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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Maybe you all can help me with something
    #4207472 - 05/22/05 07:41 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I have been wanting to write a book on raising respectful and considerate, compassionate, non violent, intelligent, creative, critical thinking children who listen well.

For those of you who don't know, I have an 8 year old daughter and so far so awesome.

I have a philosophy of my own I developed over many years of personal study and research. Mostly, it is based on what I would call, uncommon common sense.

Every time I go to work on the book, I hit road blocks and stop. I will throw out the items that stop me in my tracks and I am asking if any of you can help me overcome them or do you think I should just scrap the idea once and for all.

1.) There are already many books out there. Lots of "like" competition. For that reason alone, I may not get published. I might be wasting my time.

2.) The philosophy requires that you follow it ALL. If a reader says , "well, I agree with 3/4 of it and will do that, but not the other 1/4" they can fuck up.....like baking a cake without the flour. You can't leave any of the ingredients out and expect to get the results on the box cover.

I don't know if I want to be "indirectly" responsible for that.

3.) I have issues with immediate gratification. I may not see any results from the work spent on the book let alone if I do, they may be a year or two off until publication. This makes it hard for me to keep motivated.

4.) THIS is the biggest one. I live in a bubble of heaven on earth and in the space I like to be in. I only get motivated when I see some kid being raised in manors that are upsetting to me, That is lousy energy to be motivated by.

Tied in with that is this. To get cooking, I have to start thinking of all the old school parenting techniques the book is meant to "rewrite". When I think of them, I get upset again and start writing from that energy.

I also just don't want to be brought into that energy PERIOD!

I do not know how to overcome that. Parenting is the most sensitive subject for a parent and I want to be sensitive to that. I don't want my tone to come off judgmental.  I believe parents do the best they can with what they know.

My greatest concern is offending someone who already has older children who raised them very contrary to the books teachings. I do not want to be the trigger pull for some parent to be thinking they have been or are a bad parent.

They tend to get offended and defensive Hot and Fast when their parenting skills are put on the table.

5) I am a lousy writer. You guys read my stuff. I'm lousy at composition, am the queen of run on sentences and sometimes write in complex thought patterns I think in. I also tend to to bust off into thought streams when I get inspired and then BLOW the composition and over all flow of the whole book.

SO YES, I know stuff that works well in practice and have been saying I want to write a book on it. Those are the reason why I haven't.

6.) The methods take time, energy, dedication and patience. I think in today's nutso busy stressed out world, people will think I am living in fantasy land............well I am living in a realized one, but, it may be unrealistic for many to give those qualities in abundance or they may just think its unrealistic for them too and write it off.

7) Also definitely have a concern of major success issues. Don't know if I want to take on more to manage "if" it were to get published and do really well.

Can all these concerns be overcome and how OR should I just scrap the idea once and for all?

I appreciate the time it took to read through this and any replies to come. Thank you! :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207508 - 05/22/05 07:55 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I have always despised books about how to raise children. Each child is unique, there is no "right" way to raise a child which is true for all children. every parent fears they suck at parenting, or have done something wrong, but all those "wrong" things you did were actually healthy for the child. Parents too often think they are making a person, or molding who they will be..... a child is a person and every experience they have is a part of them.

I know people who had crack whores for moms, whose biological father came out of the closet then committed suicide and turned out to be a much stronger and cooler person than the slobs that catholic soccer moms churn out by the dozens.

You shouldnt be getting blueprints to raise your child from a book anyway.

I know this is counteractive to what you probably wanted to hear to get you motivated.


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207511 - 05/22/05 07:56 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

The problem is that there is not any one perfect method. My method is very traditional. I know that you would not agree with many of my methods or I yours. I have 3 children who are in high school. One graduates soon. I have had flawless results using my methods. They all are respectful, nonviolent, intelligent, and extremely talented in various areas. What works for one may not be relevant to another.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207512 - 05/22/05 07:56 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

How about writing a synopsis here on your child raising philosophies and then we can decide.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4207547 - 05/22/05 08:11 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Hue, you already had an idea for a method to use that you have been very pleased with. You wouldn't be the market for such a book.

There are some very frustrated parents out there. I see them struggling with children who won't listen every day. They want to do something, but don't know what and know that whatever they are currently doing is not working for them.

