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Offlineegghead1
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Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery)
    #4059831 - 04/15/05 06:50 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

The Buddha identifies wanting (desiring, craving,) as the basis of all our suffering, and in the same breath he adds that it is the causative factor of rebirth. The Buddha points out that there is no lasting, inherent pleasure or happiness to be derived from having satisfied a desire. Any desire. The pleasure occurs only during the peak moment of releasing the frustration, the anticipation, the tension of the wanting itself. Once the desired object is secured, once the discomfort of wanting has been relieved, gratification dwindles to an afterglow, and soon ceases. As soon as the novelty wears off, our attention rather quickly moves to the next item that catches our eye. It is a never-ending process.

Furthermore, the Buddha also points out that no object or situation can ever, in and of itself, be a source of pleasure or displeasure. Rather, these are constructs of the mind. In our minds we form certain expectations, the way we want specific things, situations, and persons to be. As long as these expectations happen to be met, we experience a degree of satisfaction. When they are not met, we experience displeasure, disappointment, anger, and other unwholesome mind-states in direct proportion to our frustration.

We cannot crave that which we already have, only that which is still out of our reach. We can have an attachment to what is already ours, but that is also a desire, a wanting for the future to be a certain way. We want a guarantee that the object of our attachment will continue to give us pleasure, that it will remain in our possession, and that it will not change, break, or otherwise fail to live up to our expectations. We still want something that is out of reach: a firm guarantee that future circumstances will not alter.

We deceive ourselves and each other into believing that happiness is just one more step away, almost within our reach. If only we could get rid of this, if only we could have that, if only we could chang the other, then for sure we would be really and truly happy forever! We spend our lives "if-onlying," reaching and grasping, yet we never manage to get hold of happiness. It always seems to slip through our fingers. That is the story of our lives, life after life, birth after birth.

Yes, this constant reaching and grasping for "just one more thing," this is the craving, about which the Buddha warns us. This is the glue that binds us so firmly to the Wheel of Samsara, this grim Merry-Go-Round of Misery that drags us endlessly from birth to rebirth, from death to death again, and from suffering to more suffering, relieved here and there by short-lived sparks of gratification or pleasure.


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All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: egghead1]
    #4059935 - 04/15/05 07:12 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

So that new car isn't going to bring me lasting happiness?

Bummer.


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #4060500 - 04/15/05 10:08 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

That is all well and good...for Buddhists. For non-Buddhists it is quite untrue. In my world view the physical and the non-physical have equal weight.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #4060504 - 04/15/05 10:09 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Oh, the car will....but the payments won't.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4060554 - 04/15/05 10:33 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
That is all well and good...for Buddhists. For non-Buddhists it is quite untrue. In my world view the physical and the non-physical have equal weight.




Thank You!

Have you lived the desireless not wanting route eggo? I bought into that philosophy for years. they were the worst freaking years of my life. No highs no lows just huuuuuuuuuuuuum drummmmmmmmmmm ohmmmmmmm.

Did you ever consider eggo that you can want, get and enjoy without creating identity attachments to stuff? If you do this, then you will not suffer any sense of loss if you lose them.

When you fully cognise the fleeting/illusory nature of material reality, then you can enjoy it all without suffering from identity attachment slavery to maintaining it or fear of losing it.

It's all liquid. Only people who believe in concrete get buried under its weight. Liquid knowers swim freely through it all.

Does it bother you that not everyone resonates with Buddhism as it being some ultimate absolute truth to bliss? I already found another way to it and I don't have to die or move into self denial to experience it whenever I want to.

Has it occurred to you that achieving Nirvana is something you have to want and desire for first?????? How did Buddha pull that one over is followers eyes?

Like Hue said, it's good for those walking Buddhas path but not all of us care to. Some of us got the idea to follow our hearts and forge our own. :laugh:

It's cool if you choose too. Sometimes you talk as if it's the one and only right way to get to something every body should want or be like. Thats why some confused you with Sinbad. He did that too. If the philosophy teaches that, it's already flawwed with a lack of respect for honoring free will as well as it's riddled with duality stuff about right and wrong ways to be.

