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Offlinebarfightlard
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Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs
    #4082933 - 04/21/05 10:49 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

OK, so i was argueing with a friend tonite about how all drugs should be legal.

He thought the only drug that should be legal is pot(even tho he said mushrooms n stuff before, he went back to saying only pot. He believes that if drugs are legal it will cause more harm(thinking because they are legal more people would start doing em and that everony would just be fucked all the time)

-I told him regardless of if drugs are legal or not people will still do them if they really want too.

I told him the drug war istelf proves prohibition doesn't help, and compared us to other countrys with more laxed drug laws, like Holland, and told him in Holland they have a lower ratio of drug abuseres and addicts( I don't have any hard evidence to show this is true, but I've heard it from so many people who are against the drug war, and have never heard of as big of problems with drug use in Holland)

-He still said more poeple would do them if they were legal,...

I told him that not all drug use is bad, but it has the potential too be, especially with things like crack and heroin, seeing as they are very addictive.

-same responce, i guess he thinks nobody can be responcible with drugs(and I can see that being so in many cases in our society because of we are taught to look at drugs, that we shouldn't do them at all and any drug use is evil.....so i told him hes right to some extent and with how we have devolped on the issue and how we were braught up we shouldn't just flat out end prohbition, but take step after step to ease into our way of living)

I told him I didn't get intrested in drugs untill I had a VIP class(some bullshit the local police ...spreading misinformation and taking advantage of young minds) and that alot of people first try drugs because of the "forbidden fruit" that we are get because we are taught they are bad. And that if we were taught actually and honest truth about drugs and NOT told never to touch them kuz they are very very bad for you, that not nearly as many kids would fall into the forbidden fruit syndrome of using drugs) and that would result in safer and more controlled drug use...it seems our society has a habbit of over indulging in everything.

-he didnt have a rebutal for that one

He then said that mush, acid, etc. really fucks people up and it's not safe for people to be allowed to use them legaly.

-I told him again that if we tooks steps to teach people the truth about drugs and responcable drug use that wouldn't be nearly as much of an issue

Then some stupid shit got said like if you take acid your legaly insane even after your done tripping, and that if you take acid once you can't fly airplaines

_ I told him that ya I guess you are legally insane while on those drugs, but not when you come down, unless your an unlucky one and triuggered some underlining mental problem....and I told him that that not being able to fly planes was bullshit kuz lsd has a short half life and after a few days they couldn't detect it in your sytem.

Then he said that if you take lsd even once it changes your brain in ways that it can be seen in a brain scan.


*btw this guy uses drugs too, which struck me as a little odd concidering how he looked at the things we talked about.

We didn't get anywhere in this arguement, because we couldn't show each other proof in alot of things, but he kepot saying hes seen things on tv that told him that..So, what I was hoping for is some articles to shed some light onto the issue for him to look at


thanks!


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Offlinedr0mni
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083002 - 04/21/05 11:11 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Wow!

Definitely check out www.erowid.org , and there is also an article stickied in the "general questions" forum called "How Hallucinogenic Drugs Work..." or something.

There is a lot of confusion in the scientific community about what these drugs actually do, so you can expect even more confusion in the lay community.

We should really make a whole database of all these "scientific studies" we always cite to justify our drug use... then we wouldn't look like ignorant stoners.


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: dr0mni]
    #4083053 - 04/21/05 11:27 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

OK, well if you guys could gather some links that could help out that'd be great!!


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083141 - 04/22/05 12:02 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Ha! We're not gonna do it FOR you. There's plenty of information you can find on Erowid and this site too...


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #4083145 - 04/22/05 12:04 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Madtowntripper said:
Ha! We're not gonna do it FOR you. There's plenty of information you can find on Erowid and this site too...





haha bastard, i was hopin i could be lazy!!!!!! im gunna look tomorrow though, but if you can find stuff too that would help.


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083158 - 04/22/05 12:10 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I actually think people -would- do drugs more if they were legal. It's easy to say "oh people that don't want to do drugs still won't if they legal", but the only way to know that is if you make them legal and see for yourself. If you package LSD right everyone will eat it.


--------------------
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Offline13eetleJuice
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: freddurgan]
    #4083176 - 04/22/05 12:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Why is this always an issue though? Especially among those of us who do use drugs. I mean it all really comes down to a matter of personal choice. Do you wish to or not to use drug x? Then why the hell do you care if someone else does or does not wish to use drug x? It's that persons individual decision and imo we don't need a government to sheild us and protect us from the "evils out there". I'll decide for myself and hope everyone else does the same. At least thats my take on the situation.