The book would be written for frustrated well meaning parents looking for a new approach.

psilo,

They aren't so much blueprints as you might be thinking. They are very loose. I've dealt with so many different types of children and they are general enough to be effective with all.

It's really not about a "what to do book or how to do it" book. It's more along the lines of what to become aware of when doing what you do as a parent-your way. That's why it falls more under uncommon common sense parenting.

I was looking more for how tos or reasons on overcoming my points or for just a push to scrap it once and for all because I am not the best composed or comprehensive writer.

Lunar, I wouldn't know how to write a synopsis without just writing the book first. I would start elaborating getting into examples, explanations and it would be a 50 page post in no time.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


Edited by gettinjiggywithit (05/22/05 08:17 PM)


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207573 - 05/22/05 08:21 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I don't know. To me, the pride of accomplishment would be enough, but I'm easy to please, really. I think you should press forward and finish it.
Send it in too - you never know; it could be a runaway best seller! But even if you never publish it, at least you can say you once wrote a book. Not many could say that....  :thumbup:


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207597 - 05/22/05 08:35 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

1) I think the number of things out there on parenting _is_ pretty overwhelming but there's only a few that are really popular or remembered, Dr Phil for whatever reason, Dr Spock, Hillary Clinton's thing on the village, I don't know.... noone remembers Raising A Family the Smart Way p. 1964 or Children Are Tomorrows People p. 1978. The point is this is the way the modern world is....every topic from parenting to pointilism to penicilin has been analyzed and published about a thousand ways to sunday. the challenge for parenting authors and every other kind of writer is to produce something new and exciting, and the opportunity is there as much as with anything else a person can do that earns money.

2) Comeon, that's a bs excuse and you know it. If you got a way to raise kids that can help people you share it with the world, even if it's difficult. The CIA doesn't keep the recipe for Lemon Merengue Pie hidden from the world just cause it's difficult and people could screw it up and make a mess. No, the CIA drops bombs on communists and terrorists. And you should drop this bomb, and if there are some incidents of 'collateral damage' then that's just the price of spreading freedom and democracy. See?

3) Hey if you get started, put a decent effort into it for one month, or some period that won't be too much strain, and it turns out it's coming well, that motivates you to continue. And if it isn't coming out well, that's a bummer but at least you tried.

4) you just gotta be careful with what you say then. if you feel inspired to write angry, then edit calm. If you write calm, maybe you should even try edit angry?

5) you seem like a pretty good writer from what you post on the shroomery. you'll never know until you really try so go ahead and really try. you also improve the more you practice, everyone does at some speed.

6) nothing worth doing is ever easy (aka faint heart never won fair lady), if you have any faith in yourself, then you'll make room, and it doesn't have to be a whole afternoon, even just one or two hours, everyday, consistently...

7) I had a girlfriend who gave me this "oh i'm afraid of success" line. Come on now. I don't want to be mean so I'm gonna bite my lips on this one.


you should go for it jigster! if not for yourself, do it for tha shroomery.


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youi was a pig informatnt so you can go fuckyoruselfs


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: question_for_joo]
    #4207657 - 05/22/05 08:59 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

WOW! Now thats what I am talking about. Thanks for that Joo!  My husband pretty much said the same about concern 2. Hearing from 2 different people now helps a lot!

Great point on concern 1). You put it in a way where now I see it more like a creative challenge....that motivates me. True what you said,  look at how many Blue Jean manufacturers are out there? LEVI's don't appeal to everyone. Same goes with writing styles or approaches on the same subject matter.

Yes, I figured I could edit calm. That may take complete rewrite of sections though. Maybe worth it though too.

I have been trying to not write as intense as I used too, thanks for the encouragment on concern 5) Of course I don't fuss over my posts here as much as I would editing a book.  Maybe, my different writing style might be a plus regarding competition for books on te same subject. Didn't think of that until now.

on point 7, its more of a concern about possibly having a lot more to manage. I may have to travel for promotions or book signings or be pressured into writing more books for the publisher because they want career authors not books. If it does well, there may be a lot of demands to be met and I have been dedicating my "career life" to being a MOM not an author.