Duality is the trap that keeps people cycling through stuff in a continuum of striving to be right which leads to wrong to right to wrong to right to good to bad to good to bad it never ends until you break the scales of judgment.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4060655 - 04/15/05 11:11 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I have been there myself as one step (my first) on the path. I do remember that old Siddhartha said something about a middle way...you know, between self indulgence and ascetism. Extremes actually have nothing to do with Buddhism and are not really part of it. So, my earlier statement about non-materialism being for Buddhists was not entirely correct. The Hindus preach this, of course, but it is a device to keep the lower social classes from being upwardly mobile. The Hindu religion actually empowers the rich and also slave owners of past days. It is simply not culturally relevant anymore.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4060968 - 04/16/05 01:00 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

After my thank you to you for speaking up with another view on this, my questions and comments went to eggo.

Yeah, the middle path. If you stay in your center or at least know where it is and how to get back to it quickly, you can walk any path you like..........Freeeeeeeeeeeeedddddddddddooooooooommmmmmmmm!

Waling this tight rope between extremes is lame. To be in your center and an extreme at he same time is the most intense rush and not only that but energy blocks get burned off and busted up and you end up with even more room to explore and play freely in as well as have more vital energy running through you to work with.

In all fairness, maybe some have a disposition for it like a cat that does some crazy stuff pushing its limits and always lands on it's feet if it falls and some don't.

That's why I say there is a way for everyone and they are all right for that person. It's also why I say that I am not headed where others are because there is no where to go. People have a very difficult time with that one for some reason.

I often wonder how much time people who have a final destination stop to get to spend on fathoming eternal existence. Or like this returning to somewhere or nothingness stuff. If it was all that, why did anyone leave just to go back for anything but occasional visits?


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4061050 - 04/16/05 01:16 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I always promote moderation in all things...particularly religion. So many Christians engage in extreme gluttony as regasrding their religion. Moderation changes from person to person.

"After my thank you to you for speaking up with another view on this, my questions and comments went to eggo."

I was aware of that...you were quite clear, but did I not say something about me being full of shit.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4061273 - 04/16/05 02:21 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
[Has it occurred to you that achieving Nirvana is something you have to want and desire for first?????? How did Buddha pull that one over is followers eyes?




He didn't. "Furthermore, if all dharmas are empty, meaning that no conceptually-distinct thing exists, there there can be no reaching of the religious goal, for there is no ignorance nor therefore liberation from it.  (In fact, there is no one to be liberated.)  In other words, there is no suffering and no cessation of suffering, in short, there is nothing to obtain. '

Once again, being free from desire does not equate into inaction. It does not mean that one does not think, that one does not prefer, that one does not act. It does not mean that one does not enjoy. It does not mean that one does not experience.

The whole fucking point is in regards to one's mental state of mind when one is taking part in these things. It means that one's emotional and mental state does not rely on conditions and demands based on situations in one's life in order to be.

If one experienced a state which they feel is similar to what egghead is discussing, the very fact that they refer to that state as being boring and dull, in itself, proves that they were not actually in the state that he refers to. :lol: Their emotional and mental state of being held an expectation of what the experience has to be in order for it to be a satisfying experience. This is completely contrary to the state of mind that he refers to. An experience doesn't need to be anything in order for it to be anything, it simply is. The fact that it is what it is, is satisfying enough. :nut:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlineegghead1
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4061774 - 04/16/05 07:47 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
Quote:

Huehuecoyotl said:
That is all well and good...for Buddhists. For non-Buddhists it is quite untrue. In my world view the physical and the non-physical have equal weight.




Thank You!

Have you lived the desireless not wanting route eggo? I bought into that philosophy for years. they were the worst freaking years of my life. No highs no lows just huuuuuuuuuuuuum drummmmmmmmmmm ohmmmmmmm.

