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Offlineexclusive58
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Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
"I don't know what is good or what is bad."
    #4146830 - 05/07/05 03:59 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Here's a sweet little Zen tale:


A farmer receives as a gift for his son a white horse.
His neighbor comes up to him an tells him:
"You are very lucky. Nobody would have offered me such a beautiful white horse!"
The farmer answers:
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing..."

Later on, the farmer's son hops on the horse, and it starts flinging out and ejects its rider. The farmer's son breaks his leg.
"Oh, what a horror!, says the neighbor. You were right about saying that it could be a bad thing. Surely, the person that offered you the horse purposely meant to harm you. Now your son is disabled for life!"

But the farmer doesn't seem worried one bit.
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing", he says.

Thereupon, war breaks out, and all the young people are mobilized, except the farmer's son.
So the neighbor comes back and says:
"Your son will be the only one from the village not going to the war, surely he is very lucky.'

And the farmer repeats:
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing."

:sun:


--------------------


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 93,974
Loc: underbelly
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4147060 - 05/07/05 04:42 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Exactally, :thumbup: But I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing. :confused:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Posts: 10,344
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4147074 - 05/07/05 04:45 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Good post. We should never assume what seems obvious.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
Loc: mountains and lakes
Last seen: 11 years, 2 months
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4147251 - 05/07/05 05:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

exclusive58 said:
Here's a sweet little Zen tale:


A farmer receives as a gift for his son a white horse.
His neighbor comes up to him an tells him:
"You are very lucky. Nobody would have offered me such a beautiful white horse!"
The farmer answers:
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing..."

Later on, the farmer's son hops on the horse, and it starts flinging out and ejects its rider. The farmer's son breaks his leg.
"Oh, what a horror!, says the neighbor. You were right about saying that it could be a bad thing. Surely, the person that offered you the horse purposely meant to harm you. Now your son is disabled for life!"

But the farmer doesn't seem worried one bit.
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing", he says.

Thereupon, war breaks out, and all the young people are mobilized, except the farmer's son.
So the neighbor comes back and says:
"Your son will be the only one from the village not going to the war, surely he is very lucky.'

And the farmer repeats:
"I don't know if its a good thing or a bad thing."

:sun:




its the intention that makes something good or bad

if the horse brought all the luck in the world to the son, first place on races, lots of money, long healthy life, everything he ever wanted, the act of giving that horse would be a bad thing if the man that gave it ment harm

the outcome is irrelevant, the intention is what morality ocupied with


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisibleRavus
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Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 7,991
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4147274 - 05/07/05 05:13 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

There is no objectively good or bad intentions. There is simply the desire a person has, but the duality you would label it with only exists in your own bias opinions.

Just as the actions are only regarded by our own bias opinions. If we hate that farmer and wishes his son would die, his son staying away from the war would seem bad to us, but to the farmer it would seem good. Duality is only a point of view, and can therefore be contradictary if you apply it to more than one ego.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: OldWoodSpecter]
    #4147289 - 05/07/05 05:16 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

hmmm, so you're saying that it is our choices of doing good or doing bad that count?

I think i see what you're saying, but it goes a little too deep for a drunken man :wink:

It reminds me of the book, East of Eden...


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Ravus]
    #4147295 - 05/07/05 05:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
There is no objectively good or bad intentions. There is simply the desire a person has, but the duality you would label it with only exists in your own bias opinions.

Just as the actions are only regarded by our own bias opinions. If we hate that farmer and wishes his son would die, his son staying away from the war would seem bad to us, but to the farmer it would seem good. Duality is only a point of view, and can therefore be contradictary if you apply it to more than one ego.




but when someone wishes to hurt, its called bad, people call it like that


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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OfflineOldWoodSpecter
waiting
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Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 4,033
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Last seen: 11 years, 2 months
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4147306 - 05/07/05 05:19 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

exclusive58 said:
hmmm, so you're saying that it is our choices of doing good or doing bad that count?

I think i see what you're saying, but it goes a little too deep for a drunken man :wink:

It reminds me of the book, East of Eden...




Of course, how could the outcome ever be blaimed on us? We are little and stupid creatures that can barely get our washing machine to work properly. In our total ignorance, we are responsible for that which we do know, and we do know ourselfs and our intentions


--------------------
I descend upon your earth from the skies
I command your very souls you unbelievers
Bring before me what is mine


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InvisiblePsychoactive1984
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Registered: 02/06/05
Posts: 3,546
Loc: California, Monterey Coun...
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4147365 - 05/07/05 05:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

:handth:


--------------------
"Their is one overriding question that concerns us all: How can we get out of the fatal groove we are in, the one that is leading towards the brink?" Albert Szent-Gyorgyi
"We may not be capable of eradicating the corruption of reason, but we must nevertheless counter it at every instance and with every means." Dan Agin
"Politics is the best religion and politicians are the worst followers."
-It's ok to trip as long as you don't fall.
-Substance over Style.
-Common sense is uncommon.


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OfflineFrog
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Psychoactive1984]
    #4149080 - 05/08/05 03:18 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

This is what I have been trying to explain to people lately! 

I have been noticing, for the last 6 years, that when it seems a bad thing has happened, later it turns out that it was a good thing.

