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Offlinealphaone
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New draconian antidrug laws in US
    #4258907 - 06/05/05 09:04 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Any thoughs on this new extremely restrictive legislation?

http://talkleft.com/new_archives/010719.html

short summary:

Quote:


H.R. 1528, Defending America's Most Vulnerable: Safe Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005, is one of the worst drug war bills that Congress has ever considered.

Among other things, HR 1528:

--Virtually eliminates the ability of federal judges to give sentences below the minimum sentence recommended by federal sentencing guidelines, essentially creating a mandatory minimum sentence for every federal offense (including both drug and non-drug offenses).


--Expands the federal ?three strikes and you?re out? law to include new offenses, including mandating life imprisonment (with no possibility of parole) for anyone convicted a third time under the RAVE Act.


--Mandates a 10-year minimum sentence for anyone 21 or older that gives marijuana or others drugs to someone under 18 (i.e. a 21 year old college students gives a joint to his 17-year old brother). A second offense would be life in prison.


--Expands what is considered to be a ?drug-free? school zone to include almost any place in an urban area, and increases penalties for selling or distributing drugs in that area. (The result will be enhanced penalties for people in inner cities, while people in rural and suburban areas get less time for the same offense).


--Mandates a 5-year minimum sentence for any person that commits a drug trafficking offense near the presence of a person under 18 or in a place where such person resides for any period of time. The sentence is 10 years if they are parent. (I.e. a mother that sells her neighbor a joint will get a 10-year minimum sentence, even if her kids were at school at the time).


--Creates a new offense for persons who witness or learn about certain drug offenses that fail to report the drug offender to the police within 24 hours or fail to provide full assistance to the police in tracking and prosecuting the offender. Offenses that would get someone a 2-year minimum sentence, including failing to report a neighbor that is storing or selling drugs when that neighbor has kids, failing to report anyone that gives a joint to someone under the age of 21, and failing to report a college student that is selling marijuana on a college campus.


--Mandates a 5-year minimum sentence for any person that offers, solicits, encourages, or induces a person enrolled in drug treatment, or previously enrolled in drug treatment, to purchase, possess or receive drugs.


--Makes it a federal crime to provide "drug paraphernalia" to anyone. While the goal is to make it a crime - punishable by up to three years in prison - to give someone a bong as a birthday present, it would also make it a federal crime to provide someone with sterile syringes (except where it is explicitly authorized by local or state law). If enacted, it would essentially criminalize many needle exchange programs.





Edited by alphaone (06/05/05 02:09 PM)


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: alphaone]
    #4259890 - 06/05/05 02:48 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

there have already been several threads on this bill...and either way its a done deal..so theres no real point in making such posts...


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: alphaone]
    #4261391 - 06/05/05 10:26 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

This bill seems pretty outrageous.


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Invisiblemoog
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4261636 - 06/05/05 11:21 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

done deal as in it's already passed or what? 'done deal' how?


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: moog]
    #4261694 - 06/05/05 11:36 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

moog said:
done deal as in it's already passed or what? 'done deal' how?



"Done deal" as in Anna thinks everyone in America is a neocon.


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Invisiblemoog
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4261703 - 06/05/05 11:37 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

oh..  :shiftyeyes:


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4261943 - 06/06/05 12:37 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Mm... Canada. :smile:


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: moog]
    #4262621 - 06/06/05 04:51 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

moog said:
done deal as in it's already passed or what? 'done deal' how?




no..it hasnt passed yet...the sun hasnt come out in my neck-o-the woods as im typing this either..but it will..just as surely as HR-1528 will pass...if it doesnt make it through congress as it is..then it will be piggybacked onto a war-funding bill...either way..your wasting your breath...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4262627 - 06/06/05 05:01 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
Quote:

moog said:
done deal as in it's already passed or what? 'done deal' how?



"Done deal" as in Anna thinks everyone in America is a neocon.




and i would by no means be too far off the mark with respect to drugs either...the DEA claims that 93% support the drug war..and while i dont believe that..the ballpark figure still hangs at 80-90%...no..its not everyone in america..but its close enough...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: alphaone]
    #4262677 - 06/06/05 07:44 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Wow. Every single of these examples are injustices that make baby jesus cry.

Quote:

--Virtually eliminates the ability of federal judges to give sentences below the minimum sentence recommended by federal sentencing guidelines, essentially creating a mandatory minimum sentence for every federal offense (including both drug and non-drug offenses).




This one beats them all though. The job of a judge is to administer fitting justice, just like a tailor's job is to make you a fitting attire. This basically reduces judges to the predecessor of the Sentencing Machine.