At first the buddhist path is always boring becuase we are looking to gently quieten down the craving of the mind, the mind has been habituated for so long to be involved with the objects of the senses, so its like taking a child away from his toys, at first he is upset, then he is bored. Basically the mind slowly begins to lose its desire and attachment towards the objects of the senses, and the first thing we experience is boredom. But after the mind is settlled, this broedom starts to become quite blissful through relaxing and letting go becuase as the corse mental activity quietens down you begin to glimspes the subtle levels of the mind. Increasingly profound states(which have always been present in our minds) begin to become increasingly more pronounced and clear. Basically you took the first step on the path, but went no further, thats why you didnt have any deeper experiences other than the initial boredom.

Did you ever consider eggo that you can want, get and enjoy without creating identity attachments to stuff? If you do this, then you will not suffer any sense of loss if you lose them.

Of course in Buddhism there does exist the idea of enjoying everything without craving or attachment, this is one of the main points of Buddhist Tantra. The intial wanting (attachment) is the grasping mechanism associated with frustration and suffering. The only pleasure in getting the object of desire is not latent in the object itself but comes about through the ceasasion of craving. This is becuase we cannot crave what we do not have, when we cease craving we experience temporary pleasure until we grasp at the next object of desire. Without this craving mechansim the whole process becomes blissful without attachment

When you fully cognise the fleeting/illusory nature of material reality, then you can enjoy it all without suffering from identity attachment slavery to maintaining it or fear of losing it.

Yes of course. It is not the object that causes the suffering but our ignorance of impermenance that generates our attachment.

It's all liquid. Only people who believe in concrete get buried under its weight. Liquid knowers swim freely through it all.

Well, i would'nt say its all liquid at all. My view is that its all appearences blissfully empty of inherent self-existence. But i think we mean the same thing.

Does it bother you that not everyone resonates with Buddhism as it being some ultimate absolute truth to bliss? I already found another way to it and I don't have to die or move into self denial to experience it whenever I want to.

No it does'nt bother me at all. Buddhism is not about self-denial, thats a common misunderstanding. Its about discovering through practice the truth of no-self, its a realization not a negation. In Buddhism there is also alot of dogmatic mention of the heavenly realms that are inhabitted by beings that ignorantly feed off the fruits of their positive karma, once it runs out, they experience suffering once again. You may be blissful, but will it last? Buddhism doe'st say that you have to die to experience the state, all it says is that at the time of death, th nature of mind is more easily recognisable as all of the thought processes die into their nature which is emptiness. Its like when you fall to sleep, there is a similar experience but most people instead of recongnising it,  fall into complete uncoincious oblivion before the dreamstate manifests

Has it occurred to you that achieving Nirvana is something you have to want and desire for first?????? How did Buddha pull that one over is followers eyes?

Oh the age old chessnut. This is a good one. What buddhism teaches is that we already have Nirvana,it is our nature, but we are ignorant of that. Our attachment to goals, concepts, objects and ideas is what obsucre our direct knowing of who we really are. Enlightenment is not a goal, we already have it, it would be silly to crave we already have. All Buddhsim teaches that we already have this enlightened nature, and its our ignrance, greed (craving) and hatred which obscure our enlightned nature. Buddhsim just provides methods for uncovering what we already have, their is no goal, we are already here, we just need to allow ourselves the space and peace of mind to see through these clouds of ignorance. If you look at the Prajnaparamita, it goes into explaination something like, no form, no clour..........no path, no attainment and so forth, negating all possibilites for goal orientated craving.

Like Hue said, it's good for those walking Buddhas path but not all of us care to. Some of us got the idea to follow our hearts and forge our own. :laugh:

Well thats ok, thats good. You don't have to be a Buddhist to recognize the cause of your suffering and put an end to it. I hope that all of you  can understand the cause, eliminate it and discover lasting happiness free from sorrow.

It's cool if you choose too. Sometimes you talk as if it's the one and only right way to get to something every body should want or be like. Thats why some confused you with Sinbad. He did that too. If the philosophy teaches that, it's already flawwed with a lack of respect for honoring free will as well as it's riddled with duality stuff about right and wrong ways to be.