I have tried to explain to my clients that when  "bad" thing happens in their cases, not to worry, that down the road, it will turn out to be good.  This usually becomes true.  This has happened so much in my life that I don't worry any more.

I think people don't have enough patience.  You have to take the "bad" thing that happened and wait it out.  I've heard it described like this, and I apologize in advance, but "where God closes a door, He opens a window." 

See, when something bad happens, the event creates an opportunity for good to happen.  I could give so many examples from my life or from the lives of people I know, even thought they didn't know it was happening in their own lives, that i could bore you to death for hours. 

I don't even worry about sh*t any more, because the sh*t may very well turn out to be my favorite food.  Well, that analogy didn't come out very well, but feel free to harass me with it.  :grin:


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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InvisibleeMotionALLmotion
DivineeMotive....

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 759
Loc: The Symphony of Lights......
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Frog]
    #4149102 - 05/08/05 03:29 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Frog said:
This is what I have been trying to explain to people lately!  I have been noticing, for the last 6 years, that when it seems a bad thing has happened, later it turns out that it was a good thing.    I have tried to explain to my clients that when  "bad" thing happens in their cases, not to worry, that down the road, it will turn out to be good.  This usually becomes true.  This has happened so much in my life that I don't worry any more.  I think people don't have enough patience.  You have to take the "bad" thing that happened and wait it out.  I've heard it described like this, and I apologize in advance, but "where God closes a door, He opens a window."    See, when something bad happens, the event creates an opportunity for good to happen.  I could give so many examples from my life or from the lives of people I know, even thought they didn't know it was happening in their own lives, that i could bore you to death for hours.  I don't even worry about sh*t any more, because the sh*t may very well turn out to be my favorite food.  Well, that analogy didn't come out very well, but feel free to harass me with it.  :grin:




(Sorry, I just wanted to skrunch your words into a paragraph....)  :shocked:  :lol:


:heartpump::sun::heartpump:


--------------------
Uni-VersALL      MasterPeace
eMotive  :sun: Divinity NowThere Infinity :sun:  eMelody


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OfflineFrog
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: eMotionALLmotion]
    #4149115 - 05/08/05 03:37 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

eMotionALLmotion said:
Quote:

Frog said:
This is what I have been trying to explain to people lately!  I have been noticing, for the last 6 years, that when it seems a bad thing has happened, later it turns out that it was a good thing.    I have tried to explain to my clients that when  "bad" thing happens in their cases, not to worry, that down the road, it will turn out to be good.  This usually becomes true.  This has happened so much in my life that I don't worry any more.  I think people don't have enough patience.  You have to take the "bad" thing that happened and wait it out.  I've heard it described like this, and I apologize in advance, but "where God closes a door, He opens a window."    See, when something bad happens, the event creates an opportunity for good to happen.  I could give so many examples from my life or from the lives of people I know, even thought they didn't know it was happening in their own lives, that i could bore you to death for hours.  I don't even worry about sh*t any more, because the sh*t may very well turn out to be my favorite food.  Well, that analogy didn't come out very well, but feel free to harass me with it.  :grin:




(Sorry, I just wanted to skrunch your words into a paragraph....)  :shocked:  :lol:


:heartpump::sun::heartpump:






:heart:


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


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InvisibleeMotionALLmotion
DivineeMotive....

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 759
Loc: The Symphony of Lights......
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Frog]
    #4149128 - 05/08/05 03:44 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

:lol: :tongue:


--------------------
Uni-VersALL      MasterPeace
eMotive  :sun: Divinity NowThere Infinity :sun:  eMelody


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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
Posts: 2,146
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Frog]
    #4152991 - 05/09/05 12:35 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Frog said:
This is what I have been trying to explain to people lately!





So do people usually walk away from you with a convinced look on their face? Or do you usually fall in despair when you realize that people are too blinded by their personal problems to even attempt to understand what you were saying to them?


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OfflineFrog
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: exclusive58]
    #4155359 - 05/10/05 12:28 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

exclusive58 said:
So do people usually walk away from you with a convinced look on their face?




People never walk away from me with a convinced look on their faces after I'm done explaining my take on the Universe.  Usually, they look at me as if I had just metamorphosed into something unbecoming.  :grin:

Quote:

Or do you usually fall in despair when you realize that people are too blinded by their personal problems to even attempt to understand what you were saying to them?




I learned  when I was younger that I can't make anyone understand MY perspective, which is based on what I have gone through.  I alienated people when I was going through counseling, years ago.  I felt that I had found my answers, and that MY answers would solve EVERYONE'S problems. 

This was not true. 

I initially felt despair that the human race would not unanimously allow me to fix it, but I also realized that more importantly, each of us has our own individual learning experiences to go through.

I might impart my perspective on someone else's learning experiences, but I am not the solution to someone's problem. 

So no, I don't fall into despair any longer.  I realize that we each of us have to go through what we have to go through and some of us are at different points on the path toward where ever.


--------------------
The day will come when, after harnessing the ether, the winds, the tides, gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And, on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire.  -Teilard


Edited by Frog (05/10/05 02:41 AM)


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Offlineexclusive58
illegal alien

Registered: 04/16/04
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Re: "I don't know what is good or what is bad." [Re: Frog]
    #4155819 - 05/10/05 02:34 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

:thumbup: :heart:


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