A judge can take into account that the young mother stashed the dope for a friend because she had to feed her child with the $100 she'd get for it. The Sentencing Machine will give her life imprisonment for posession of 2 oz of cocaine in the presence of an infant in a school zone.
:mad:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4263133 - 06/06/05 12:39 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Annapurna1 said:
and i would by no means be too far off the mark with respect to drugs either...the DEA claims that 93% support the drug war..and while i dont believe that..the ballpark figure still hangs at 80-90%...no..its not everyone in america..but its close enough...



The "drug war" is a very broad term. There are many people who support the "drug war" but believe marijuana should be legalized or decriminalized. There are also many who have their limits to their support of the drug war. Let's face it: few people wish to see meth or cocaine legal. At the same time, however, many of the same people have a problem with restrictive regulations like the RAVE Act. It's not all black-and-white for everyone.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4263389 - 06/06/05 02:11 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

im glad that you mentioned the RAVE act..because congress actually rejected the RAVE act twice before it was piggybacked onto the amber alert bill...similarly..if congress rebukes HR-1528..it will subsequently be attached to a bill which cannot be debated...and this was also the case the REAL-ID act...

and BTW..meth and coke are legal for medical uses...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


Edited by Annapurna1 (06/06/05 04:36 PM)


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4264761 - 06/06/05 08:05 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If enough states oppose the bills, and send their senators, they can make a case for congress cant they? Then they can change the federal law, to reduce "minimum" punishments.

But who knows, federal courts just banned medical marijuana for patients that have presriptions from a doctor.


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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Zero7a1]
    #4264795 - 06/06/05 08:16 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

yes and no..as witness the RAVE act...the RAVE act was open to debate (and subsequent defeat)..but not the amber alert act...


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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Annapurna1]
    #4264848 - 06/06/05 08:29 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

In my personal opiniion, the whole Drug war is nothing but a disguise for the cooperation of drug companies and those who hold positions in US government.

Its insane to think about how many lobbyists there are for insurance, as well as drug and pharmaceutical companies!

Eventually, the social situation regarding the prison and jail facilities will outweigh its benefits for the regular citizen... hopefully they will reaize that we should be putting child molesters in prison, and not stoned ravers... or people with glaucoma.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Zero7a1]
    #4266325 - 06/07/05 02:18 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If I was into conspiracy theories I might point out that the guys who benefit most from the war on drugs (besides police and prison guards) are drug dealers. The bad ones. As long as their product is black market they can make whatever ridiculous markup they want, pay no taxes, and cut drugs with other nasty stuff like caffience and meth.


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InvisibleSoopaX
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #4266359 - 06/07/05 02:28 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yea, the big profiteers of the drug war are the government and the drug dealers. The government has a real reason to keep the drug war going, so they don't mind tossing tons of money at it. The drug dealers, large cartels and such, know that legalization will cut their profits drastically, so they don't spend money to promote legalization. One side spends (our) money to keep the product illegal and the other side is benefiting from the status of the substances. Noone really has the money to put behind legalization efforts. I think that a benefit concert of all pro-pot bands would be great. They could all play a benefit concert on the Mall in DC, a five day concert so that the Senators and Congressmen would get the full effect. Ask for donations and signatures, and just for a large group of people to get together and make their message heard. I think that the news would cover a large event such as this with 10-20 large headlining bands.


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InvisibleZero7a1
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Re: New draconian antidrug laws in US [Re: SoopaX]
    #4266641 - 06/07/05 04:49 AM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Yall are both very right. That is the situation as it stands in reality, outside of the citizens.

But why is it so hard, for citizens, patients, doctors, to be refused this therapy, or this naturally occuring substance?

This isnt a conspiracy theory, but just a matter of fact. Before the FDA was called the FDA, they made these laws against narcotice to "protect" consumers from "un verified" means. So things like aspirin could be produced legally and to help citizens in a way, but also block others who didnt have the seal of approval.

Its actually a crime to sell drugsg also because it isnt being taxed, and therefore it become illegal in that regard.

No one has just figured out the correct medium between regulation, distribution and taxation. Besides, our infrastructure and beauracracy limits i think the ammount of real credit this issue should be given, both in thought and action by the government, thats not including the stuck in the rut conservatives.

If the governemnt was so worried about high crime rates, why not get rid of the drug dealers and the propogaters of societal mis-fit war? I dont think anyone here would argue the current way of dealing with personal users who dont harm anyone are severely over the line, and contribute to the stagnation of our society, and not to the benefit of.

On both an economical and ethical standpoint.

Neither of them do the justice that should be done.


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