That replied defintely knocked some stuff loose. I really appreciate it. :hug:

Thanks for your considerate words to Duk:hug:

Thanks everyone who replied.  :hug:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


Edited by gettinjiggywithit (05/22/05 09:04 PM)


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207665 - 05/22/05 09:02 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

I have noted that parents who let their children get out of control tend to dismiss any new idea as futile. I once had a friend who's child would make messes and refuse to clean them up. Spanking did not work, because the child had become desensitized to this treatment. I told him to set the child in a corner face (5 year old) to the wall and tell him when he chooses to clean up the mess he made that he can get up. My friend did this and later reported that it did not work. I asked how long the child sat in the corner. He said about 10 minutes. I asked why so short of a time. He said that any longer was cruel and that it was easier to let the child have his way. Any insinuation that his child could be brought under control was met with doubt. He stated that all adults had this problem, but that most would just not admit it. He said that if I claimed to have well behaved children that I was probably lying because he himself had been out of control as a child and he was normal. Most parents with this problem hold the same futile attitude.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4207901 - 05/22/05 10:09 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

well on the 007 let me just say that if your book happens to become really successful, sells out or whatever is good for books to do. you're not going to serve time or nothing if you just lay low, don't write anymore, don't do anything else. the worst thing that would happen in that case is not making as much money as you could by going out and interviewing and showing up at the 2007 the emmy awards or whatever. you got more urgent questions that need answers first.

as far as a different writing style, absolutely, that's half the battle i think. you just gotta have some character. ok not like the characters in star wars. they are very awful. they say things like "i wish i could just wish away my feelings". you gotta lay out your ideas in a way that makes sense and say it all with character. i mean, i would read a book on parenting by an adult who regularly does psychelics whos got their act together. the "man" don't like that though, so you'd turn away wholesome Martha Stewart types with talk of your doper highjinks, assorted wheelings and dealings with hanging babies from your neck in a white sack, timeouts, dealing with racist influences from modern childrens films, all types of stuff



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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4207919 - 05/22/05 10:13 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

My book would handle it differently however, the parent said that they did try your alternative method to spanking. I think frustrated parents will try anything. What that parent didn't do was follow through with thier word. They failed and said your method didn't work.

Thats what I meant about parents only using one of two ingredients and then blaming the method.

My stuff on prevention pretty much covers a child doing what they are asked to do the first time they are asked. The mehtod is designed to be started from birth on as their are many special considerations for neural pathway development during the 0-3 years if you want to max out the intelligence potential of your child.

The other stuff can be worked in later though. Lets say, a parent of a 5 year old gets my book and they have a child who won't listen when asked to put their toys away.

(The whole book is involved here to support this) I would first ask nicely and use the word please. If they refused or ignored I would stop whatever I was doing and sit on the floor and chat with them about it. The conversation would go something like this in a nice soft tone of voice with maybe some smiles and tickle tweeks.

It was you who brought these toys out here wasn't it? Yes

Only you played with them right? Yes

If someone else asked you to clean up the toys they brought out and played with, do you think it would be fair to you? No

Is it fair then if just I put them away? No

Then it's fair if you put back the toys you brought out and played with isn't it? Yes

I would then explain that it is important and smart to put things away when you are done with them. I would explain that it keeps an area free for the next game to be set up and makes it easier to find the toys again the next time they are played with. It also keeps them from getting lost and broken. I would explain that in this house, we put our toys away when done playing with them.

Finally I would say this. You won't be allowed to play with any other toys until these are put away. I will box up and put away anything I see you playing with until these toys are put away.

If the child refused I would keep my eye out for when he went for another toy. I would remind him of what I said. If he still refused , the next toy he went for would get boxxed up. I would keep doing it until he/she put them away even if I had to box up every toy they had except for what was left on the floor. If it took 3 days it would take 3 days.

That's what I mean by my methods taking time, dedication, energy and patience.

I also advise making the consequence fit the crime as close as possible. In this case, putting away toys means you have toys in places to go get and play with in the first place.

Say you have company coming over in an hour and don't have time to let the child come around on his own, yet you don't want to spoil him and pick them up for him. I would do and say this.

Joey, company is coming over soon and they will be walking in this room. They may step on your toys and break them. Do you want that to happen? No. They may trip and hurt themselves. Do you want that to happen? No. Then it would be a good idea to put them away now right? yes.