That is of course your own interpretation, im just explaining from my view the cause of suffering and how to be free of that. There are many methods and many paths to the same truth, so i dont see any problem. Please show me where i have shown disrespect, becuase i dont feel that i have. As you probably know, their are many different philosophies and ways of explaining even within the Buddhist religion let alone others. One school of thought says one thing, another negates that and says another. This is a problem, this is'nt the main point. If what i say makes sense and you can connect with that, then what is the problem? If it does'nt make sense and you cant connect, then its ok, there is still no problem. Im just experessing myself, and the path i follow, im not forcing anyone into anything, neither am i disrespecting there chosen beliefs. Buddhism doe'snt say that it is exclusively the only way. Look at the Dalia Lama for a shining example of showing respect to all religious traditionas and religions. He teaches to all being regardless, and its never in a dogmatic fashion, always trying to work with and accomidates for the needs of all beings, not trying to convert or indoctrinate them, i think that is mainly the true Buddhist way.

Duality is the trap that keeps people cycling through stuff in a continuum of striving to be right which leads to wrong to right to wrong to right to good to bad to good to bad it never ends until you break the scales of judgment.

Exactly





Edited by egghead1 (04/16/05 09:12 AM)


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #4061793 - 04/16/05 08:00 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

So that new car isn't going to bring me lasting happiness?

Bummer.


Typo. You actually meant "Bimmer", right ? The new M6 is pure bliss with a 485 HP V-10...



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlineegghead1
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: Swami]
    #4061796 - 04/16/05 08:02 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Its Impermenant and so are you.  :sun: :wink:


--------------------
All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: Swami]
    #4061890 - 04/16/05 10:12 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

"You actually meant Bimmer, right?"

If I had enough money, it would be a Bimmer and not a Bummer.  :grin:


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #4061935 - 04/16/05 10:51 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

the good thing about this topic is that is shows directionality
or a potential movement.
our basic instincts operate on the same principle
In the mind one cannot use this type of dualism except
to set up your priorities, all one can do is approach or sit still.
there is no opportunity to avoid or run away.
mind operates by association only. no repulsion in mind instead
you get instinctively the attraction to revulsion.

but buddha taught sitting still, it works better than the
instinctuality aspect of intellect (duality directionality etc.)

Code:


Instinctual directionality chart idea
Attracted to it Run away & hide
========================================================================
Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery)
Sex (harmonious Bliss) <-----------O------------> loneliness (Misery)
Food (health and life) <-----------O------------> starvation (death)
safety (warmth security) <---------O------------> Danger (sharp teeth cliffs)


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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: redgreenvines]
    #4061957 - 04/16/05 10:59 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

"'Discipline' is a difficult word for most of us. It conjures up images of somebody standing over you with a stick, telling you that you're wrong. But self-discipline is different. It's the skill of seeing through the hollow shouting of your own impulses and piercing their secret. They have no power over you. It's all a show, a deception. Your urges scream and bluster at you; they cajole; they coax; they threaten; but they really carry no stick at all. You give in out of habit. You give in because you never really bother to look beyond the threat. It is all empty back there. There is only one way to learn this lesson, though. The words on this page won't do it. But look within and watch the stuff coming up--restlessness, anxiety, impatience, pain-- just watch it come up and don't get involved. Much to your surprise, it will simply go away. It rises, it passes away. As simple as that. There is another word for 'self-discipline'. It is 'Patience'. "



"it will pass..."


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Offlineegghead1
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: dorkus]
    #4061997 - 04/16/05 11:36 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Nicely done :thumbup: :heart:


--------------------
All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: fireworks_god]
    #4062445 - 04/16/05 03:08 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

FW,

Are you under the impression or belief that we are linear beings that can only encapture one state of being at a time?

What happens when you open up to being multidimensional in your beingness?

Do you know what it feels like?

Imagine having a 24/7 a hook up to source peace, serenity, contentment etc "the stillness" AND additional space to become a conscious co-creator continuing on a journey of self exploration and discovery "self realization" not imagination at the same time while also occupying the space that functions and cares for physical life responsibilities.

