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Offlinefreddurgan
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Is consciousness the worst disease of all?
    #4278669 - 06/10/05 04:49 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I mean..what has it given us? Our science? Our medicine? I'm basically basing my comparison on humans vs. all else. No other animals WANT. No other animals have jealousy or self-loathing or anger (maybe?) or any of this bullshit that humans deal with. And our science takes us closer and closer to nowhere. Never closer to happiness. Never closer to answers (maybe?..rebuttal?)

What has consciousness given us that man kind (or what we were just before we gained consciousness) would be WORSE WITHOUT?

Consciousness..the greatest cosmic joke of all time. Wish I was a cat.

SEE a cat would never say that. Ever. Or a fish, or a sloth. Or an elk. Wouldn't even think it, if they can even think at all, which I doubt.


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


Edited by freddurgan (06/10/05 04:50 AM)


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4278717 - 06/10/05 05:10 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Considering how consciousness is present in every aspect of the universe, I think you are fucking insane. :lol:

No, seriously. Perhaps you do not know what consciousness is, and you are confusing the term with something like a complex self identity, or something.

It is also amazing that you think animals are not capable of thought. Every animal that I can think of (;)) undergoes some sort of basic thought process.

In the end, the fact that we have a higher level of consciousness than most anything that we relate to is not what is to blame for the "negative" ways in which we have used that consciousness.

Your post just seems to be an emotional rant with no real basis in true observation, evidence, or understanding. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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InvisiblePhobos
Registered: 10/15/00
Posts: 435
Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4279181 - 06/10/05 11:22 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

My friend, ask a leading scientist what "consciousness" is, and he'll stumble.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: Phobos]
    #4279191 - 06/10/05 11:27 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Phobos said:
My friend, ask a leading scientist what "consciousness" is, and he'll stumble.




Apparently the disease he is inflicted with is destroying his ability to control muscle movement? :lol:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4279286 - 06/10/05 11:52 AM (11 years, 9 months ago)

To elaborate on Fireworks' comments... I also believe that what you are talking about is better described as a complex self identity.

The complex self identity and knowledge-based cognitive thinking systems that have developed in man are paradoxical in value. It is both a curse and a blessing.

When you are a child, you are carefree... children are very much like animals in the sense that they have not fully developed their ego yet.

The ego is a NECESSICITY for human survival and development in the world we're faced with. It is a safety device, designed to protect us during development.

During a transitional period, this ego comes to be known as a curse, because we identify fully with it. We believe we are the ego... we believe we are our cognitive thinking systems. In a sense, we are trapped inside our own minds.

However, through the process of thinking (therefore utilizing the benefits of this so-called "curse" to overcome said "curse", paradoxically) there comes a time when every person needs to realize that this form of protection and safety hinder the possibility of fully embracing the experience of life.

This is when a door opens. This is when one comes to a realization that it was actually cognitive thought and the ego that caused the suffering they've experienced in the first place.

Then begins the next long leg of the journey: the process of reprogramming yourself so that the mind is recognized as a tool at our disposal, instead of recognizing the mind as "me".

Cognitive thinking is a double-edged sword. It has great power to cause both self-suffering and freedom. The suffering is necessary to understand the versatility that is offered. Through egoic suffering, we open the door to the realization that we have a choice of how we react internally to external events.

Once this versatility of the mind is understood, one is freed from the self-imposed limitations that were generated only by the beliefs that one developed during a time when they falsely identified with the cognitive thinking systems.

Finally, this is where the real positive aspects of cognitive thinking come out... because this is when you're capable of fully embracing the usefulness of the mind, without being chained to it (through self-identification.) in times when cognitive thought is not useful or necessary.

...!

That was a mouthful... I'm not going to re-read it, because I'm at work... so hopefully it's not too confusing or self-contradictory...  :grin:


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4279349 - 06/10/05 12:04 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

What has it given us?

It has given us.  :thumbup:  :wink:


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Mr. Dogma Free
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Registered: 10/31/04
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #4279379 - 06/10/05 12:11 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I'm at work

Well, get back to work and stop talking on the Internet, mang!  :blush:

Good to see ya tho JC!  :heart: 

"Cognitive thinking is a double-edged sword.  It has the power to cause both self suffering and freedom"

Amen brother and the choice is not always easy or obvious although when you put it like that it would seem like it should be an easy choice.


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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OfflineJacquesCousteau
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4279389 - 06/10/05 12:12 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Whoops. (DP!)


Edited by JacquesCousteau (06/10/05 01:48 PM)


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #4279513 - 06/10/05 12:38 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

JacquesCousteau said:
To That was a mouthful... I'm not going to re-read it, because I'm at work...




Well, you technically never said anything about not re-posting it... :lol:

:wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Registered: 04/08/04
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4279927 - 06/10/05 02:28 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

this smearing together of living moments and memories, this subunit of creation and creativity, this streaming consciousness also happens in cats and dogs and other creatures to greater and lesser extents.

we use hands and we use language, and we use what we made with hands and language as content and as foundations for our lives, but that smear of consciousness is not unique to us.

Only the degree of complexity that we have embraced with it is more elaborate and entangled than what the animals tend to live with.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4280072 - 06/10/05 03:12 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Those are good questions to ask Fredruggen! So what if you were moved by emotion (energy in motion) to ask and post them.

Neglecting the emotional beingness of ourselves is the reason science and modern medicine doesn't help us with the basics of living a content and fullfilling empowered life.

You may get some insight of your own to those questions in the last reply I did in the "emotion not so good post".

If you plan to get into neuro science, everything I wrote there can help serve you as pioneer in that field.

More have to bring the wholistic body into it. Many are now and , we still need many more.

One of these days science med has to "make the connection" and start studying how energy moves us (emotion) is related to the chemical reactions of the brain and body related to our over all health and well being.

Good post! And the stuff people wrote about our creating ego identities where as animals don't answers a lot of your questions too.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4280416 - 06/10/05 04:41 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

Well when I wrote this I was indeed thinking of "consciousness" along the lines of "intense self-absorbed egocentric thinking with an awareness of awareness that extends into extreme, depersonalizing abstraction"

That was an off-the-cuff definition there but I liked it.


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


Edited by freddurgan (06/10/05 06:13 PM)


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OfflineTiCal
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4280430 - 06/10/05 04:45 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

I think consciousness is just a part of our soul or inner being, whatever you wanna call it. Maybe a downside of having a soul IS consciousness for some humans.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Is consciousness the worst disease of all? [Re: freddurgan]
    #4280452 - 06/10/05 04:51 PM (11 years, 9 months ago)

a sense of humour?


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