--------------------


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: freddurgan]
    #4083195 - 04/22/05 12:20 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Ya the only way is to find out,...Like I said in our culture wouldnt be able to just all of a sudden end prohibtion. We would have to do it slowly, as to let the bullshit people have in their minds about drugs slowly flow out, I think thats the only sesnible way. But they wont do that because no governemnt likes to admit when they lie and it would cost them a fuck load of money to set that sort of thing up, drug education for the young and the old alike, rehabit clinics, ect man theres just so much they would have to do in order for it wo work....A big reason why they wont even think about it either.

We can still keep pushing the best we can even if the changes we make our very minor, that better than noting, riight???


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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Offline13eetleJuice
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083210 - 04/22/05 12:25 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I've sort of given up on trying to end prohibition. It seems rather pointless now as I don't ever envision it actually happening in this country. What I would like is more truthful drug education. When I was growing up, I was taught in school by a cop with a briefcase full of look-alike drugs that ALL drugs were insanely addictive, including marijuana. I was taught that if I smoked just one joint, that'd I'd be helplessly dependant on it for the rest of my life. Needless to say I got smoked out a few times and realized that this wasn't the case. Then I figured everything else I'd been taught was a lie as well. Good thing I didn't run out just then and get a shitload of heroin and start shooting up. Luckily I was smart enough to re-educate myself and find out the truth about what each drug does, safe dosages, possible side-effects, and each drugs individual addictive nature if applicable.


--------------------


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: 13eetleJuice]
    #4083234 - 04/22/05 12:33 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Ya I REALLY REALLY doubt prohibition will end, I think it will just get worse, and hopefully to a point where more and more people will stand up, but I doubt that either because they have become amaxing with their brainwashing.

I think you right, in that the only reasonable change to expect is proper drug education, even getting that done will be very hard.


lets hope for better days when mind altering plants have a more accepaible relashionship with humans though!!!! :sun:


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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OfflineHD590
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: 13eetleJuice]
    #4083255 - 04/22/05 12:41 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I think the first step would be to promote the various uses of psychadelics, instead of...lies

I often wonder what would happen if the world existed for 3 generations without contact with psychadelics an then the 4th had access to them... they would be so conditioned there heads would explode.


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: HD590]
    #4083269 - 04/22/05 12:45 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

sorry if this seems like spamming, but if you any links regarding anything with drug prohibtion please post it, I want this guy too see the other side than from what hes heard from tv and what hes heard from other friends who only heard these drug facts from tv......


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083348 - 04/22/05 01:06 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

If it makes the line between users and non-users a little more clear; a big reason is that the federal government couldn't properly control or tax illegal drugs.

Sorry if I've ruined your day or views on personal choice.. both sides are controlled, one just rebels.


--------------------



Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: Adden]
    #4083364 - 04/22/05 01:12 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

s2dope said:
If it makes the line between users and non-users a little more clear; a big reason is that the federal government couldn't properly control or tax illegal drugs..




why do you think they couldn't do that??

I can see it looking like they can't because of conditions right now, but if enough energy went into it, I think it could work. But that much energy almost seems like too much to ask for how deep we are in now....


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083377 - 04/22/05 01:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Are you going to go to the store and buy 20 joints w/ low THC content for $5-10 or are you going to grow 5 plants a year of killer buds?

Tax that.


--------------------



Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: Adden]
    #4083439 - 04/22/05 01:29 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Thats just another thing we would have to work on, is convince the governemnt that higher THC levels are healthier....I dunno dude, but there has to be a way to work out somethign here ......


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083470 - 04/22/05 01:34 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Never giving up is a start.

Spreading knowledge is a good second step. On the local level, you'll never beat out the D.A.R.E. propaganda machine.

Dose people.

Save your seeds and toss them randomly near streambeds, lakes, highways when the soil is moist. Infect the flora with marijuana.

Spread the love.


--------------------



Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: Adden]
    #4083556 - 04/22/05 01:57 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

It's hard to spread knowledge when nobody believes what your saying.


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: barfightlard]
    #4083573 - 04/22/05 02:03 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

They don't call it a war for nothing.


--------------------



Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation


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Offlinebarfightlard
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Re: Need help showing a friend the betyter truth about drugs [Re: Adden]
    #4083587 - 04/22/05 02:09 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

aye!

I'm not good at getting my point across in a way other people just automaticly block, my debating skills are poor, but still I like doin it:D

Hopefully I can gather some information they will take a look at and think about. That will do much more than my words can I think.

Oh another thing I forget, he also said the red light district was filled with crime and violence, n stuff, dunno where he heard that, but I always thought that place was fairly decent concidering whats here in Canada and the USA.


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks


Edited by bellylard (04/22/05 02:12 AM)


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