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Invisibleshroomydan
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Hay Bail Pan subbs (Photos added July 5th)
    #4288875 - 06/12/05 10:50 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

My recent break from moderating the hunting forum gave me time to explore some new places. :smile:

These were found on a hay bail on public land in western Pennsylvania.





This is an old one.


A blue foot is common on the old ones.


The younger ones show no bluing and are difficult to distinguish from Panaeolina foenisecii. They ones on the left are Pan subbs from the hay bail; the ones on the right are Pan foens from my mom's yard.


:smile: :heart: :mushroom2:


Edited by shroomydan (07/05/05 02:00 PM)


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Offlinemattymonkey
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4288904 - 06/12/05 10:54 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

wow nice...

do you recommend any reading for people who are interesting in learning this art?

(edit) nm, found the FAQ! thanks :smile:


Edited by mattymonkey (06/12/05 10:57 PM)


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Invisibleivi
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4288910 - 06/12/05 10:56 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nice find and pictures. What have the temperatures been like in the western Pennsylvania lately?


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: ivi]
    #4288940 - 06/12/05 11:02 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

It's been in the eighties and very humid, with occasional heavy rains. The Pan subbs love it. :laugh:


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4289154 - 06/12/05 11:54 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Cool pictures! I found a pann subb with a stem that was 8" today in 1' grass. No picture, I'm sorry. maybe I set the record for worlds longest stem? It all goes in the same blender, so who really cares :sun:
I REALLY like your picture where you compare the two pan strains.
One way I pick them out easy is the subbs sometimes come to a more conical point at the top. Especially if they are growing through tall grass.


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these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


Edited by flowstone (06/13/05 12:32 AM)


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Invisibleivi
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: flowstone]
    #4289210 - 06/13/05 12:08 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

flowstone said:
I REALLY like your picture where you compare the two subb strains.




Those are not "two Panaeolus subbalteatus strains". If you read what shroomydan wrote, the two mushrooms on the left are Panaeolus subbalteatus and the two on the right - Panaeolina foenisecii.


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Edited by ivi (06/13/05 12:14 AM)


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Offlineeris
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4289306 - 06/13/05 12:29 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

nice, very nice photos.


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: ivi]
    #4289316 - 06/13/05 12:32 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

That's what I meant to say. *ninja edit.
The gill structure is the giveaway for me.
And the white stems... There were some medium pan artillums out today and they look more like a subb cap than foes do. Thank goodness they ain't deadly I'm sure lots of people mistake it.

According to the shroomery dose calculator, you CAN collect and eat pan foes. Check out the dosage yourself

http://www.shroomery.org/index/par/12195

About an ounce per level(dry) haha! Eat 5 ounces of them( and puke your guts out) Or you can eat 3.65 grams Cyanescens for the same effect... I think it puts to rest some former rumors that pan foes were a utilized magic mushroom, while possible, yes.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4289333 - 06/13/05 12:37 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Hi Shroomy dan, Nice score of Pan subbs. A point to make to you and others is in rwegards to your comparison photographs.

Quote:

The younger ones show no bluing and are difficult to distinguish from Panaeolina foenisecii.




If one turns over the caps to look at the gills, the shapes of the caps of the Pan subbs are irregular rather than a circle, they become strain on some of the curves in the circle. I think somoen needs to show a few of the caps of the subbs of smaller ones with the irregular curves. Also, Pan foenisecis do not have the vertical groves spiraling up and down the length of the stem.

mj

have a shromy da. Would like to add your two photos tot he Pan subb ID in the Shroomery's ultimate field guide if it is all right with you.

john


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #4289633 - 06/13/05 02:15 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

"There were some medium pan artillums out today and they look more like a subb cap than foes do"

Lol I have never seen any of those that even sorta resemble a subb.

"maybe I set the record for worlds longest stem?"

Or not... I have found them with a stem almost a foot long, as im sure angryshroom has too since we pick from the same patch.


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: CptnGarden]
    #4289643 - 06/13/05 02:19 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I mostly find kids who mistake Psathyrella gracilis and Panaeolina foenisecii for subbs. I rarely hear of kids mistaking "artillums" for subbs, maybe your just special.


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Invisibleflowstone
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: CptnGarden]
    #4290016 - 06/13/05 04:17 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Come down a bit from your pedestal.
Maybe you've never been in a GA field...
Maybe you've never seen it yourself...?
Maybe you know everything! :thumbdown:

Or maybe you missed the word 'cap'.
They are very similar, in fact. More so than a Psathyrella Velluntia resembles a Weilii.


--------------------
these long agonizing months without you...have been long and agonizing..
"War Doesn't Decide Who's Right... It Only Decides Who's Left."


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: mjshroomer]
    #4290284 - 06/13/05 08:24 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Sure MJ.

