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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Asante]
    #4054512 - 04/14/05 08:45 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Randalflagg said:
I view racism as a deep hatred, revulsion, or stereotyping of a certain race.

I view prejudice as a natural wariness that anybody gets when interacting with people that are unlike themselves. My definition might not match the dictionary's definition, but it is how I view things.

Wiccan Seeker said:
Look, then we're having a battle of definitions, where I adhere to the textbook definition and you stray from that.




Maybe I do stray from the definition.  But, it is how I define things.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
I believe, and much that I have read reflects that, that most of that wariness is brought about by CULTURE, not NATURE.




If it is not natural, why does it exist in every society on earth?  Why has it always existed?  Culture does definitely influence opinions and attitudes, but I think it is natural to be wary of different things and people.  I think nature influences culture.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
Risk asessment is an individual matter. But western culture subconsciously teaches that race is a risk factor.




There are many facets to a ?culture?.  In America, there are many individual cultures that exist.  There are Asian communities in New York and San Francisco.  There is a large Arab community in Dearborn, Michigan.  There are big city folks, small town folks, and suburban dwellers.  There are multitudes of American movies and TV shows that say, ?Racism is terrible.  Can?t we all just get along??.  There are some parents that tell their kids that ?niggers are bad?.  There are some parents (the majority) that tell their kids that racism is bad.  There is no homogenous ?Western? or ?American? culture, which is what you seem to be insinuating.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
And my stance is that our western culture instills a state of unconscious racism (which you might call prejudice) in everyone living there by default.




You are missing my two main points:

#1.  Western culture has a lot of different ideas and opinions flying around in it.  Some are racist and some are very anti-racist.

#2.  Prejudice and racism exist everywhere in this world (not just in ?Western Culture?).  It has existed since the beginning of time.  When Hannibal was attacking the Roman empire, how do you think the Romans felt about the people of Carthage?  How do you think the Middle Eastern Arabs feel about the Jews or the U.S.?  Conflict is inevitable in this world.  Distrust, wariness, and even outright hatred is inevitable in this world.  Racism is a virulent form of despising another race.  Prejudice is a wariness of another group or race.  I don?t think prejudice is bad.  I think it is a natural reaction among humans that cannot and should not be stifled.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
Racism isn't a matter of GUILT, it is a matter of BEHAVIOR and THOUGHT.




It matters what those thoughts and behaviors are.  If you react a certain way because your instincts are telling you to, I think that is OK.  If you go out of your way to demonize and attack a certain race, then you are definitely a racist.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
If you are a bit more wary of Arabs than of white man if you are flying on an airplane then that is a RACIST FEAR.




I consider that a reasonable prejudicial fear.  I don?t consider it racism.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
You in fact are the victim of the RACISM the media put into you




The Media didn?t kill 3,000 people on 9/11.  The Media didn?t hack several American citizens heads off.  The Media doesn?t kill innocent civilians.  The media didn?t force eight times as many black males to go commit homicide when compared to white males. 

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
but your exposure to american society has caused you to experience racist fear when you are on a plane and three Arabs with beards are talking a bit in Arabic.




:lol:  You?re wrong.  My exposure to American society has nothing to do with the fact that I would be wary of Arabs on a plane with me.  It has to do with the fact that 19 Arabs murdered 3,000 of my fellow citizens by using several airplanes.

Quote:

Wiccan Seeker said:
If you are mortally afraid when you're in an elevator and three young black men walk in, more so than with three white young men, then you are the victim of your own RACIST fear. You are the racist, but you are the victim of it. If you take racist ACTION you are a racist too, but then you victimize others by racist action.




In that situation, I would zero in more on how the three individuals were acting than the color of their skin.  Were they acting all shady and eyeing me up?  I trust my instincts.  If my instincts tell me something then I listen.  If my instincts come across as a little racist, I really don?t give a shit.


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
Errorist
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Re: Racism in the US [Re: Asante]
    #4054583 - 04/14/05 09:03 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

1.Yes, there is racism in America.

2. No, it isn't any worse here than it is anywhere else. In fact it's better than most places.

3. Yes there is government institutionallized racism in America; overtly against whites, and covertly (mostly unconciously) against everybody else.

4. Hindu lookin motherfuckers can't make sandwiches. I don't know if it's genetic or not.

5. There is nothing preventing a Non-White person from being just as successfull as any white person in America. If you "act black" then that may or may not inhibit your ability to succede depending on (a) who you're dealing with, and (b) what your idea of "acting black" might be. If your idea of "acting white" is to dress and talk like a pirate, that could have an impact as well, yarrr. If you are black, or have long hair, or act effeminately, or are openly homosexual, or you like the Redsox and the judge knows it, and hates the Redsox for some reason, then chances are you may not recieve absolutely fair treatment in a courtroom.  I'm sure that only happens in America tho.

6. Anti-American predujice is approximately as justified in European countries as anti-French sentiment is in America. Except in America it is taken lightly, like a joke, whereas anti-American sentiment seems more rabid and mouth-frothy.

