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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
PM from Racquetball forum on MM
    #4225442 - 05/27/05 05:34 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Pertaining to Medical Marijuana for sports pain:

I left my "ancedote" about my sister out of your first thread about pot because you asked a specific question that pertained to yourself...and I respected that and answered accordingly.

Dissecting my sisters fate is rude. Using it to push your agenda offends me greatly. I'll be putting you on ignore and sadly I certainly won't be wishing you well. If the thread wasn't locked I'd have happily ripped you a new one on there...

Drugs aren't a game, they're a loaded weapon that causes damage despite what you believe. YOU may not be feeling like a criminal, but I think if you look backward on the chain of custody that leads to that baggie you'll find it covered with blood at many points. I really don't give a fuck if alcohol is bloody too, btw, or if aspirin gives you stomach cancer...delude yourself all you wish but learn to leave some things alone.

Q


Thought you should see the mindset that we are up against. When emotions run high, reason shuts down. This guy's sister left his parents with two kids and a dead-beat husband and it is ALL the fault of cannabis.

And now it is my fault because I pointed out his logical errors. This is called "transference" wherein one takes one's helpless anger and finds someone new to dump on rather than examine his family's choices. Yup folks, cannabis got her pregnant, made her choose a jerk for a husband and made her become an irresponsible adult. He could not deal with the real facts, and now I am his enemy.

BTW, please check your herb for blood...


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineMushmonkey
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4225517 - 05/27/05 06:25 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

bad cannibis! no cookie!


--------------------
i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.


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Offlineduster
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Registered: 07/20/04
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #4225549 - 05/27/05 06:52 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

i wish killing didnt have all that illegal/guilt trip stuff after you do it or i'd have killed alot of people like that one >:]


--------------------
"Life is created out of the seeking of knowledge."


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Offlineduster
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: duster]
    #4225552 - 05/27/05 06:55 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I think it's quite funny how the mods on that board locked the threads you created saying to stay on topic with RB and yet right above and below it there's threads having nothing to do with rb... heh


--------------------
"Life is created out of the seeking of knowledge."


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OfflineGomp
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: duster]
    #4225588 - 05/27/05 08:06 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

lol


--------------------


--------------------
Disclaimer!?


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
Loc: underbelly
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4225652 - 05/27/05 09:19 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Very sad indeed. Glad you were willing to engage the debate though. Says much about you. :laugh: :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineAlan Stone
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Registered: 11/23/02
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4226000 - 05/27/05 12:14 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

He does have one implicit point though: "You can handle drugs, but not everyone can".

I'd not opt for legalising drugs at a certain age (16, 18, 21, whatever), but I'd rather like to see an EULA for anyone using drugs, looking something like this:

1) You apply for a "weed license"
2) You get some theoretical background (i.e. what are the effects, what is the neurochemical effect, what are the risks, where are you allowed to toke up, etc)
3) Signing an agreement.

This agreement would entail that you recognise the full risks of that particular drug, and that you are willing to pay for the treatment of any detrimental effects yourself (behaviour therapy, medical treatment, etc). That is the basis of oldskool liberalism, is it not? Responsibility?

The license in turn would allow you to buy drugs directly from the government. Why the government? Several reasons:

1) Quality control
2) Easier to keep statistics
3) Price control (preferrably the same cost as, say, vegetables for weed)
4) VAT on drugs, so the government itself benefits from the drug trade. Money is always a good persuasive for governments.

This of course does require a less... let's say biased government.


--------------------
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

- Aristotle


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Alan Stone]
    #4226277 - 05/27/05 02:01 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Alan Stone said:


I'd not opt for legalising drugs at a certain age (16, 18, 21, whatever), but I'd rather like to see an EULA for anyone using drugs, looking something like this:

1) You apply for a "weed license"
2) You get some theoretical background (i.e. what are the effects, what is the neurochemical effect, what are the risks, where are you allowed to toke up, etc)
3) Signing an agreement.

This agreement would entail that you recognise the full risks of that particular drug, and that you are willing to pay for the treatment of any detrimental effects yourself (behaviour therapy, medical treatment, etc). That is the basis of oldskool liberalism, is it not? Responsibility?

