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Offlineytse
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Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure)
    #4232943 - 05/29/05 11:54 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

The following is a report of a harmala extraction from passion flower. (written originally for erowid experiences)
Unfortunately the outcome is not very promising.


Passiflora species contain some alkaloids, mainly the beta carbolines : harmine and harmaline in low concentration . Having an approximately 8 sq.m fence covered with passiflora cerulea I was taking serious thoughts on making an extraction from the plant.

I made some bibliographic search as long as Internet searches.
The whole subject was discussed in the www.paterasprod.org forum.
According to TiHKAL 300mg of harmala alkaloids are required for the full experience.
According to many documents (Gracie + Zarkov for example) passiflora contains approximately 0.075% Harmala alkaloids. So in order to obtain 300mg there are required 300mg/0.00075=400gr. Taking into account that there is some loss due to the extraction process, I finally used 600gr of dry foliage.

I decided to do the acid-base extraction using vinegar. The same procedure has been followed effectually by many people in order to extract the same alkaloids from Perganum Harmala seeds.

The process briefly:

-I grinded the dry foliage
-I added 6L of vinegar
-I heated the mix below boiling temperature and kept stirring for about 24 hours
-I filtered the mix and kept the liquid
(- I could have repeated the 4 last steps using the solids after the filtration but I didn?t have the patience and the vinegar needed)
-I condensed the liquid through evaporation (heating & air circulation)

The final volume of the condensed liquid was 0.6L , very dark and viscous. It had a characteristic sweet scent reminding me of cherry liquor. After trying a small sip ,I found out that it was bitter enough.

After finishing the whole process I bottled the liquid and putted it in the fridge and let it there overnight.

The whole process was not easy at all owning to the heroic volumes.

The experience:

I had decided to drink it the next morning without drinking or eating anything else.
The day before I had avoided foods high in tyramine.
After having my first swig I realized how horrible was its taste. The taste was really awful. I can stand many a bad taste but standing this was impossible. I bearded this out after having one more swig. I forced my self to drink once more and I decided that I should go on and condense once more.

While starting the second condense ,I felt that something black and sticky was heading to my stomach. Twenty minutes latter ,I was feeling my stomach turning.
For the next 3 hours I had an awful stomachache and l kept on throwing up on the crapper. I didn?t really have much to throw up. It was just the black, sticky thing mixed up with my liquids. I think that drinking some water with sugar made me be on the mend.

I didn?t notice any psycho-effects from the harmala alkaloids but I hadn?t drink enough after all.

The experiment was cancelled and the remaining liquid thrown away to the sump. Maybe a second process with salt and low temperatures could make a purer Harmala extraction which wouldn?t cause nausea, but I really wasn?t in the mood of trying it.


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Offlineesin
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: ytse]
    #4233036 - 05/29/05 12:40 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

That is not an acid-base extraction. It's a simple acidic extract.

Passiflora is a very weak source of harmala alkaloids anyway, that's probably the reason why you didn't feel substancial effects.

Well, next time do the same acidic extract (with 1 part water to 1 part vinegar), filter thorougly or decant. Heat it to a boil and than add 10g of NaCl for each 100ml of the acidic extract. Let it sit at room temp for 24-48hrs. Than stick it in the fridge and let it sit there for another 24-48hrs.

Crystals will collect on the sides and bottom. Filter with coffee filter and let it dry well. You have relatively pure chem-free harmine and harmaline, which you can eat, insufflate or turn to freebase and smoke. Insufflating or smoking causes short-lived MAOI effects, which are very convenient for short trips such as vaporized or insufflated DMT.


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Offlineesin
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: ytse]
    #4233050 - 05/29/05 12:45 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

My dad has a huge passion flower vine too. I use the blooms for a tea or as an inert smoke to provide ashes for other endeavours. But i never got any substancial effects from it.

Rue is the prolly the cheapest ethno product anyway.


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Offlineytse
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: esin]
    #4233200 - 05/29/05 01:48 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Well, I didn?t have substantial effects because I didn?t manage to drink all of the liquid.
The harmala alkaloids contained in the liquid should be enough according to my calculations.

I didn?t purify it further because I had already lost my lust. I had already decided that passionflower as a harmala source doesn?t worth the effort.

Apart from that it proved that it contains some other substances with ?unpleasant effects?

So , at the end of the day it isn?t valuable as a harmala source!
But I thought it would be good to documentate (and post) somewhere the above experience.


--------------------
For unrestricted use, the West has permitted alcohol and tobacco;
all other chemical Doors in the Wall are labeled Dope,
and their unauthorized takers are Fiends.

Aldous Huxley (1894-1963)


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Offlinepod3
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- [Re: ytse]
    #4265910 - 06/07/05 12:26 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 01:13 PM)


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OfflinePsiloman
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: pod3]
    #4268844 - 06/07/05 07:08 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

"I am assuming that the DMT vaporizes at what would be a high temp for a tobacco pipe. Several long draughts of air were sucked into the cheeks before I got that bitter taste, which I drew deeper into my lungs."

Dont you mean Beta carbolines?


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Offlinepod3
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- [Re: Psiloman]
    #4275939 - 06/09/05 02:35 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 01:12 PM)


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Offlineytse
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: pod3]
    #4276048 - 06/09/05 03:00 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

It was my understanding that harmine, betacarbolines, and DMT are all present in different proportions in any plant which contains any of these chemicals, as though they existed naturally in different stages of the same synthesis. Probably, one of our resident, organic chemists can be more specific?




This plant does not contain DMT . ( It may contain traces of DMT )
DMT could be an intermediate product but its amount should be really small!


--------------------
For unrestricted use, the West has permitted alcohol and tobacco;
all other chemical Doors in the Wall are labeled Dope,
and their unauthorized takers are Fiends.

Aldous Huxley (1894-1963)


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Offlineesin
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: pod3]
    #4276081 - 06/09/05 03:12 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Beside that N,N-DMT has a quite low boiling point. It would be the first thing to come in the smoke, not the last.

I'd say it was some sort of potent betacarboline that caused your experience.


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OfflineChemical_Bliss
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: esin]
    #4276227 - 06/09/05 03:48 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Can anyone point me in the direction of a good source for passiflora seeds? I`ve been craving one of these plants for some time now.


--------------------
'divine moments of truth, total and utter cosmic stuff...'
'be here now... i love everybody'


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Offlineytse
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Re: Harmala extraction bioassay from passionflower (failure) [Re: Chemical_Bliss]
    #4278550 - 06/10/05 04:14 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Passiflora plants can be found easily at nurseries.
The only problem is that, in most of the cases there is passiflora cerulea and not passiflora incarnata. Incarnata is preferable from alkaloid point of view! (There are pictures of both in erowid)

As for seeds, I don?t know, sorry.


--------------------
For unrestricted use, the West has permitted alcohol and tobacco;
all other chemical Doors in the Wall are labeled Dope,
and their unauthorized takers are Fiends.

Aldous Huxley (1894-1963)


κατσίκα


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Offlinepod3
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- [Re: ytse]
    #4291343 - 06/13/05 03:27 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

-


Edited by pod3 (10/26/06 01:12 PM)


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Ethnobotanical Garden

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