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Offlinethashaman
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Registered: 11/09/04
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Tryptophan in casing layer?
    #4279465 - 06/10/05 12:27 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Hello all, I wanted to get you guys' honest opinion on something I am thinking of trying. I have recently gotten a hold of 100 % purified and isolated L-tryptophan from SigmaAldrich Chemical company. I was thinking about it and I know all the controversy concernting whether P. Cubensis can actually convert tryptophan into Psilocybin. But I was thinking of adding about 1 gm. to my casing layer to give it a shot. I don't think it can HURT anything becasue the side chain of L-tryptophan is not acidic or basic. It's simply an indole ring (Similar to psilocybin). Anyways, I was thiniking that if P cubensis has enzymes necessary to convert Tryptophan to Psilocybin, it is likely a non-favorable reaction and hence requires ATP or some reducing equivalent. That energy source would be being used rather than to fruit, to make alot of psilocybin. So unless I use a hearty substrate, which I have for this experiment, I might not get as beautiful flushes. Anyways what do you all think?


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Registered: 05/08/04
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4280253 - 06/10/05 03:58 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Well I think...that it wont HURT anything.


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Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
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Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: scatmanrav]
    #4282212 - 06/11/05 02:29 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I think it would help more if you add it to the substrate.
RR


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Offlinexburn
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #4282521 - 06/11/05 05:20 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

wont that make the mycellium sleepy and not want to pin. I mean whenever i eat turkey i just want to sleep. And if i was a mushroom i would most definatley not want pin. i mean think of how hard it is to get it up after thanksgiving dinner. I mean no fucking way would i want to pin. Fuck That man. My reccomendation is why bother. Your just gonna help them sleep


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Invisibleyousuck
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Registered: 05/23/05
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: xburn]
    #4293589 - 06/14/05 12:54 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

perhaps you know a bit of chemistry and are willing to convert this most precious tryptophan into a more desirable substance? you must have some qualification if you've aquired this, chem companies dont just give out tryptophan to anyone.


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Offlinexburn
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: yousuck]
    #4293849 - 06/14/05 02:03 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

sleepy mycellium


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: xburn]
    #4293994 - 06/14/05 03:06 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

I think it would help more if you add it to the substrate.




Ditto.

-Gnostic


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Invisiblemorninggloryseed
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: IGnosticAbhorI]
    #4297443 - 06/15/05 01:22 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Enzymes in the mycelium will produce psilocin from tryptophan. But you want to add this to the substrate...not the casing layer.


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OfflineElemicin
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: morninggloryseed]
    #4302258 - 06/16/05 02:43 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Decarboxylate...decarboxylate, thats all I gotta say, but yes, generally mushrooms can use the tryptophan. Keep in mind however the amount you put in.


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Registered: 11/13/04
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: yousuck]
    #4302302 - 06/16/05 02:54 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Uh, tryptophan is pretty easy to get actually.


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Offlinexburn
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: SoopaX]
    #4302594 - 06/16/05 05:42 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

milk ... and turkey


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InvisibleHyphalTryptamin
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4303470 - 06/16/05 01:55 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Well, if you want naturally occuring trytophan use a substrate which utilises quinoa- the grain with the highest amount of trytophan to be found. I hear the Alien substrate includes quinoa? Has anyone tried it?


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: xburn]
    #4304062 - 06/16/05 04:41 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Or just buying a few hundred grams of tryptophan. It's legal.


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Offlinethashaman
Biophilosopher

Registered: 11/09/04
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: HyphalTryptamin]
    #4324749 - 06/22/05 02:42 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, I am currently experimenting with Alien's Substrate. I inoculated 3 quart sized canning jars and 4 1/2 pint sized jars after 30 min. in an autoclave at 15 p.s.i. I made two small casings (two 1/2 pint jars a piece) in 60/40 verm./ coco-coir. The mycelium seems to love that mixture and your right about the quinoa having a high tryptophan content. I have my casings in the fruiting PMP right now. For good measures, I made the same small casings using BRF jars. So as soon as these casings fruit I will be able to comment on whether or not the quinoa lead to more psilocin or not. I think I will test this via GCMS. I will update, and thanks for all the input. You're right you do need a license to order from Sigma-Aldrich. Thanks...keep the input coming.