If they still refused, my voice would shift into a stern and direct tone. I would say, " Joey, you have two choices here. You can choose to put those toys away now OR you can come with me tomorrow to donate them to a children's charity and you won't get to play with them anymore.

I would follow through.

In your example Hue, the parent blew it because the ultimate thing to be aware of is consistency. If you say you are going to do something, you have to follow through. A kid learns quickly that you mean what you say and will do it and they don't fuck with you. Mine knows I mean what I say because I always follow through.

That is the number one key for raising children who listen.

The second options is a little more forceful to me because it makes the child have to come around on the spot and implies pressure on them and I don't like to do that or be forceful if I don't have too.

I don't want to teach my daughter to be forceful or on the spot demanding with others. Parents like that raise bratty demanding kids like that. They learn it from the parents demanding forceful style.

Giving children choices is a double bonus. It shows you have faith in them to make the desirable choice and gives them a sense of having some power to use so they have nothing to struggle with you over. I don't power struggle with my daughter. I give her the power to make choices with and explain ahead of time, the benefits of one choice and the consequences of the other. How can she struggle with me or get mad at me when she is the one making the choice. Ha Ha.

Hue, you would have had the kid sit until they cleaned. You know that the vital part is follow through with your word. If they sat for an hour that would have been fine with you. That takes patience and time and you spent it to make your point that you are to be listened too.

I gave an example for what I would do and why. The parent reader can come up with their own approach being aware of these key things;

1) be nice when for requesting something. Give them a chance to do the right thing first. Don't bark, order or demand or talk to them like they are bad from the get go. You will only teach them to do that back to you and others when they want something AND you will work at wrecking their self esteem as well.

2) explain why you are asking them to do or not do something in a way that they become agreeable with and can understand.

3) if you have to take it further, offer up choices for what yo are asking and one with a consequence that MOST CLOSELY correlates with the crime. You want them to associate the consequence with the action or they won't learn from it. If you take away their play date at Toms tomorrow instead, that taught them nothing about why we put our toys away when done playing with them. It will just make them think you are mean and unfair and it's not fair to Tom to cancel on him either.

4) If you must and use it sparingly, go into your stern and direct voice. Never yell, as it just puts people off from listening and teaches your child to yell to get their way. Use the stern voice sparingly or it will become ineffective in No time.

5) Follow through with the consequence if that is what it comes down too. Do it in a loving manor. Remember, you are not accepting of the child's behavior, but you are accepting of the child. You may not love what they did, but they must always feel that you love them. Don't without emotional care and affection. The consequence is enough. The idea is for them to learn that what they did or didn't do was unacceptable. You never want them thinking they are bad or not worth your love and a hug.

6) equally vital, give warning of what will happen as a consequence FIRST. Give them a fair chance to first do what you wish for them to do. Parents low on energy and patience just start punishing at the first sign of undesirable behavior without first giving the kid a chance to modify or correct it. You have to give fair warning.

Why you give fair warning is explained in the above. Here is why you don't want to not do that. The kid will grow anxious and on the defence never knowing when the next smiper attack is going to strike in their own home. (between us thats the sort of stuff that gets me upset when I see it and if I kept writing, I would start to shift tone there so I will stop at that one now.)


5) When they come around if they do, praise them for it! Let them learn that positive action gets your attention. You don't want them learning that the way to get your attention is through negative behavior.

Sometimes, from what I see, that is the only time kids get paid attention too, when they are behaving out of control.

So much more I feel I want to add to that. I do want to write this book.

Like their are age considerations to add just to that common problem.

Depending on the age, when they are younger, the adult should help them and show an example for how putting away items goes. Children should be provided places for where things go as well. By ages 3 and 4 and they can start to be asked and expected to do it by themselves depending on the task.

I still have so much more to add to this but I will stop now.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: question_for_joo]
    #4207977 - 05/22/05 10:29 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

That last reply was funny Joo!

I understand what you mean by Creating a character out of myself.

I am a character if you haven't noticed. That is one of my concerns. I know stuff I say in my street voice gets taken the wrong way easily.

I don't know if this is a topic I would get to character edgy with as an author.

I would love to write it in my street voice and I would piss so many people off. Then again, that is what could make it a controversial success to arm and arm with the competition.