7. Your words seem to indicate that you see things that happened in Europe prior to the creation of America as things that "you" (or your people) have done and that the decendents of those people who moved to another country (European-Americans) should be somehow differently credited with the accomplishments of their ancestors than those who stayed in the same geographic region. This is an obvious case of geographicism. The government of your country should not allow this behavior to continue, and you should be jailed immediately. :yesnod:

8. America has been genocide free longer than France.

9. The most devestating form of racism in America as far as holding back minorities is the belief that the white man is holding then down. Nobody is holding them down but themselves. Most of the poor minorities (and whites) are poor because they don't understand that they don't have to be. They either aren't willing to do the work it takes to educate themselves, or the believe themselves to be incapable of learning.

10. There is a culture of loathing of knowledge in America. Being a good student can be stigmatic here. This taboo is magnified by the perception that "the system" wants to subjugate, controll and own you. This perception is held almost entorely by poor people. In the case of poor minorities, their feelings toward "the system" are influenced by their perception of it being a white system.

11. Racism does more damage from the inside than the outside in America.


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InvisibleSilversoul
Rhizome
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/02/05
Posts: 23,576
Loc: The Barricades
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #4054981 - 04/14/05 10:41 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

:thumbup:


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole

Registered: 02/12/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 6 years, 3 months
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4055239 - 04/14/05 11:58 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Very nice job. Everybody who lives outside America should give a great deal of credence to what BH wrote. I think it's right on the mark.

I think a lot of people confusedly believe that discrimination is inherently racist. I can discriminate the difference between an apple and an orange and I like oranges better. I can discriminate that if I'm at 154th and Lex and a bunch of young black gentlemen with boom boxes and 40s come down the street I might want to consider escape routes. Just in case. I'll be in the store. Likewise, I might, if I were black, insist that the real estate agent show me everything that's come on the market in her area and do it in writing. Just in case. I'll check with some others agents too.


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InvisibleGijith
Daisy Chain Eater

Registered: 12/05/03
Posts: 2,400
Loc: New York
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #4055503 - 04/15/05 01:01 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

:mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: :mushroom2: coming your way.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Silversoul]
    #4055753 - 04/15/05 01:57 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Paradigm said:
I was once out riding my bike when a bunch of young Mexican hoodlums started riding up near me. They then surrounded me and jumped me for my bike.





"Hey Holmes, gimme yo motherfuckin' bike!"


Edited by RandalFlagg (04/15/05 01:59 AM)


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: Racism in the US [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4056464 - 04/15/05 06:01 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

RandalFlagg said:
Quote:

Wiccan_Seeker said:
People who say that the cause of these percieved flaws are because of their race. And some people here are saying that.




Nobody said that. I don't know why American black people seem to statistically have more social problems than white people. It could be poverty (black people have less wealth than white people). It could be a lot of stuff. Sociologists have been trying to answer some of these questions for years.




Noone addresses why American Indians do so much better on standardized tests than blacks either. I'm sure it's because 50 years of slavery was oh so much harder than centuries of near-genocide.


--------------------


Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Racism in the US [Re: SoopaX]
    #4056484 - 04/15/05 06:05 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Be careful SoopX, truth is not sought, nor encouraged when it comes to discussing race. Everyone is equal and exactly the same to think or question otherwise is ignorant.


--------------------
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OfflineCatalysis
EtherealEngineer

Registered: 04/23/02
Posts: 1,742
Last seen: 14 years, 2 months
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #4056548 - 04/15/05 06:21 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

10. There is a culture of loathing of knowledge in America. Being a good student can be stigmatic here. This taboo is magnified by the perception that "the system" wants to subjugate, controll and own you. This perception is held almost entorely by poor people. In the case of poor minorities, their feelings toward "the system" are influenced by their perception of it being a white system.





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Invisibleniteowl
GrandPaw
Male User Gallery

Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc: Flag
Re: Racism in the US [Re: SoopaX]
    #4056822 - 04/15/05 07:27 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SoopaX said:
Noone addresses why American Indians do so much better on standardized tests





'cause standardized tests dont really prove anything. (IMO)
:shrug:


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Racism in the US [Re: Catalysis]
    #4065377 - 04/17/05 08:37 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)


Mini race riot breaks out on basketball court


Brooklyn Skyline

"A gang of up to 30 black teens attacked four white girls in Marine Park in what police are saying is not a bias crime... According to witnesses and parents of the victims, four young girls from St. Edmund's had the day off from school due to Easter recess. They were playing basketball during dismissal from nearby Marine Park Junior High School, when several Marine Park students demanded to use the court. After adults intervened and asked them to wait their turn, the teens left - but returned in a pack of up to 30, both boys and girls, and stormed into the park. Witnesses say the attackers were all black and called their victims 'white crackers' during the bloody melee, which raged for almost 20 minutes."


http://www.brooklynskyline.com/news_article.asp?c=ne&na=1486


Yeah......white racism towards black people is such a big problem in America isn't it? What about black racism towards white people? If the roles were reversed in this situation(white gangs attacking a small group of black kids) the outrage would have been nationwide. Jesse Jackson would be preening in front of cameras bellowing about the "undercurrent and legacy of white racism in this country", the FBI would have opened a very public "hate crimes" investigation, and black community leaders would be "outraged".