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Offlinepharmacyte
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5-hydroxytryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4326951 - 06/23/05 01:21 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

tryptamine, in my moderate experience, is what is extraordinarily hard to get. my last few attempts got so sketchy that i forever abandoned the idea of getting pure tryptamine from a lab supply company. i think this is what some of you are thinking of, since it is the foundation for psilcybin/psilcin ... it goes like this:

Tryptophan (the amino acid)--> 5-Hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) --> Serotonin --> N-Acetyl-serotonin --> Melatonin

perhaps one would consider a more available form of tryptophan, the omni-present 5HTP (hydroxytryptophan), as an additive in the water originally added to the substrate. perhaps that someone would be me (perhaps it would be my imaginary friend, the same one who would have gotten the tryptophan delivered to him...) and i can attest to no obviously stunted rhizomorphic growth or delayed fruiting... but attesting to any variation in potencyi can not.

post all thoughts about this... can p. cubensis process 5HTP? this is where my knowledge abruptly stops. help?

cheers,
pharmy.


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Offlinethashaman
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Registered: 11/09/04
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Re: 5-hydroxytryptophan in casing layer? [Re: pharmacyte]
    #4335115 - 06/25/05 05:56 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yes you pose an interesting and valid point. Tryptophan is not hard to come by if you have access to a PO# for educational research. I.e. the kind available in university research labs across the country. For that matter, niether are most other commercially produced chemicals. And it would be a pretty micky-mouse SN2/ oxidation reduction reaction to get from Tryptophan to 5-hydroxytrptophan. I think that I am coming to the realization that nature is not to be fucked with though. If one wants more potency, then one should upgrade to cyans or tampies. But then the condenser columns, and soxhlet apparatus' never stop. They never stop calling me..."Use me...Use me... fuck with nature...please for the love of GOD..." The inner turmoil is too great. Let CUBES BE CUBES! :smile:. Thanks for responding to this post all of you who did.


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Offlinedrugsaregood
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Re: 5-hydroxytryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4336459 - 06/25/05 05:50 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I used quinoa a couple times and only had good results. Once mixed with a little with the PFTEK substrate and the other time was just straight quinoa grain. The BRF/quinoa cakes worked really well but I couldn't tell much difference in potency, there's nothing relative to compare with when tripping. The straight quinoa grain would produced aborts, but they were definitely potent stuff. 3-5 aborts, maybe a gram or less, were definitely enough for a good trip, and the casing grew about 100 aborts total.


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Offlinethashaman
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4338268 - 06/26/05 03:21 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Came across this...

Psilocybin and Psilocin: Hoffman described the chemical synthesis of psilocybin and psilocin in 1959. During the synthesis of these compounds, DMT is formed first. The further synthesis of psilocybin and psilocin requires considerable additional procedure. This may be the reason why very little of these two hallucinogens has been seen on the illegal market.

Psilocybin can also be produced by biochemical methods using a pure culture of Psilocybe cubensis following the method of Catalfomo. There have been attempts to follow this route to produce psilocybin but all have been failures.

Hoffman, A. Psilocybin and Psilocin. Two Psychotropically Active Principles of Mexican Hallucinogenic Fungus. Helv. Chim. Acta., 42, 1557 (1959)

Catalfomo, P. The Production of Psilocybin in Submerged Culture by Psilocybe Cubensis. Dissertation Abs. 24, 953, No. 3, (1963)


Edited by thashaman (06/26/05 03:22 AM)


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Offlineonetime
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4340261 - 06/26/05 10:05 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

you can get 5-htp from one of our vendors and you can also get one that the human body turns in to 5-htp it comes in a bottle for humans to eat so i asume its capsuals. i would think that you could also buy it from any gnc or vitman store. is melotonin triptophan? becouse they sell that at the grocery store


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OfflineRudra
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Re: Tryptophan in casing layer? [Re: thashaman]
    #4343391 - 06/27/05 04:09 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Would melatonin be a nice idea?


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