Give me a footnote. :grin:


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4290297 - 06/13/05 08:43 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)


found this and a few others yesterday
we need more rain now that we finally got enough heat.


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Offlinenycomyco
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4290557 - 06/13/05 11:48 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nice find shroomydan,
I found a bunch in straw bails back in the beginning of may when temps hardly got out of the fifties. Now that it's in the 80s-90s here, I haven't found any. But this gives me hope. I'll keep on looking.


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InvisibleCorporal Kielbasa
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4290581 - 06/13/05 11:56 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nice find.

Hay bails used at new construction sits along roadsides to keep erosion from flowing into the road are a Pan subb heaven.

Some of these were found on bails. Most were found around a hay feed station on a cow farm.



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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4313578 - 06/19/05 01:37 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Here are few more from the same location. Spores have turned the caps black. This is typical on the older specimens.




I found about ten other species growing from the same hay bails, including these.


I'm not sure what they are, but they remind me of deadly Conocybes.


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Invisibleivi
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4313595 - 06/19/05 01:45 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nice mushrooms and photos :thumbup: You should roll that hay bail home or something :crazy:

But I don't think those other species could be Conocybes as they all have rusty-brown to cinnamon-brown gills and rusty-brown to cinnamon-brown to ochraceous sporeprints.


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4313843 - 06/19/05 03:46 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Excellent find shroomydan.

Perfect Pan subbies.


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4315313 - 06/19/05 11:42 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Once again Shroomy Dan has shown others the true Pan subb. If you have a chance, turn some of the smaller semi rounded caps over to show people the unusual shape of the ouyter edge of the caps.

I think this wold also help the many who find Pan foens and cannot see the difference. They forget about the verticle lines running up and down the length of the stems, the fibrils near the bottoms and the bulbous tops,

Also lift a few from the hay and lightly pull back some of the hay to show the bluish-white mycelial threads , mattd like cotton from where they are picked.

This is what I taklked about in my paper Close Encouonters of the Panaeolus Kind.

Angry Shroom's compost heap was the most magnificent collection I have seen in years. Followed by Gumbys in Georgia, and Mitnasts annual field collections.

Shroomy Dan deserves a five star rating and i am going there to do so.

have a shroomy day,

P.s., Those are not the deadly Conocybe filaris mushrooms.

Not sure exactly, Color looks a little off. I have seen similar Coprinus in Seattle at the UW.
mj


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Invisibleangryshroom
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs. [Re: shroomydan]
    #4315362 - 06/20/05 12:00 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

nice finds man!


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Invisibleshroomydan
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs (new photos added 4JUL05) [Re: shroomydan]
    #4372094 - 07/05/05 01:58 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I took a drive over to my spot in PA yesterday and sure enough, the subbies were waiting for me. :laugh:

This spot has got to be one of the coolest finds of my mushroom hunting career. I only like to hunt on public land, so this leaves little access to Panaeolus subbalteatus's preferred habitat. The day I found this spot I was walking in the wooded flood plain along a stream on public game land in Western Pennsylvania. I was searching for the elusive P. caerulipes when up ahead I noticed a hay bail. :oogle: It was actually half of one of those large round bails. It looked so completely out of place lying there in the woods along the stream. It must have been picked up from the farm about a half mile upstream and deposited there by the massive flooding brought by hurricane Ivan last fall. I continued down stream and found four more bails. Humidity from the nearby stream and dense shade from the forest provide the perfect conditions for my little friends to thrive. On three of the five bails I have found Pan subbs.


When I find them they are usually blackened by spores. As you can see they do not resemble Panaeolina foenisecii.
               

They are quite a bit larger than Pan foens and the caps become plane as they age. Pans foens usually remain campanulate at maturity.


In this earlier photo you can see how they start off bell shaped, but flatten out as they mature.


Another way to tell you have a Pan subb is to look where the stem attaches to the gills. The top of the stem is bulbous and you can see the dark lines which MJ mentioned. These start where the gills attach and continue down the stem. These lines are not visible on Pan foens.


This spot is a reliable producer. Ive been back five or six times since I found it, and there have been mushrooms on at least one of the bails every time. It's amazing what you can find if you get out there and look.

:smile: :heart: :mushroom2:


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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs (new photos added 4JUL05) [Re: shroomydan]
    #4372570 - 07/05/05 05:06 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

those look so freakin delicious man. id love to stuble across those on a hunt. :mushroom2:


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InvisibleMadSeasonAbove
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs (new photos added 4JUL05) [Re: stankness]
    #4372702 - 07/05/05 05:42 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Wow, that is a sweet spot!


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InvisibleHermes_br
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Re: Hay Bail Pan subbs (new photos added 4JUL05) [Re: shroomydan]
    #4372808 - 07/05/05 06:20 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

nice ones..

thanks for the pics... :mushroom2:


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