I asked earlier why if we came from source peace, security and bliss that we left it? I asked why one would think its about a final return to it instead of occasional visits. I asked if anyone had fathomed ETERNITY? Screw that, just fathom 99999999999999999999999999999999 godzillon, quadrillion billion tripltilion years and you have not even a drop in the water of ETERNITY. And you have a final place to go to? You wondered why i said Hoooooooo hummmm ommmmmmmmmmm there? :rotfl:

I never said that hook up states were boring. They are exquisite and sublime indeedio. Imagine having that and cognitive room to still engage in the creation of new challenges that lead to actual self realizations.

You can engage solely in the bliss of your hook up to the exclusion of any action required for it. You can tune in to the heart akasha and access information until your head will explode again and again and again like having mental orgasms and never move a finger.

What makes it all possible? It exists as something to be connected and tapped into because it's been realized.

How did that happen? Hmmm Something somewhere had to become conscious, self aware and active to get the ball the rolling. The more that gets realized that juicier the pot is to draw from. The more we expand our capacity to house light, the more of the juice we can realize and experience without lifting a finger.

Some one some where is lifting fingers so you can do that.

You can read a book about what it is like to be a professional windsurfer. You can sit on the beach and watch and imagine what that guy is experiencing and get a vicarious thrill from it. You can go deeply into your imagination and pretend you are the windsurfer. Or, you can get your head out of the book, your ass off the beach and go realize what it feels like all long with meeting the challenges of mastering the sport and realize it full on for REAL!


The guy who reads the book about it or uses his imagination to pretend what it is like can only do that because someone has actually done it first and made it something real, brought it into the realms of what is possible to actually be.

When you are alone and self absorbed and indulged in imagination realms (meditation), it seems close to the real thing. How would you even know how far off you are from it any way? You are safe in your in-activity and feel really good and content and that a be enough for some who dare not stray.

That is the equivalent of spiritual masturbation in my book. You can get off on your divine self all day long, safe and still all alone thinking you are experiencing IT all you want to!

When you decide to take a risk and experience the real thing with a partner WOAHHHHHHHHH. Then you "know" the difference and what you were missing out on. To actively engage in the co mingling of subtle energies with another, to be in the act of creation, to realize your power within movement of energy. To harmonize that energy with another heightening and amplifying the experience, to have another to play off of, to work with and expand upon states that can be achieved BLOWS masturbation out of the water.

There are those who dream the dream and those who are actually living and realizing it.

I never, while imagining the stoke of the windsurfer, imagined the sound the water makes cutting under your board. It's exciting. I had no way of knowing it watching from the beach. I never imagined the force pull of the wind on your boom. It's awesome. I had no way of knowing it watching from the beach. I never imagined the eagle rays sailing along by my side in play with me. It was beautiful! I couldn't see them underwater from the beach. I never imagined the feel of gust grabbing your sail and slamming you into one hardy face plant. It was stunning. I had no way of knowing that sitting still watching from the beach.

Tell me you think I don't know what Eggo described in his first post because you assumed that because I said stillness was hooooooooo huuuuuuuumm ommmmmmmmmmmmmm. Tell me I don't know what I am talking about when talking about action and self realization versus stillness states of being in imagination of the real thing.

Tell me that the point of life is not to live it. I loose nothing by you saying that. Reject my words and you neither loose nor gain anything from them either.

Perhaps when I take breaks from here and come back, I naturally forget how far the members here have pushed them selves regarding taking action and self realization- not imagination but experiencing the real thing through life and action and speak from places I want to bring everyone to, to share in what I have discovered in this amazing place called life where interaction and creation is going on. It's such a gift so many blow away.

"Be still and know that I AM."  Okay, step one, you are I am in me, very cool ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm yes yes yes.

Okay , um so, what exactly are we and what can do with this ahhhhhhh mmmmmmmmmm yes yes yes?

"Fuck if I know. That's what I made you and this plane for. Get off your ass and go find out! I got your back homie. It's all us. You can't go wrong or fail. Just remember who we are in the stillness when you get in the thick of he IT and forget. I am always with you as I am you" Uhhhhhhh Okay dude! I'll go check us out and report my findings often! :laugh:

So FW, how still are you when you are recording your music to hear back and play for others to appreciate and enjoy? Do you prefer imagining new tunes and creating them just in your soul, mind and heart or ACTUALLY creating the sounds with instruments to realize them aesthetically with your 5 senses also? Which is the greater stoke? Hearing it in your head? Hearing it for real feeling the bass pulsate through your body? or Sharing it for real with another who is digging it with you?