The license in turn would allow you to buy drugs directly from the government. Why the government? Several reasons:

1) Quality control
2) Easier to keep statistics
3) Price control (preferrably the same cost as, say, vegetables for weed)
4) VAT on drugs, so the government itself benefits from the drug trade. Money is always a good persuasive for governments.

This of course does require a less... let's say biased government.





Alan Stone for President! :thumbup:




--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Registered: 01/01/05
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4226567 - 05/27/05 02:59 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
BTW, please check your herb for blood...



I thought that weed last night tasted funny.


--------------------


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OfflinePsiloman
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4227855 - 05/27/05 09:02 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
Pertaining to Medical Marijuana for sports pain:

I left my "ancedote" about my sister out of your first thread about pot because you asked a specific question that pertained to yourself...and I respected that and answered accordingly.

Dissecting my sisters fate is rude.  Using it to push your agenda offends me greatly.  I'll be putting you on ignore and sadly I certainly won't be wishing you well.  If the thread wasn't locked I'd have happily ripped you a new one on there...

Drugs aren't a game, they're a loaded weapon that causes damage despite what you believe.  YOU may not be feeling like a criminal, but I think if you look backward on the chain of custody that leads to that baggie you'll find it covered with blood at many points.  I really don't give a fuck if alcohol is bloody too, btw, or if aspirin gives you stomach cancer...delude yourself all you wish but learn to leave some things alone. 

Q


Thought you should see the mindset that we are up against. When emotions run high, reason shuts down. This guy's sister left his parents with two kids and a dead-beat husband and it is ALL the fault of cannabis.

And now it is my fault because I pointed out his logical errors. This is called "transference" wherein one takes one's helpless anger and finds someone new to dump on rather than examine his family's choices. Yup folks, cannabis got her pregnant, made her choose a jerk for a husband and made her become an irresponsible adult. He could not deal with the real facts, and now I am his enemy.

BTW, please check your herb for blood...




Hehe,Swami...

From my rather limited experience on this planet i have come to the conclusion that people rarely listen to logic.Thats because when emotion fights with logic,emotion always win...No matter what evidence you put forth,no matter what speech you give this person he is "better off" in his own world thinking that "cannabis was the downfall of his sister".Its easier to blame an object,objects dont talk back (except rare cases :laugh: ). So he sleeps ok at night thinking that "Marijuana is bad mmmmkay?" (hey,its alreaady a discredited substance by many!) and thinking that the blame is not at his sisters back.

Also i believe that there is something like a scale of "graveness" of mistakes...Consequences of misjuding and dropping an egg on the floor are lesser of misjudging and touching a live wire for example.Psychoactives tend to be one of those issues that people with a tendency to "fuck up" WILL fuck up. They seems somehow to be able to highlight the person's drawbacks as if they are indicators "Apply 3 grams of X drug on the subject and notice the how his irresponsibility areas stain bright red and how his happy-go-lucky-till-stupid areas flash brightly yellow". They simply require responsibility ,that of an adult,but the oxymoron is that few adults have "adult responsibility". I think that the drugs just hastened a proccess in his sister's life that could happen one way or another.

On a side note : Have you noticed that if one supports a view like "cannabis is bad" noone will question him or ask him for evidence whereas if someone opposes a neutral or positive argument for this matter he/she has got a lot of explaining to do? Well,welcome to the notion of "Socially accepted ideas" where one is not questioned if he follows them!

On logic:

I have spoken using only logic at numerous occasions ,even at the point of giving a small speech to some people.These was done on many occasions and for a multitude of matters from substance abuse and its effects to personal matters unrelated to substances...Most of the time this pattern ensues : I talk,the other person "listens" but does not follow my thoroughly documented advice (yeah,im a geek with reasoning),a month or two passes and the person i gave advice to and was ignored says to me "Well,you were right after all"

First time i was confused: "Ummm....why didnt he/she follow my advice after all my analysis?"

Next i felt anger : "well,fuck that,would i spend time overanalysing it if i thought i was wrong?!?!?"

