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OfflineAbermelin
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Symbiosis Q
    #4043150 - 04/11/05 11:49 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

i was gonna throw a small lowlight plant in my fruiting chamber to replace fanning or installing a noisy air pump. I was wondering why more people dont do this, any reasons in specific?

im guessing that not only will the plant be able to supply enough oxygen, it will also contribute to the overall humidity levels. hell, if i can find one with the right type of foliage, it might protect my casings from water droplets falling from the ceiling of the container.


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InvisibleCrasher
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4043156 - 04/11/05 11:52 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

The soil you're using hasn't been pasturized or sterilized,I doubt the container was either, there could be a buildup of bacteria, mold spores, or a multitude of other nasties involved with throwing it in your chamber.. I've thought about it, and I may be a little overcautious, but I wouldn't.


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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Crasher]
    #4043286 - 04/12/05 12:21 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

plant must also like to be constanly wet. But like said above soil has to be sterilized. Im guessing ur still going to have to fan unless its a huge plant with little amount of cakes or casing being fruited. another thing natural sunlight or artifical sunlight? Artifical is not as efficent as sunlight. Plus what about night, plants give off oxygen at a lower rate at night. You would be taking a big chance in putting a plant in a fruting chamber I think you would have to change the soil everytime you change batches to be frutied. Really not worth it IMHO. But experiment!


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Invisibletahoe
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #4043308 - 04/12/05 12:25 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

tropical plant. I was going to put some grass seed in a casing. I think it should work. maybe h202 the seed first


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Stop experimenting half way through your first grow. Grow it to maturity, watch it, learn from it. Do this a few times then experiment with different ideas and figure out what works best for you.


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OfflineGNIOM1498
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4043326 - 04/12/05 12:31 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

best plant would be sugar cane. I believe it gives off huge amounts of O2. But then again low light plants will not give off that much O2. I don't believe one low light plant will be able to keep up with with some fungus.


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----ALL MY POSTS ARE FICTIONAL-------


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OfflineAbermelin
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: GNIOM1498]
    #4043416 - 04/12/05 12:51 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

sugar cane? damn, im not using a room as my terrarium. when i say small, i mean like 6 inches in length. This plant only needs to be watered every few days. i only use natural sunlight, cant beat it.

Quote:

The soil you're using hasn't been pasturized or sterilized,I doubt the container was either, there could be a buildup of bacteria, mold spores, or a multitude of other nasties involved with throwing it in your chamber..




uh, yeah, what do you think happens every time you open your terrarium to fan and mist? you blow a shitload of bacteria and spores in the air into your terrarium, unless im the only grower here who doesnt live in a level 3 biosafety room.

seriously, once the cakes have been colonized fully, they have NO risk of contamination from airborne contam's. however, the casings still do, and i can see your worry about that, but as i said before, a small plant would contain no more bacteria and spores than what is already floating in the air.

anyways, what good is sterilizing the soil gonna do? bacteria will just float straight back on the soil as soon as throw the plant back in it. shit, i think humans carry way more contams than a small plant ever would. maybe i should pasturize myself every time i check on the cakes.


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OfflineIGnosticAbhorI
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4043460 - 04/12/05 01:02 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Acully fully colonized doesn't mean it wont get contamed...its usually strong the first flush...but after that its kind of loses its vigor...

I like tahoe's idea, why didnt anyone comment on it? I've heard of some peeps trying it out and was thinking about giving it a go but wasn't sure how to go about it...It's a better idea than a plant IMO...

Gl though

-Gnostic


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OfflineMonkeyPod
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4043467 - 04/12/05 01:04 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I've been considering the same thing although the one thing I'm skeptical about is the fact that when the lights go out the plant gives off carbon dioxide and water and consumes oxygen through respiration. Oxygen is only created through photosynthesis. This could be an overnight lethal combo for the mushies. I'm not sure that it would have the desired effect without good O2 to begin with. There's only one way to find out... Adding a little lime to the casing will help a little, but I'm not sure for how long. Soda lime absorbs CO2. They use it in scuba rebreathers and anesthesia recyclers for this reason. Maybe elevating the mushies above the floor and puting a pan with soda lime in it could help as well. I've also been bouncing around a few other ideas. I'm pretty lazy...I don't even want to fan the little fuckers. It'd be nice to work something out so it's somewhat self regulating.


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OfflineAbermelin
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: MonkeyPod]
    #4045798 - 04/12/05 02:45 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

plants dont go into reverse mode, consume o2 and produce co2 at night. i dont know what F'd up biology class you took....


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OfflineMonkeyPod
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4048650 - 04/13/05 02:52 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Apparently the same fucked up biology class you should have taken. Photosynthesis only occurs during the day. At night the plant does not absorb co2. The plant gives off CO2 and H2O during the day too but photosynthesis helps to reabsorb it. So, at night the plant continues respiration and does not reabsorb any CO2 or water until there is light to activate photosynthesis.