Yes, I called just the being in your head and heart alone part 24/7 years on end hooooooooo hummmmmmmm oooooommmmmmm  compared to experiencing the real thing in interactive co-creative play.

I said it and meant it! This is the place for action and you can be active AND growing AND still at the SAME time.

What does anyone think all this talk of our multidimensional beingness, consciousness and simultaneous time consciousness we are evolving into experiencing has been all about anyway?

Buddhas way was the way of the ancients. The best he could pull off in this puppy was housing enough light to get a glimpse at self realization through memory/imagination only. Yet, he was still so far removed buried deep in physicality he experienced the fear of separation and just wanted to be home again. He thought taking action was taking a step away from home. He thought outside of stillness was where suffering existed.

He allowed himself to realize home yet he  hadn't allowed himself to realize that home goes with you wherever you go, in whatever you do. We can do that now. Stillness and action and growth realization can take place consciously ALL AT THE SAME TIME in these puppies.

And that is thanks to all of those who dared to not only dream the dream but actually live it along the way and those who not only imagined what could be possible but made it so and put in the report so meditators could suck off it. It's thanks to all of those who not only said, I Am, but look at what I can become of it.

I am not knocking stillness. I am sharing with you all that you can heighten, lower, broaden and expand upon that sublimeness, because there is nothing to be afraid of by taking action. You just have to remember the stillness while in action. It's always there and everywhere even in the midst of war and chaos.......in the midst. I can tell you, it wouldn't be able to become realized even in still meditation if it wasn't realized by someone in the physical first.

Follow the ancients and all you get is what is ancient. There are so many new worlds to explore and even to be created and yet realized into existence and possibility. Buddha did good for his time and era serving the cause in his own way and that was a long time ago.

If your destination is a final one, just remember eternity and that 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 godzillion, quadrillion tripletilion billion years is nt even a drop of water in it.

We got places to go, paths to forge, realities to create and love to make because there is nothing else but to be just in waiting, imagining and dreaming of that.

I'm not closing any doors here for anyone to get in a huff about. I am opening more of them up. Think back to what it feels like the first day in spring you open the windows and let the fresh air blow in after a long winter, smell the jasmine and gardenia in the air, hear he birds signing their songs ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. That's being home man with the windows and doors to the world open to you and calling you out to play. :heart:


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinefireworks_godS
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Male

Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,851
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 13 days, 3 hours
Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4062468 - 04/16/05 03:19 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Jiggy always wonders why threads she posts in mysteriously develop a second scrolling dimension.... I'll tell you what, that horizontal scroll bar didn't become activated until her, experiencing multiple dimensions of states of being, posted in this thread. :tongue: :lol:

Hehehe, sorry, I couldn't resist. I will now read the rest of your post. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,851
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 13 days, 3 hours
Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4062522 - 04/16/05 03:42 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
So FW, how still are you when you are recording your music to hear back and play for others to appreciate and enjoy? Do you prefer imagining new tunes and creating them just in your soul, mind and heart or ACTUALLY creating the sounds with instruments to realize them aesthetically with your 5 senses also? Which is the greater stoke? Hearing it in your head? Hearing it for real feeling the bass pulsate through your body? or Sharing it for real with another who is digging it with you?




Having now read all of your post, I've quoted just this as I certainly can't quote it all, I definitely can't respond to every sentence, and, since this refers to me specifically, and all of your points converge together for a whole meaning, I'll just reference my reply from this point. :grin: Jeez, jiggy, you never cease to amaze me with your eagerness to express yourself. :wink: :laugh:

Honestly, it seems that you have a misconception of what it is that I speak of and refer to.

What I have spoken of and referred to does not, in any way, mean or imply that one does not experience. It does not mean or imply that one does not consciously act.