After the 50th or so time i started slowly and steadily to grasp the meaning:

1) Emotion vs Logic = 1-0 (99% of the time)
2)Let people make mistakes ,maybe you can see better than them at some matters maybe they can see better than you in others.Anyway let em do it their way worst thing that they can tell you is "You were right" (just hold back the "i told you so" because this can make you even more irrate for having to say it)
3)Somehow,life/human relations/whatever/etc etc does not obey the rules of Logic.Sometimes it seems as if its a maarathon for the most logically detached ideas...Sit back,sip a martini (with olive please!) and enjoy it

Well,thats my three axioms so far ,hope you like it. People simply WONT listen to reason!


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Offlinefreddurgan
Techgnostic
Male

Registered: 01/11/04
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4228808 - 05/28/05 02:06 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Swami said:
I really don't give a fuck if alcohol is bloody too, btw, or if aspirin gives you stomach cancer...delude yourself all you wish but learn to leave some things alone.

Q







Incredible..he just basically cancelled everything he said right there.


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: freddurgan]
    #4229151 - 05/28/05 04:15 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Also note his use of the phrase "pushing your agenda". My agenda is "Please don't jail me for seeking pain relief". Seems he must use incorrect and emotionally charged words to try to make his point.

BTW, I apologized to him about his sister just to see his response. Making an enemy doesn't help our cause even if I am "right".


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineTrippinNinjaBuddha
ShroominSamurai
Registered: 04/11/04
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: Swami]
    #4229729 - 05/28/05 01:12 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

So, how do we go about undoing the damage of the deeply rooted propaganda system and social conditioning that our government propogates?  Ideas?  I've been doing it at an individual level, as I'm sure all of you have, but it is slow and inefficient.

Swami, take it to their prohibitionist asses!  :thumbup:


--------------------
Jumped in a river, what did I see?
Black eyed angels swimming with me
Moon full of stars and astral cars, all the figures I used to see
All my lovers were there with me
All my past and all my futures
We went to heaven in a little rowboat
There was nothing to fear and nothing to doubt


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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
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Loc: underbelly
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: TrippinNinjaBuddha]
    #4229742 - 05/28/05 01:18 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

On the individual level may seem slow and inefficient, but I think it is what works best. Evolution may seem slow and inefficient but it gets the job done. :grin: :heart:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: TrippinNinjaBuddha]
    #4230241 - 05/28/05 04:28 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

So, how do we go about undoing the damage of the deeply rooted propaganda system and social conditioning that our government propogates?

I was thinking of doing an online test on Drug History and other facts (or book). If you read the entire racquertball thread, notice that NOT ONE answered my simple, direct questions.

If a prohibitionist honestly took my proposed quiz, he would be hard-pressed to maintain his/her stance or would at least be forced to re-evaluate his/her position.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblewandrnshaman
old hand
Registered: 09/21/03
Posts: 1,196
Loc: Pinellas Co, FL
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM *DELETED* [Re: Swami]
    #4230628 - 05/28/05 06:22 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Post deleted by wandrnshaman

Reason for deletion: .



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Invisiblewandrnshaman
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Registered: 09/21/03
Posts: 1,196
Loc: Pinellas Co, FL
Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM *DELETED* [Re: wandrnshaman]
    #4230637 - 05/28/05 06:25 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Post deleted by wandrnshaman

Reason for deletion: .



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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: wandrnshaman]
    #4230870 - 05/28/05 07:29 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

How does a rigid mindset and view of the world contrary to facts not fit into philosophy?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Invisiblewandrnshaman
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM *DELETED* [Re: Swami]
    #4230908 - 05/28/05 07:40 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Post deleted by wandrnshaman

Reason for deletion: .



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InvisibleLunarEclipse
Mr. Dogma Free
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Registered: 10/31/04
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Re: PM from Racquetball forum on MM [Re: wandrnshaman]
    #4230980 - 05/28/05 08:09 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Can we change the name from S&P to "Maybe everyone should just post here?"

I nominate wandrnshaman and Swami as moderators for this new forum.

Any seconds?


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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