I don't use psychedelics as my mind trips well enough all on its own. I'm he shroom less shroom head.

I see what you mean. I wouldn't totally knock Martha Stewart's style. She has reached many millions and amassed a fortune.

What I need to do is best identify the personality style of the well meaning parent who is frustrated and wants to learn new methods and raise awareness of what they are doing as a parent that is failing the child. Once they are identified, I have to figure out what writing style best appeals to them.

I have to know my audience and I have to write in a way that appeals to them.  Thanks for bringing that up as another MAJOR consideration for writing a book that reaches the market for it effectively!



:heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4208045 - 05/22/05 10:46 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I want to make a correction to the "Never Yell" part. I was referring to stuff like not picking up toys. Save the yelling voice for only when a life is on the line. If you yell at your kids everyday, they will become desensitized to it and it won't be effective for getting their immediate attention when it really counts.

I didn't mean for this to turn into a parenting thread. I am just looking for help breaking through my concerns that have been keeping me from writing the book I do want to write and get published.  I can't always insight into myself well sometimes and came to you all for help with that, like how Joo replied.

I think anger over how I was raised is still a part of me and it gets in the way. I have forgiven my childhood and parents but I can't seem to forget when I am reminded by why I want to write this book in the first place. Argggggggggggggggggg

Love for being here for me! Thanks again all! :heart:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4209048 - 05/23/05 04:53 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

In your example Hue, the parent blew it because the ultimate thing to be aware of is consistency. If you say you are going to do something, you have to follow through. A kid learns quickly that you mean what you say and will do it and they don't fuck with you.

Giving children choices is a double bonus. It shows you have faith in them to make the desirable choice and gives them a sense of having some power to use so they have nothing to struggle with you over. I don't power struggle with my daughter. I give her the power to make choices with and explain ahead of time, the benefits of one choice and the consequences of the other. How can she struggle with me or get mad at me when she is the one making the choice. Ha Ha.

Follow through with the consequence if that is what it comes down too. Do it in a loving manor. Remember, you are not accepting of the child's behavior, but you are accepting of the child. You may not love what they did, but they must always feel that you love them. Don't without emotional care and affection. The consequence is enough. The idea is for them to learn that what they did or didn't do was unacceptable. You never want them thinking they are bad or not worth your love and a hug.

I love this stuff. :thumbup:

1.) There are already many books out there. Lots of "like" competition. For that reason alone, I may not get published. I might be wasting my time.

Karmic reasons alone are enough to write that book, in my opinion. Even if it doesn't get published, you will have thought a lot of wholesome inspirational thoughts in the process of coming up with the text, and your intention is pure. Writing that book may well blast your way to heaven.

2.) The philosophy requires that you follow it ALL. If a reader says , "well, I agree with 3/4 of it and will do that, but not the other 1/4" they can fuck up.....like baking a cake without the flour. You can't leave any of the ingredients out and expect to get the results on the box cover.I don't know if I want to be "indirectly" responsible for that.

Speak the truth, I say, and if no one listens, that is none of your concern. Maybe they don't have ears.

3.) I have issues with immediate gratification. I may not see any results from the work spent on the book let alone if I do, they may be a year or two off until publication. This makes it hard for me to keep motivated.

If you're not motivated enough, then you are not going to do it anyway. So why be concerned about it? The fact that you started a thread and posted a lot about the topic seems to suggest that you do have some motivation.

Apart from that, and I'm sure you know that, and I know it's hard to actually put into practice -  the best approach would be not to care about any goal, but to simply get into the flow of doing.

4.) THIS is the biggest one. I live in a bubble of heaven on earth and in the space I like to be in. I only get motivated when I see some kid being raised in manors that are upsetting to me, That is lousy energy to be motivated by.

When I think of them, I get upset again and start writing from that energy. I also just don't want to be brought into that energy PERIOD!

I struggle a lot with that issue, too. At times it seems to me that hate-free anger, if such a thing exists (and at times I think it does), must be a positive quality, being pure viriya, or energy. I'm not sure about that. But as far as motivation is concerned - you will find lots of quite upsetting child rearing examples by doing research on the web.

5) I am a lousy writer. You guys read my stuff. I'm lousy at composition, am the queen of run on sentences and sometimes write in complex thought patterns I think in. I also tend to to bust off into thought streams when I get inspired and then BLOW the composition and over all flow of the whole book.

