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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
Male

Registered: 10/19/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
Re: Libertarianism [Re: Silversoul]
    #4171955 - 05/13/05 07:30 PM (17 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

I think the issue here is procedure. The government has very specific regulations as to how to go about dumping waste in designated areas. If you're going to impose those regulations on private dumps as well, fine.




Who gives two shits about procedure? Who is to say the government's way of doing thing is the only way -- or even for that matter the correct way? It's no secret that governments are the largest environmental offenders of all.

Either the stuff remains within the boundaries of the property (dumpsite) or it doesn't. If it stays within the boundaries, no one need do anything. If it escapes the boundaries, action is then taken. There's no need to make this more complicated than it is.




Phred


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/04/03
Posts: 2,400
Loc: New York
Re: Libertarianism [Re: Silversoul]
    #4171962 - 05/13/05 07:33 PM (17 years, 9 days ago)

I think the questions of the Libertarian party's environmental postions are legit because those positions seem to vary quite a bit. Some are extreme to the point of saying that nuclear dumping offshore would be okay, as it's no one's property. Others seem to support some form of government regulation. Or at least specific laws on the issue. Really all over the map. Same with many other issues.

Autonomous, as usual, is correct. Many flavors. Suprising for a party that likes to flaunt its adherence to relatively simple ideals.


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what's with neocons and the word 'ilk'?


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InvisibleSilversoul
Rhizome
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
Re: Libertarianism [Re: Phred]
    #4171964 - 05/13/05 07:33 PM (17 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
Who gives two shits about procedure? Who is to say the government's way of doing thing is the only way -- or even for that matter the correct way? It's no secret that governments are the largest environmental offenders of all.



True, but that's like saying that since government has been the biggest initiator of force that therefore government shouldn't exist, ignoring the fact that government does, in fact, have a role to play in stopping or preventing the initiation of force. Simply because they do their job badly is not to say that there isn't a job there that they need to do.


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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides

Registered: 05/17/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1 Flag
Re: Libertarianism [Re: Phred]
    #4172256 - 05/13/05 08:51 PM (17 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
No one will prevent you from supporting them, or stop you from presuading others to assist you in a non-Libertarian society either.




True. What's your point?

Well, I got the impression from your previous post that only in a Libertarian run society would people be "allowed" to make charitable donations...

Quote:

However people aren't that altruistic on their own. I volunteer at a Salvation Army homeless shelter/soup kitchen and there's never enough of anything, believe me.




Do you honestly believe that if people were paying a tenth the taxes they do today -- and knew full well there were no tax-funded relief programs at all -- they would give no more to charity than they do today? If you do believe that, could you please provide some supporting evidence for this? Or if not evidence, then at least some kind of argument as to why they wouldn't?


I couldn't spew facts and figures to support this, nor could I do the same to support your argument either. However, having traveled around this planet almost 35 times, I think I know a bit of human nature. Whilst there are some truly good and charitable people out there, most people couldn't give a damn about anyone but themselves, I'm sad to say.

Just to add, this is the only problem I see with this political philosophy. I do like the idea of limiting some government powers. We have too damn many laws, IMHO......


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Offlineshroommachine
Stranger
Male User Gallery
Registered: 01/03/05
Posts: 1,202
Loc: Florida
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
Re: Libertarianism [Re: Le_Canard]
    #4172957 - 05/14/05 12:14 AM (17 years, 9 days ago)

Corruption, Greed, and Theft will always find a way. No system of government will ever create a perfect society, because everyone is crazy.


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And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I told Bill that if they move my desk one more time, then, then I'm, I'm quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've moved my desk ...four times already this year and I used to be over by the window and I could see the squirrels, and they were merry, but then, they switched from the Swingline to the Boston stapler, but I kept my Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much and I kept the staples for the Swingline stapler and its not okay because if they take my stapler then I'll set the building on fire.


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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


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