I do not consider ourselves to be linear beings (whatever it is that that means :smirk:), but I do consider there to be one state of being. Naturally, one's state of being is the summation of one's direct experience. Regardless of how many countless aspects may or may not have their place in that state of being, there is but one state of being, as it is, naturally, the summation of these aspects. :wink:

What I just spoke of and referred to does not say or imply that existing within the state of mind in question means that one does not act, think, or experience.

I can't help but feel that the concept that you responded to is not the concept that I have expressed, that perhaps the concept that you are responding to is your own and is the result of something existing prior to this and related discussions. That is, that when you read what I speak of, instead of understanding and perceiving it in its own context, your mind is instead automatically referencing a pre-existing concept that is not actually the same.

I do not have the time at this point to resummarize the aspects and concepts of this state of mind that I have spoken of and referred to, but never have I said or implied that existing within such a state of mind and state of being equates into no conscious action, thought, or experience. On the contrary, each action, each thought, each summated experience is experienced as it naturally exists, prior to and perhaps even without the mind's projections, and defined meanings of what that action, thought, or experience is or is not. One directly experiences these aspects of reality as they naturally occur. The mind does not interfere with our observation, perception, and experience of reality. Etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

Hehe, I apologize for not having the time to go in-depth, but this is what I have for you now. :wink:

:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlineegghead1
Nakedly Open

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 931
Loc: The Womb of Love
Last seen: 12 years, 1 month
Re: Buddha (Lasting Bliss) <-----------O------------> Craving (Lasting Misery) [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #4062575 - 04/16/05 04:02 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

"Buddhas way was the way of the ancients. The best he could pull off in this puppy was housing enough light to get a glimpse at self realization through memory/imagination only. Yet, he was still so far removed buried deep in physicality he experienced the fear of separation and just wanted to be home again. He thought taking action was taking a step away from home. He thought outside of stillness was where suffering existed.

No, elightenemnt isnt something imaginary. Its not something that the Buddha imagined and then decided "Oh this is enlightenmnet", its a discovery and its nature is not only stillness, that is just one aspect. The Buddha disocvered that the natural condition of all beings is non-dual wisdom. This isnt some made up fabricated state, it is our very essence, who we really are, which of course is not limited to stillness, nor movement but emcompases both and all aspects. What do you think all the Tantric energy practices are all about, its about working with the movement , which isnt rooted in physicality but is on the energy and mind level, working with the movement aspect of our minds as well as the stillness. He most certainly did not teach that outside of stillness lies suffering. You really are completely mistaken and need to read some more and stop talking such nonsense. You should really take a look at the four noble truths.

He allowed himself to realize home yet he hadn't allowed himself to realize that home goes with you wherever you go, in whatever you do. We can do that now. Stillness and action and growth realization can take place consciously ALL AT THE SAME TIME in these puppies.

You really dont know much about Buddhism do you? Again, what do you think Tantric practices are all about? And no, you are wrong again, he lived the life of a wandering begger and astetic, you really cant get much further from the comforts of home than that

And that is thanks to all of those who dared to not only dream the dream but actually live it along the way and those who not only imagined what could be possible but made it so and put in the report so meditators could suck off it. It's thanks to all of those who not only said, I Am, but look at what I can become of it.

Being a Buddha means that you are fully awake, there is no longer any reason to partake further in the dream other than to wake other beings up out of it. he made it possible for all beings to discover elightement, to wake up out of this dreamlike condition. Also this illusory 'I' is the beginning of all of our problems, so saying proudly "I AM" and "look what i ahve become" is just another form of "self" confirmation that perpetuates ignorance.


Follow the ancients and all you get is what is ancient. There are so many new worlds to explore and even to be created and yet realized into existence and possibility. Buddha did good for his time and era serving the cause in his own way and that was a long time ago.

The Dalai Lama is said to be an emenation of the Buddha of Compassion. Buddhism is very much alive and kicking today. It is not an ancient thing at all. It is a living presence. The Buddha is in our hearts, the Buddha is living presence.
"


--------------------
All you need is Love! Really thats it! Infinite Unconditional Love! Just develop that and all else will fall into place perfectly!


Edited by egghead1 (04/16/05 04:47 PM)


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