It's political correctness run amok...

All of those rampaging kids should be prosecuted. People should start acknowledging blatant black racism towards white people. Why the double standard when dealing with racism? Why is black racism downplayed and accepted while white racism is vilified and trumpeted?


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Racism in the US [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4065432 - 04/17/05 09:06 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I wish I was one of the white people on that court. I guarantee I would have 30 black scalps hanging on my belt right now.


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Offlinepleco
Astralnaut

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 203
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
Re: Racism in the US [Re: looner2]
    #4065632 - 04/17/05 10:30 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
I wish I was one of the white people on that court. I guarantee I would have 30 black scalps hanging on my belt right now.




Now that's just the wrong reason to become a black belt... and as much as we'd love to imagine you trying to scalp 30 boys and girls, who cares?

The questions here are more along the lines of why didn't the kids wait their turn, who were the adults who told them to do so and how did the NYPD determine that this wasn't a hate crime?

More questions than answers in that article...


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Racism in the US [Re: pleco]
    #4065665 - 04/17/05 10:41 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

The questions here are more along the lines of why didn't the kids wait their turn

What kind of question is that!?? I can understand if it was kindergarden class and kids were butting in line for the monkey bars.

but....

A group of black kids formed a large mob and attacked, kicked, and stomped white kids in a park like a savage war party while yelling racial obscenities!!

No one cares if it should be a HATE CRIME. Who gives a shit?

This is a prime example of black children being brainwashed by their deadbeat parents. No child understands racial issues at a young age, and to intiate violence on top of it tells me society or parents are teaching these kids some pretty shitty values.


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: Racism in the US [Re: looner2]
    #4065817 - 04/18/05 12:25 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
Be careful SoopX, truth is not sought, nor encouraged when it comes to discussing race. Everyone is equal and exactly the same to think or question otherwise is ignorant.




Forgive me! I hope that the thought police don't kick my door in.
"everyone is biophysically the same" Ten thousand times a day on MTV for 14 years, then it's a truth, right?


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleSoopaX
Criminal DrugAnalyst

Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 1,690
Re: Racism in the US [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4065825 - 04/18/05 12:28 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I've said it before and Ill say it again. Whites and blacks don't live together well. I think that n*gger males that attack/rape white women should be tortured to death. Maybe just toss them out in Alabama in the middle of a KKK rally. Those guys knew how to keep some knee-grows under control.


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: Racism in the US [Re: SoopaX]
    #4066087 - 04/18/05 02:28 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SoopaX said:
Maybe just toss them out in Alabama in the middle of a KKK rally.  Those guys knew how to keep some knee-grows under control.




Just because some darkies get a little out of control is no reason to advocate KKK solutions.  :lol:  Just kidding.

But seriously, I suggest that you calm down your more racist tendencies.  It detracts from your posts (which are sometimes pretty good).


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Offlinepleco
Astralnaut

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 203
Last seen: 15 years, 2 months
Re: Racism in the US [Re: looner2]
    #4066153 - 04/18/05 02:54 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

looner2 said:
No one cares if it should be a HATE CRIME. Who gives a shit?





Isn't that what RandalFlagg was getting at? I'm sure a lot of people care... the kids are lucky it's not or they'd be in deep shit. They care. The white kids probably care, because those kids who got arrested aren't going to jail. They're going back to school on Monday.

But anyway, I don't really understand what you're rambling about... are you just trying to make it clear that you don't like blacks and would like to scalp their kids? If so there are a bunch of people out there who would love to have you in their company... check out www.nazi.org. if that's not your type of crowd, www.stormfront.org has about 50,000 citizens who'd love share all of their problems with minorities in America, with you. Then you can have even more... issues... to deal with.  :thumbup:


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
Errorist
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Re: Racism in the US [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4066219 - 04/18/05 03:18 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Any chronically violent child should be put to death regardles of race. This includes anyone in a gang.


The end.


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Invisiblelooner2
ABBA fan

Registered: 06/21/04
Posts: 3,849
Re: Racism in the US [Re: pleco]
    #4066469 - 04/18/05 04:58 AM (17 years, 5 months ago)

But anyway, I don't really understand what you're rambling about... are you just trying to make it clear that you don't like blacks and would like to scalp their kids? If so there are a bunch of people out there who would love to have you in their company... check out www.nazi.org. if that's not your type of crowd, www.stormfront.org has about 50,000 citizens who'd love share all of their problems with minorities in America, with you. Then you can have even more... issues... to deal with.

*yawn*

What part of discussing race relations, in a thread, aptly titled "Racism in the U.S", is called "rambling"?

Very predictable with the nazi and stomfront crap... don't say anything negative about the blacks and support them when they go on war parties through our parks, and your a good, kind-hearted liberal.

You remind me of an hermaphrodite friend of mine who lived in this giant tree out in california. He loved that tree dearly and wouldn't come down when the loggers needed to gather wood. His name was "whisper".


--------------------
I am in love with Acidic_Sloth



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