"Respiration is the opposite of photosynthesis. It consumes oxygen (oxidation of sugars) and releases carbon dioxide (CO2) and water."

http://www.cfl.scf.rncan.gc.ca/ecosys/dynamic/photosyn_e.htm


Edited by MonkeyPod (04/13/05 02:59 AM)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Symbiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4049416 - 04/13/05 09:19 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Mexicana in a two gallon pickle jar with grass.





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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Symbiosis Q [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #4049422 - 04/13/05 09:22 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

By the way, the above didn't work out too well. The grass itself got moldy by the end of the first flush.
RR


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4049518 - 04/13/05 10:20 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Abermelin said:
plants dont go into reverse mode, consume o2 and produce co2 at night. i dont know what F'd up biology class you took....




Apparently I also took the same F'ed up biology class as him and the rest of the world who took biology class. Plants always secrete co2, but during the day, they also release oxygen. At night, they dont (dont know if you didnt relize it or not, but the sun isnt out during the night and the sun is needed in photosynthesis).

I see this as not doing much good since its not just oxygen that mushrooms need (from what I've been told) and that makes perfect sense, since most of the air isnt oxygen. I also see this as being a contam problem. Thats just how I see it, proof would be a chamber that gets no fanning, just a plant in there...and a healthy solid flush from it showing no signs of excess co2. I could see it working, in a large enough setup, with the right kind of grass, but it would take something very creative which I havnt seen yet.

Search posts on this topic and change the date range from a month to at least 1 year, you'll find a number of posts on this topic and many many opinions on it..someone thinks of this once every week or so.


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"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


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Offlinekingboomer
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Re: Sybiosis Q *DELETED* [Re: scatmanrav]
    #4049543 - 04/13/05 10:32 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Post deleted by kingboomer

Reason for deletion: open a new post



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Hole in the sky/
take me to heaven..
window in time/
through it I'll fly...

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OfflineAbermelin
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: kingboomer]
    #4049590 - 04/13/05 10:51 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I dont care enough to argue with you people. ok, the plant will release a harmful cloud of Co2 and bacteria at my shrooms and all will fail. you happy?


Edited by Abermelin (04/13/05 11:06 AM)


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: Abermelin]
    #4049659 - 04/13/05 11:21 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Your so testy. All because people dont like your idea  :rolleyes: People get so damn defensive when they think they've come up with an idea. Then you go and tell them they're wrong (about plant production of co2 and oxygen)  when they try to flame people (I can provide you with numerous sources that says exactly what he and I said). Plants release co2...over all they produce more oxygen and absorb more co2 then they release, but they still dont release oxygen without light..FACT...and putting ANYTHING into your grow chamber, besides sterile containers holding colonized substrate is a CONTAM RISK...FACT...no matter how SLIGHT it is. Those two things, I see as problems that make this not really benificial. Not to mention how many people have talked of it, with a few trying it and not ONE success as of yet. This is just how I SEE IT, as I said. If you want to prove your hypothesis right, feel free, I didnt tell you it couldnt ever be done...maybe it can...I JUST SEE IT as being more difficult then its worth. Thats MY thoughts on it, as you asked for when you posted this question for all to give their views on it.

If you want to get into a huff because I said I dont like your idea thats your problem. I didnt ask for you to "argue" with me or "these people", YOU wanted to know what we though and WE told you. Get over yourself.


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay


Edited by scatmanrav (04/13/05 12:32 PM)


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OfflineMonkeyPod
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: scatmanrav]
    #4049769 - 04/13/05 12:20 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

You could also test your own hypothesis by building your own project. You asked for ideas and I gave you mine backed up by what I felt to be sound theory based in science. But it's just that...theory. RogerRabbit had a pretty good project there. Maybe just expound on his idea and try to reduce contams through your own theories. Perhaps He needed more holes in the jar stuffed with polyfill/ better O2 exchange. Try soaking the grass seed in H2O2 before germinating. Grow the grass in a seperate casing in a PMP with the shrooms. Raise the shooms in the PMP and lower the grass closer to where the polyfill vents or airstone are...who knows. The only way to fly in the face of convention is to go against the grain and succeed. Then you've created the new convention.
Good luck.


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Offlinethenewguy05
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Re: Sybiosis Q [Re: MonkeyPod]
    #4049926 - 04/13/05 01:08 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

If the plants release co2 in the off time would you have to switch to a 24hr. light cycle??? Also, would a periodical fanning(either morning or nightime) correct the problem??? I know we are trying to do a total no hasle deal but it has to be opened sometime to mist.


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Mushroom Cultivation

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