I love the paragraphs I have posted at the beginning, in both style and content. If you are willing to invest the same qualities required for your methods (time, dedication, energy and patience) into your book, I am sure it will be apt for publishing. Besides, your style is perfect for writing on the net, so why not create a webpage? That could get you immediate feedback from your readers. You could expand that webpage into a book later. Or do it the other way round and publish your book as a pdf-file on the net, if all else fails.

7) Also definitely have a concern of major success issues. Don't know if I want to take on more to manage "if" it were to get published and do really well.

on point 7, its more of a concern about possibly having a lot more to manage. I may have to travel for promotions or book signings or be pressured into writing more books for the publisher because they want career authors not books. If it does well, there may be a lot of demands to be met and I have been dedicating my "career life" to being a MOM not an author.

Just tell them to piss off.

You have at least one reader here, jiggy.


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Offlineegghead1
Nakedly Open

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 931
Loc: The Womb of Love
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4209098 - 05/23/05 05:28 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Yes, you must write a book or compose a web-page for the good of humanity and the next generation of human beings on this planet. It is you obligation to write about what you know to be true. I too love your ideas on child rearing, and we all know you have the experience to back those ideas up. I say go for it, regardless of what you think is good or bad energy, use all energy as a tool towards your pure intention. Use your unconditional love for humanity and write from the heart. Break out of your bubble and let your inspired words flow into the hearts of those who are in need of guidance. :heart:


--------------------
All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male

Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
Loc: underbelly
Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4209250 - 05/23/05 09:40 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
I have noted that parents who let their children get out of control tend to dismiss any new idea as futile. I once had a friend who's child would make messes and refuse to clean them up. Spanking did not work, because the child had become desensitized to this treatment. I told him to set the child in a corner face (5 year old) to the wall and tell him when he chooses to clean up the mess he made that he can get up. My friend did this and later reported that it did not work. I asked how long the child sat in the corner. He said about 10 minutes. I asked why so short of a time. He said that any longer was cruel and that it was easier to let the child have his way. Any insinuation that his child could be brought under control was met with doubt. He stated that all adults had this problem, but that most would just not admit it. He said that if I claimed to have well behaved children that I was probably lying because he himself had been out of control as a child and he was normal. Most parents with this problem hold the same futile attitude.




This has been my experience also. I work around alot of parents and children. The parents are the ones most often who need the corrections the most. They seem to have no idea what is possible as far as a child having control of themselves. Most teach as they were taught.

I have left our oldest boy on a time out for over three hours, to allow him to absorb an idea and make a connection. And he had to sit in the bathroom because he would inconvenience his brothers play in his room. He missed out on all that time because of a 15 minute chore. When he was finally ready to do the chore, as he was in charge of the length of the time out in part, he realized he still needed to commit 15min to the chore.

Once over it was never mentioned. Or held against him. He has never had a repeat anywhere near that extent. His father has no discipline and taught the boys that everything is too much effort and mother can do it so I can play.

These boys have come around nicely and we share lots of love and fun things. The problems are starting to fade away. They tell me that they are happier with things this way.

May not work for everybody. But it's the best I know how. Miles beyond how I was raised. Yet some of the things my Dad did were not so wrong either. He just forgot to add the love and respect. :heart: :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (05/23/05 09:45 AM)


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Female User Gallery

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: Maybe you all can help me with something [Re: Nomad]
    #4209414 - 05/23/05 11:11 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

WOW! Again!

I woke up already feeling stuff shifting around and reorganizing in me and seeing my concerns from new perspectives and then Nomad and Egghead, your two posts have stirred up so much I am now overwhelmed.........in a good way, in the way I hoped to be when I put this post up.

Like I said, I didn't want to discuss parenting here, I wanted help getting past myself, my own self created walls and blocks that I just haven't been able too. Believe me, I feel the inner flooding going on so damns of the river denial were definitely located and broken.

Big healing day for me.

I just want to go be quiet and let the reorganizing gel.  :sun: :heart: :hugs:

S&P delivers. You all are the best and this forum is just brilliant. WOW! S&P is so bright, I gotta wear shades :cool:

LOVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVEEEE YOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart: :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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