would draft 250,000 Iraqis to join 500,000 Americans in a new organization. It would be called Americas International Security Service(AMISS). Every year an additional 25,000 recruits would be required to join, or be drafted to replace an outgoing 10,000 from each member country.
It's first priority would be controlling the Iraqi oil fields. Once secured I would take profits directly out of Iraqs oil revenues to fund this newfound organization and also to slowly pay off the debt incurred through the freeing of Iraq.
Second priority would be the establishment of a Middle East Regional Headquarters in Iraq. State of the art bases and weapons again paid for with oil revenues.
Their third priority would be dismantling and shipping Saddams palaces back to the US for use as public libraries.
Finally they would be ordered to secure neighboring countries. In each, a minimum of 75,000 recruits would be taken, and public resources would fund their ongoing efforts(never so much as to strain the economy though).

Or failing all that, I'd go with Paradigms plan minus the apology.


--------------------
"I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."


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InvisibleYidakiMan
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: daimyo]
    #4294650 - 06/14/05 12:07 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Tell the world that we have switched to a wonderful new lubricant in our ammunition factories. This lubricant is called Powerful Innovative Grease.
Chefs call it pig fat. Pig fat probably doesnt work very well as an industrial lubricant, so in reality it would just be psychological warfare.

In all seriousness, I like what Paradigm said, save for the apology. I like the idea of a confederacy, and it was my opinion long before the war that a democractic state would fail unless Iraq were broken up into three seperate entities.


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: YidakiMan]
    #4294900 - 06/14/05 03:46 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Apologize? You never apologize, consider everyone the fucking enemy, you never ever say sorry. You say sorry and they will piss on you the next chance they get.


--------------------



http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


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OfflineAncalagon
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: downforpot]
    #4295032 - 06/14/05 04:12 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

downforpot said:
Apologize? You never apologize, consider everyone the fucking enemy, you never ever say sorry. You say sorry and they will piss on you the next chance they get.



If your 'soul' or what have you was switched into Hitler's body in the summer of 1939, would you apologize for all you had done so far or continue on the path layed out before you?


--------------------
?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'


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OfflineKada
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: downforpot]
    #4296177 - 06/14/05 08:24 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Agree.

I wouldnt apoligize, i would slap everyone in charge over there in the face 1 time each, and tell them they made me come over there, and dont make me do it again, cause next time will be 1000 times worse.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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InvisibleRavus
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4296669 - 06/14/05 10:25 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I'd put much more time and energy into creating a well-trained, well-funded Iraqi army, and then start to slowly withdraw U.S. troops until we're just there as a minor enforcement behind the more powerful Iraqi troops.

Then I'd legalize drugs, gambling and prostitution in Iraq and have a big party, inviting all the metrosexual Europeans and manly Americans and bored Brazilians to come have all the fun they want. The funds from this could go to helping fund the Iraqi army to stop the insurgents, and the rest could be divided between the Americans and the Iraqi people.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: Ravus]
    #4296749 - 06/14/05 10:48 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I'll bet the conservative Islamic extremists would just love gambling, drugs, and prostitution.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: If you were President of the U.S. what would you do about Iraq? [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4297006 - 06/14/05 11:47 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
I'll bet the conservative Islamic extremists would just love gambling, drugs, and prostitution.



It'd be a nice testing ground for how the Christian extremists will react to it over here.


--------------------


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